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what a fugly car
http://www.tsn.ca/auto_racing/story/...ry_auto_racing
http://images.tsn.ca/Story/Image.asp...430&height=300Quote:
BMW-Sauber gave everyone a sneak peek into what Formula One cars may look on the track next season as the first winter test began in Spain on Monday.
http://i33.tinypic.com/10n7sqf.jpg
oh my god i jus peuked! looks like a snowplough
ugly and useless,
it is amazing how F1 has managed to reverse course evelotion wise.
it is like looking at a 70's aero package
I am really saddened by this course of action that F1 is taking
they are loosing the presitige and unique status of the elite racing series to satisfy the deranged whims of MM and his cronies on the FIA.
by the time they are finsihed, we would have a GP2 like series on hand with one engine, one chasis and zero innovation.
shameful, just shameful what has happened to the sport i grew up with and loved.
it looks like something I could build with $100k not like something that time. effort, and innovation has gone into.
just a reminder of what we are going to miss
http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/wp-conten..._frontwing.jpg
http://www.f1-fansite.com/wallpaper/...na-01-1440.jpg
these look like the pinnacle of motorsports
the 2009 car looks like a kit car.
I have to say I like it. It will take some getting used to, but together all the weird-looking elements just fit.
What's your gripe? Sometimes you have to take a step back to take two steps forward.Quote:
Originally Posted by truefan72
Sure, the rear wing looks ugly, but everything else is razor sharp. The massive front wing, slick tires, and clean body makes for an impressive profile. Remember that aesthetics are not the purpose for 2009's newly revamped cars, it is racing!
looks like a formula bmw car
there is taking a step back and there is simply dailing back the time machine on aerodynamic evolution in order to purportedly bring abouty more racing.Quote:
Originally Posted by gloomyDAY
IMO there was plenty of racing in 2008 and the likely impact of these cars on 2009 racing is going to be nominal; as many preidct.
So what we have left is a Formula BMW looking car, simplistic along with exagerrated wings that leave the car completley unworthy of being a piece of f1 machinery. All in the name of improved racing.
I would really like someone to explain to me how F1 can improve the racing form 2008.
do cars catch up and pass others on the straight - yes
do cars over take others on slow corners - yes
do cars outbreak others and overtake - yes
do we see close fights of cars challenging each other - yes
do we see different cars winning races - yes
do we see the likes of Honda/Force India ahead of supposedly faster cars -yes ( and sutil was going to finshi 4th in Monaco before...)
do we see extreme parity in times amongs the all the cars - yes
did we see dramatic races and great finishes - yes
do we see overtaking in the mid pack -yes constantly ( it just so happens that the cameras are not focusing on these battles that often. I dare say if you watched an entire race only of cars from p7-p15 you would have an completly different view of F1 racing)
so I am not sure exactly what more folks want out of the series.
Perhaps you could explain what more you would like to see (I am not being sarcastic here but an earnest inquest)
there is taking a step back and there is simply dailing back the time machine on aerodynamic evolution in order to purportedly bring about more racing.Quote:
Originally Posted by gloomyDAY
IMO there was plenty of racing in 2008 and the likely impact of these cars on 2009 racing is going to be nominal, as many preidct.
So what we have left is a Formula BMW looking car, simplistic along with exagerrated wings that leave the car completley unworthy of being a piece of f1 machinery. All in the name of improved racing.
I would really like someone to explain to me how F1 can improve the racing form 2008.
do cars catch up and pass others on the straight - yes
do cars over take others on slow corners - yes
do cars outbreak others and overtake - yes
do we see close fights of cars challenging each other - yes
do we see different cars winning races - yes
do we see the likes of Honda/Force India ahead of supposedly faster cars -yes ( and sutil was going to finshi 4th in Monaco before...)
do we see extreme parity in times amongs the all the cars - yes
did we see dramatic races and great finishes - yes
do we see overtaking in the mid pack -yes constantly ( it just so happens that the cameras are not focusing on these battles that often. I dare say if you watched an entire race only of cars from p7-p15 you would have an completly different view of F1 racing)
so I am not sure exactly what more folks want out of the series.
Perhaps you could explain what more you would like to see (I am not being sarcastic here but an earnest inquest)
Not really.Quote:
Originally Posted by truefan72
The 2003 - 2008 cars looked more an more like a Christmas tree with areo bits instead of candys.
The 2009 car:
http://i33.tinypic.com/10n7sqf.jpg
Looks better IMO.
You'll see, it's just a matter of taste. And those of us who followed F1 pre 2000 are used to see beautiful cars with simple and flowing lines!
What an abomination! Absolutely hideous and will take some getting used to.
If the racing is going to be awesome then all will be forgiven....
well, some but not all! :D
Looks like a cross between an Formula BMW car, the 2004 Williams and the '2000 Ferrari with better sidepods. Plus the wing off of a 1991 car lol. Looks strange.
I'm not going to say I don't like it but it's a dramatic difference.
http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/wp-conten...mpcar_2006.jpgQuote:
Originally Posted by gloomyDAY
Champ Car (with slicks, hardly any aero, and massive wings). If you can keep a straight face and tell me that car looks better than this one... :rolleyes:
I can understand your argument about looks not being everything...you're right it is about the racing at the end of the day. However, these might not be the implementations to make it happen. There have been seasons in the past before all the aero pieces where teams dominated (i.e. 1988, 1992, 1996 & 1997, 2002...). I'm just suprised that people think this is going to make it better when 2008 wasn't that bad to begin with. This is not Oval racing where everyone is going to have a chance to win. O, and just to clarify, 2009 is all about costs and money, nothing to do with racing; if it was about racing then we wouldn't have lost Canada under the circumstances we did.
i just don't like the front wing being that wide, other than that, i can get used to the rear wing and definitely prefer the disappearance of all those winglets.
she looks beautiful - I can't wait - rake that gay crap off them and go racing!!
I was never a big fan of all the aero stick-on bits and pieces. They may have been the result of impressive, and expensive, work done in the windtunnel but they just illustrated the point that aero dominated above all else, and damaged the racing in the process.Quote:
Originally Posted by truefan72
Years ago Gilles Villeneuve said:Almost 30yrs on and we're still losing out. They still haven't got the cars right IMHO. The 2009 version not only looks ugly but the FIA's own technical consultant Tony Purnell has saidQuote:
"I love motor racing. To me it's a sport, not a technical exercise. My ideal Formula One car would be something like a McLaren M23 with a big normally aspirated engine, 800 hp, 21 inch rear tyres. A lot of people say we should have narrower tires, but I don't agree
because you need big tyres to slow you down when you spin. And you need a lot of horsepower to unstick big tyres, to make the cars slide. That would be a bloody fantastic spectacle, I can tell you. We would take corners one gear lower than we do now, and get the cars sideways. You know, people still rave about Ronnie Peterson in a Lotus 72, and I understand that. I agree with them. That's the kind of entertainment I want to give the crowds. Smoke the tyres ! Yeah !
I [care about the fans], because I used to be one of them ! I believe the crowd is really losing out at the moment, and that's bad."
:dozey:Quote:
"I expect the 2009 car will have quite a lot of downforce – perhaps 70 or 80 per cent of last year’s level – and I suspect that may mean the aero rules do little for racing...aerodynamics is probably the worst thing you can have when it comes to close racing.”
I like it. The back looks a little strange but it's OK without all the silly bits coming off it
this is not 2009. is a 2008 car fitted with some 2009 wings. the new cars will look better
Just take a closer look to the nose section (see how wide and high it is compared to the 2008 car?) and you'll see that this is not the 2008 car.Quote:
Originally Posted by goodf1fun
gievn a clean piece of paper, whats to say that all the teams will tuen up looking like the BMW - sure there will be some common elements, but others may take a slightly different approach and for me that is exciting. the car may look a little simple in its current interim form, but you can bet it will be cleaned up prior to the start of the next season.
i do think the new cars will take a bot of getting used to, but the innovation is still there, the constrained rules just mean they will have to work for it elsewhere and maximise different parts
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/72176Quote:
"To me, for the moment, it's the worst (looking) Formula One car I have ever seen. It just doesn't fit together. But we will get used to it. There will be a lot of modifications until the first race in March."
Brundle once commented that an F1 should look like it is travelling at 100MPH when it is standing still....
....this pile of s### looks like its made out of lego!!
Well it's a test hack really isn't it? A 2008 car with some new aero parts (including a new nose) stuck to it for the purposes of testing.Quote:
Originally Posted by ioan
It's not a showcase of the F109 by any means.
is NOT 2009 car. compare the rest of the car and u will see the 2008 bmw.
The new cars will be wider. The nose from the point that you can remove it, looks identical to 2008
I didn't say that it is the 2009 car!
But is it a 2008 car or not?!
I say it is different enough from the 2008 car to be called at least an intermediary car but not the 2008 car.
Sure it has the same carbon tub, but the nose isn't the same, the whole aero package is different and the tires are different too, heck even the engine isn't the same anymore cause the new ones will have to last 50% more, plus there is KERS installed on it and running, so not even the transmission is the same anymore!
So 75% of the car isn't the same anymore.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ioan
are u working in bmw?
Are u working in Skoda?Quote:
Originally Posted by goodf1fun
pretty much sums it upQuote:
Originally Posted by ArrowsFA1
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel
no i am working in VW (real)
I dont mind it but it looks surprisingly like Gould Hill Climb car. A thinner nose would improve the looks massively.Quote:
Originally Posted by thunderbolt
It's interesting to read a couple of the comments from the Barcelona test:
Robert Kubica: "Of course we lose a lot of downforce compared to the 2008 car. But because we are back from grooved to slick tyres, we have substantially more grip in slow corners. So with some more development I don't think there will be too big a difference between the 2009 and 2008 cars."
Marc Gene: "We got rid of as many things as possible, to try to create the downforce we'll have the next season. But the main thing is the slicks. I couldn't directly compare them, but the first feeling is that the grip delivered by the new tyres compensates the lower downforce."
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/72177
The more things change, the more they stay the same :p
But they aren't the same.Quote:
Originally Posted by ArrowsFA1
Aerodynamic grip is easily lost when in turbulent air, whereas mechanical grip from the tyres & chassis is not affected whatsoever.
In theory therefore, it should be a whole lot easier to get closer to the car in front and precipitate that most rare of natural occurences - a genuine overtake.
However, don't underestimate the genius of aerodynamicists. They are cunning swines whose mantra is "What the good lord taketh away, the wind-tunnel giveth back eventually"
The difference will be that mechanical grip coming from the tyres wont be gone as soon as you get close to the car in front in a turnQuote:
Originally Posted by ArrowsFA1
I was simply referring to Kubica's comment that "I don't think there will be too big a difference between the 2009 and 2008 cars". That despite major changes to the regs.Quote:
Originally Posted by tamburello
Hopefully the increased mechanical grip will improve the racing, but much of what I've read about the prospects for the new cars confirms your aerodynamicists mantra that much of the lost aero grip will be recovered.
I read Kubica's comments as referring to the respective pace of the cars, not the way they will perform to get that pace.Quote:
Originally Posted by ArrowsFA1
Gene's comments seem to endorse that.
That said, give those aero buggers enough time & soon enough you'll be bemoaning the loss of all the winglets, chimneys and horns that gave us such a competitive field!
I doubt that very much, in anything other than a slow corner, were they have no trouble following closely anyway, aerodynamic grip is the determining factor, not mechanical. It might be that they can follow closely through mid to fast corners now or they might not, we wont know until they start racing, but I doubt the mechanical grip will be the defigning factor.Quote:
Originally Posted by tamburello
Aerodynamics will always play a part, but these regulations would appear to have moved the emphasis towards mechanical grip. With that shift in emphasis, the turbulent air from a car is not such a defining factor.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sleeper
For now.
i see chris bangle has moved across to the F1 team...
Even IRL crap wagon looks pretty now !
I dont agree with the new rules, F1 should be an enginering sport too ! Overtaking, yes of course, but i still think this is the wrong way to go, i would rather see a push to pass button, and and tourbo engine to boots overtaking, than this, a crying same, and a bad move by F1 !
Big wings and silly winglets are the things which have made F1 somewhat of a snorefest for the last few years. This year was exciting in some ways but it wasn't the cars that provided the excitement.Quote:
Originally Posted by Claus Hansen