To be fair it was as a teammate to Loeb at Citroen, an aberration to the WRC that caused plenty of knock-on effects.
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To be fair it was as a teammate to Loeb at Citroen, an aberration to the WRC that caused plenty of knock-on effects.
Also fun fact, in a way Sordo was the perfect team mate to Loeb, he was consistent enough to bring points but not fast enough to really challenge him. But crucially he was fast enough especially on tarmac to slot between Loeb and his rivals, Gronholm and later Hirvonen. In this era the title contenders often finished 1-2 and the points were 10-8-6-5-4-3-2-1 so if you had just one more position between then the margin was double. Of course this is all hypothetical but you could say Loeb owes Sordo some beers for the following titles:
2006 - title victory margin is 1 point - Sordo finished in P2 behind Loeb but ahead of Gronholm in Spain and Germany - difference of 4p in Loebs favour compared to if Sordo was not there
2007 - title victory margin is 4 points - Sordo finished in P2 splitting them in Monte and Spain plus he finished P3 ahead of Gronholm in P4 in Portugal so that's one more point for a total of 5
2009 - title victory margin is 1 point - Sordo finished P2 in Monte and Spain splitting Loeb and Hirvonen giving Loeb 4p in total
So teoretically if Loeb had some worse team-mate we would have Loeb 6x WDC, Gronholm 4x WDC and Hirvonen 1x WDC.
Now interestingly the reverse combinations (Gronholm-Hirvonen and Hirvonen-Latavala) were less effective:
2007 - Hirvonen took 2 points away from Gronholm by winning Norway when Loeb retired, but the did slot between them once in Finland so total is 0 - you could argue it was too soon for tactics as Norway was round 3
2009 - Latvala never slotted between the title contenders but was allowed to win Italy ahead of Hirvonen even after it was already clear he had no chance at the title - to be fair Hirvonen had not yet won a rally that season but then went on to win 4 in succession
So yeah, this is all hindsight and there are mitigating circumstances, for example in 2009 Wilson let Latvala take the win because he was coming off a bad streak and wanted to boost his morale. Team tactics are hard decisions to take but maybe sometimes you need to be ruthless if you really want the trophy. So let's say MSport declares Gronholm the team leader in 2007 and the switch them already at round 3, and they buy Latvala a beer in Italy 2009 but make him give up the win we have Loeb 7x WDC, Gronholm 3x WDC and Hirvonen 1x WDC.
Now this topic often comes up in the silly season, about having a team-mate to help for the title. I actually went back almost 30 years and I saw no more examples of anyone actually making the difference to decide the title. There are some cases where they helped but in the end it didn't matter. There are a lot of cases like the counter examples above, where team-mates took points away from each other. So it seems the team mate matters very little, maybe in like 10% of cases, the rest it's more important to be good and have a good team and car.
So after I did all this investigating I actually think Sordo is maybe under-rated, by some at least. I'm happy for him that he got 3 wins and not all on tarmac. What do you think?
He was asked not to challenge him...Quote:
Originally Posted by seb_sh
I only know Sordo from 2016 onwards. FWIW... in my time, the most important thing about Sordo was that he was prepared to be a support driver.
I remember when Adamo hired Breen for Wales, specifically with the brief of driving safely and being sure to finish, in case one of the top Hyundai drivers went out. It was public, Adamo said it, and Breen said it, that was his job. Breen did the job for three or four stages then started talking about competing for the win and rolled the car.
Sordo was the opposite of that. And he was quick enough to come 5th or 6th (in a world with VW) whilst driving within himself and finishing reliably.
I suppose there were team orders on tarmac but on gravel he was usually behind, so for the championship in that era he couldn't really challenge him. So in that way for the championship it makes sense what they did.Quote:
Originally Posted by PLuto
Happy 50th birthday Maestro Loeb!
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GHR2i0vW...jpg&name=small
you really believe that Sordo he could beat him?Quote:
Originally Posted by PLuto
I have never told it...Quote:
Originally Posted by dimviii
on some occasions, yes. he could have had a few more wins than he has now.Quote:
Originally Posted by dimviii
But sordo was smart enough to not do that, and that's how he managed to stay in the wrc for 18 years.
The only instances I could find in which Citroen could have asked Sordo not to challenge Loeb are Catalunya 2007 and Catalunya 2009. Maybe New Zealand 2008, but was a particular case, as Hirvonen and Latvala threw the rally away at the penultimate stage while they were 1st and 2nd.
I think he was sometimes close on tarmac and that would create some pressure, except both would know that they will hold position. Anyway overall he was under control and never a danger to Loeb in the championship.Quote:
Originally Posted by focus206
The times Sordo was close on tarmac are the ones I wrote, all the other times he was behind Loeb, Sordo was 30+ seconds back pretty soon.Quote:
Originally Posted by seb_sh
Another time they were close was Ireland 2007, but then Sordo made a mistake and dropped back. Maybe someone can provide other examples, if they exist.
This is just incredible.... and Im NOT a F1 fan.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zq72S36dJqw
Crazy to think that THESE GUYS are WRC promoters........................... but........ eh......... why bother doing cool stuff with their own series
long time reader. decided to create an account to comment too.
just wanted to share this weird thing i do. im not into f1 anymore since drs.
but i love watching the qualifying. i almost see it as a rallying event to be honest.
try that if you are also not into f1. the qualys are really fun to watch. like rally sprint.
I do wonder just how much influence Red Bull actually has within WRC Promoter......Quote:
Originally Posted by fiscorpun
Whatīs the upside of having 3-cyl engine in Rally2 car?
25% saving on spark plugs.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rallyper
If your Pistons start flying out the block you'll also only have to buy three instead of four.Quote:
Originally Posted by WRCStan
On a more serious note, a reduction in friction for sure and I guess depending on the base engines available by the OEM potentially a more suitable bore/stroke ratio for the restrictor size in Rally2.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rallyper
Today Kai Tarkiainen released the itinerary for Secto Rally Finland. "Best ever" route he says. I tend to agree fully. I will let any of you Finnish guys to start Rally Finland thread, but here is (I hope) correct link:
https://sectorallyfinland.fi/en/itinerary/
Best ever route...
SUPERHYPER Sunday with total of 41km
and 8km powerstage.. :(
Maybe part of the new concept. I donīt know. Sunday always depends on where you are in standings...
Laajavuori will be crowded...
what are the biggest/best (?) rally sprint championships right now? do any of those have some decent coverage? (like new zealand rally champ or the irish champ)
This looks great https://x.com/ewrcresults/status/176...C1kV5QC61vX5Xg
Now this I would love to see as Toyota's livery next year...0 percent of it happening I know but we can keep on dreaming.Quote:
Originally Posted by EstWRC
Looks great and is great news for the BRC !Quote:
Originally Posted by EstWRC
The fantastic livery is thanks to MEM and their ongoing connection with Castrol.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GBYU6pvX...pg&name=medium
Nice to see the inspiration there too...
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GI8v7BsW...jpg&name=large
Livery by Keane Design:
https://www.instagram.com/p/C4p8yJWM...dleWw0Zmlhag==
.
Yesterday sadly saw the passing of 2 names from rallying's past with both Kenjiro Shinosuka and Joaquim Santos leaving this life RIP both
Rest in peace Kenjiro Shinozuka! :(
https://www.motorsport.com/wrc/news/...d-75/10588643/
https://cdn-1.motorsport.com/images/...tti-kuuka.webp
WRC for the UK after all ? ;)
https://www.topgear.com/car-news/sat...rc-rally-stage
Some tragic news unfortunately on a local Hungarian rally: https://dirtfish.com/rally/four-dead...ngarian-rally/
a sega rally game tribute! just stop everything you are doing and watch. cant wait to put my hands on that.
https://youtu.be/2XryAiKvO-o?feature=shared
you might also like these 2 retro inspired rally games:
https://store.steampowered.com/app/1...er_Jump_Rally/
https://store.steampowered.com/app/2..._School_Rally/
and of course art of rally:
https://store.steampowered.com/app/550320/art_of_rally/
*o*Quote:
Originally Posted by seb_sh
!!!!!!!!
40 years of Prodrive!
1984 - Porsche 911:
https://www.facebook.com/prodriveoff...3Hq6vNvo74ctsl
1986 - MG Metro 6R4
https://www.facebook.com/prodriveoff...D9SBSRkAxjeJul
1987 - BMW M3
https://www.facebook.com/prodriveoff...Lu7aRsT9hLPmvl
Those were the days! :)
I wonder which rally1 driver lost their license in Sweden....
You mean drivers license, not rally license?Quote:
Originally Posted by SubaruNorway
Yes, but unlike Petter was able to finish the rally within the 48 hours you still have to driveQuote:
Originally Posted by Rallyper
Liberty Media is acquiring MotoGP for 4,5 billion USD
i thought there were some european laws impeding that from happening. weird. liberty did a really good job with f1, cannot deny that. the racing in f1 is shitty because of fia tho. motogp has the best road racing on the planet. liberty will have the greatest product ever on their hands.Quote:
Originally Posted by Franky
WSBK would like a word with youQuote:
Originally Posted by saco0o