Marco's pass on Kanaan

I'd like to hear from everyone else, but I found nothing wrong with Marco Andretti's pass on teammate Tony Kanaan, which led to Kanaan hitting the wall from the marbles. Admittedly Marco was coming into that corner pretty hard, but that's what he's supposed to be doing. The pass was clean and Marco went as low as he could. Kanaan was clearly not going as fast as Marco and it might have been dangerous had Marco slowed or hit the brakes, perhaps causing a pile up since there were many other cars in that group with them. Maybe Kanaan was surprised Marco was there, but that shouldn't have mattered who it was, someone was going to make that pass. Kanaan has been at Indy long enough to expect the unexpected. And while I can understand his disappointment, he shouldn't be crying that much, IMHO. Marco is there to win every bit as much as Kanaan is, and hey, either lead, follow, or get out of the way.

TK isn't normally one to whine, so there must have been some validity is his taking exeception with Marco's move.

Gary

There is a time and place for banzai moves. That wasn't it. They were working through a lot of traffic, and while that may present an opportunity to make a pass, forcing another driver off line is never a smart move, especially if it is your teammate. I am sure the opening was enticing, and Marco took it. Last year a statement was made by someone at AGR (no link) that Marco's driving style was mainly see driver, pass driver. But sometimes you have to see driver, analyze consequences, then pass driver if you can - safely. He did more than ruin Tony's race, the spin wiped out Fisher and perhaps her dream of being an owner driver.

Starter makes the point that it is the overtaking drivers responsibility to avoid contact. The other part of that is that they should never place the overtaken driver at risk by forcing them to take avoiding action or by moving them well off line. You can take their line away, but you have to give them an out. Marco didn't.

if it was the last 10 laps of the race, then the rules change. Tony probably would have shut the door.

It's a shame for Tony, but one could argue that he did not make as good a job of getting through the traffic as Dixon, knew he was slowing and should have expected Marco on the inside. It was just one of those things that happens at Indy. From Marco's point of view he had a really good run on the car ahead of him, so why should he lift? It the other car had been a non team mate would it have been a big deal? As is often the case there are so many ifs and buts after the event. I feel more for Fisher than I do for Kannan - a really tough break after driving a good race and keeping out of trouble.

Having watched all the drivers and owners walk down Gasoline Alley prior to the race Marco was the only one really who did not smile, looked down and was not fan friendly. Not that has anything to do with his driving. Seems he has more of his dad rather than his grandad in him. TK is a team player and has nurtured Marco especially last year when Marco had a very strained relationship with his Dad so for him to say what he did about Marco makes you think TK is correct. However he brought it home whereas Graham Rahal did not. Shades of Marco on the ovals from last year.

TK was mad because the pass was late going into the turn, he went high and got in the grey and lost it. unfortunantly, Sarah had no where to go and wrecked him.

there was plenty of give and take in the first 150 laps and Marco was all take although he did have one heck of a run

TK won't be with AGR next season...you heard it here first

clearly the most talented mature racer on the team and is playing third, arguably fourth fiddle to the other drivers

I suspect we will see him at Penske

My guess is that TK feels this year it's time for him to really cement himself again with strong finishes (like Indy and/or Championship) to solidify sponsorship and team for the next several years. What Marco did would have been questionable, but at worst just hard racing if it wasn't to a teammate. But to make that move on TK was irresponsible. And I do feel particularly bad for Fisher who probably would have had a solid top 15-20 finish. Is her team really in such bad shape though that an 20th place finish is a guaranteed Kentucky run and a 30th place is not? Both Marco and Briscoe's "mistakes" were a result of the slick racing and lack of passing. They had to make the passes in the pits or in whatever extreme situation possible on the track. Marco is still desperate for his Indy win, and clearly will put teammates at risk to do it.

Also i would agree that this move was very similar to what happened last year at Sonoma.

I still don't see it. Marco did, in my view, exactly what Starter said he should do, which was go low and avoid contact. Kanaan was clearly going slower than Marco, so it could be argued that he (at that point) may have been holding Marco and the others up, and Marco made the pass not only to get by, but also avoid a risky cluster of traffic. I do feel very bad for Sarah Fisher who did a great job all day and was just in the wrong place at the wrong time.

Backing off would've been impossible at that point, I think. It's easy to be a Monday morning quarterback. Making a split-second decision is different. Teammates should be allowed to race, and Marco raced. That's racin'. Kanaan got into the marbles long after Marco was gone.

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Originally Posted by Yankee Racer

Backing off would've been impossible at that point, I think. It's easy to be a Monday morning quarterback. Making a split-second decision is different. Teammates should be allowed to race, and Marco raced. That's racin'. Kanaan got into the marbles long after Marco was gone.

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While we will never know TK's true reaction to Marco being on the inside of him. Was he surprised? Was he shocked? Was he trying to stay away so they both wouldn't crash?

We do know that Marco being there did force him to change his line.
However, there were many other passes made just prior to going into the corner were the high side car made it through.

IMHO, because he was not expecting Marco to be there, he turned in too late and was never able to get low enough to make it through the corner.

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Originally Posted by Yankee Racer

Backing off would've been impossible at that point, I think. It's easy to be a Monday morning quarterback. Making a split-second decision is different. Teammates should be allowed to race, and Marco raced. That's racin'. Kanaan got into the marbles long after Marco was gone.

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Do you have ANY clue as to where the marbles begin or what line will carry you into the marbles regardless of how much you attempt to turn in?

Gary

The bottom line is Marco had every right to pass Kanaan. He was down low enough so Kanaan could take his normal line into the turn. Just look at the replays.
According to Dixon Kanaan made his first mistake when he lifted in turn one that gave Dixon the oportunity to overtake Kanaan on the out side and Marco to the inside.

In three I500 Marco has a second and a third and Kanaan a hand full of DNF's.

Let the boys race. 10 years ago this situation would have been forgotten as soon as it happened.

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Originally Posted by garyshell

Do you have ANY clue as to where the marbles begin or what line will carry you into the marbles regardless of how much you attempt to turn in?

Gary

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Why is it that I don't remember so many marbles in years past at Indy? Tony, and others, were obviously still trying to steer away from the wall. So sad to see so much of the track to be just an illusion. Might just as well fill it in with sand - at least that would save the cars and avoid down track secondary accidents. Yep, sand and a crane and let the racing continue.

Softer tire compounds cause a higher level of marbles, doesn't it? The grip on today's Firestone tires is much more than what they were some years ago. This grip is allowing the drivers to "cheat" a bit and make bolder moves. The hard compounds of years ago didn't make as much marbles, and you therefore had a wider expanse of track to use. Of course the speeds weren't as high. I gotta think that when the cars were running 215 back in the day, taking corners wasn't nearly the white knuckle risk it is now, and it probably made for more passing, like the move Emerson Fittipaldi made on Al Unser back in some years back to win the race. You could make a move like that safely and stay within the limits of the car. But now since the horsepower has gone up, and the tires have more grip, it is actually even more risky to make those moves.

Look at what is going on in NASCAR right now, and the harder compound Goodyear tires they are running. the drivers have been spoiled by the grip they used to have, but the car of tommorrow has had an impact on the tires used, and not many like it. Tony Stewart had a temper tantrum recently about them every time someone put a microphone to him, and Goodyear had to put out a statement about it. But I have to believe the the old school drivers are laughing at Stewart and the other drivers; back in Richard Petty's day, if the tires were hard and lacked the grip of today, you learned how to drive with that and not whine about it. If you learned how to drive with those tires better than the next guy, that's what you were supposed to do. It was what made you a better race driver.

To me, Marco drove with what the car gave him, and made a bold but pure racing move. If the tires didn't shed so much, Kanaan could have made the turn and been able to stay in the hunt.

Aside: Isn't nice to talk about the racing, and not the politics?

Tyres are too soft. If you want less marbles and lower cornering speeds without giving them less power, give them harder tyres. Also opens up more lines.

I think Marco made a mistake. But he's young and careless, so he's supposed to make these mistakes.

I agree that the tires should be harder.

I don't think Tony Stewart's complaints were about a lack of grip from the tires, but just a general history of poor quality tires over the last few years.

exactly my observation too regading the possible racing lines. Overtaking was not the easiest and blocking (or almost blocking) could be seen often.
I also say something needs to be done to give at least a second decent line through curves.
There could have been more action into the corners.