What a terrible situation, but I guess they are still there.
Hope they can find a way of getting someone better for 2022.
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What a terrible situation, but I guess they are still there.
Hope they can find a way of getting someone better for 2022.
Well money first this politic what m-sport have to do now to survive for the future
You think........let's see!Quote:
Originally Posted by EstWRC
Suninen also changing co-driver, probably for a cheaper alternative.
This is probably the best compromise in a really difficult financial situation.
Greensmith is bringing important money and I believe can improve his speed with more experience.
I'm really glad that Suninen can still have a role and hopefully it can be increased later.
Fourmaux is a fine prospect and it will be interesting to see him adapting to the Rally1 car.
This year was a write-off anyway, better concentrate money on 2022 development.Quote:
Originally Posted by T16
The only big issue I have with this lineup is who will develop 2022 car? (sure you don't need top-speed drivers for development, but usually experience helps) Neither of these 3 ever drove anything than Fiesta.
Other points:
- much better idea for Fourmaux to drive full WRC2 than learning in WRC at this point
- the "free" car when Suninen does not have funds obviously aims at "highest bidder" from the likes of Mikkelsen or Lappi for a few starts, but those will imo also wait for signs that Fiesta is somehow competitive still this year or for "promises" for 2022
I thought Fourmaux is going to do both full WRC2 season and also some WRC startsQuote:
Originally Posted by mknight
Also remember that M-Sport must have two WRC cars at every WRC event if they want to compete in the manufacturer championship (not for the sake of competing, but for exposure)
Gus leading the team, eh?
well its better than nothing, at one point i was really worried about m-sport. im really happy that Suninen gets at least some drives, i wish Lappi would have shared the car with Gus.
really interested to see Formaux in the rally1 machine.
The 2022 cars are called Rally1, the top class is WRC until that ;)
disagreement, you need to have top-speed driver for development. From where you'll get the necessary feedback?Quote:
Originally Posted by mknight
Only at the end of the development would you need a top driver to get the last few percent from the car. A lot of guys can be trusted to do the basic work and testing mileage.Quote:
Originally Posted by meh
That a driver manages to drive extremely fast does not automatically mean he can give good car feedback, especially on how car behavior changes with different parts/setup.Quote:
Originally Posted by meh
There are many examples where the opposite is often true, "second" or even "third rate" drivers are often better developers than top speed guys that just go as fast as they could all the time.
If you recall Breen after testing with Loeb in C3 (in 2018) was even surprised that Loeb would drive almost all runs on 90% speed and give feedback on the car and only do last few runs at max speed. For Breen it was at that point only natural to drive at full speed.
You only need the real top speed when you start comparing with other cars on rallies, which won't be before 2022. Another point is that these days the difference in top speed between the say 8 fastest drivers is very small in km/s.
Another thing is that the engineers have to actually trust the driver feedback, being a champion/multiple winner can give more authority but other things can do that too. Sometimes it doesn't matter who you are when leadership decides that you are just to pilot what engineers make (Nandans publicly stated approach, 307 WRC 4 gear gearbox..., C3 development etc.).
A cheaper alternative I'm sure, but Lehtinen's decision. He has other options in the sport.Quote:
Originally Posted by AnttiL
Shame.Quote:
Originally Posted by AnttiL
'Ford Fiesta WRC' sounds so much better than 'Ford Fiesta Rally 1'
Even sticking with R1-R5 would have been better but reversing the hierarchy, although I suppose that would be even more confusing than the current mess.
I prefer the new class structure. Same as Formula. 1 is better, 5 is slower...
Any news on whether the 2022 car will be a Fiesta or a Puma.
Fiesta
I bet the cars will still be called WRC, WRC2/R5 for quite a long time..
Stupid and confusing changes.. They should better work on 22' car rules.. it's already first week of 2021 and basically no news..
The series is called World Rally Championship.. not Rally1, rally2
Wrong thread tho..
And 5th gear is faster than 1st gear. All about perspective.Quote:
Originally Posted by Andre Oliveira
And the one who finished 1st was fastestQuote:
Originally Posted by Franky
i agree, i would just rather they were called R1, R2 etc as it sounds less silly.Quote:
Originally Posted by Andre Oliveira
And its ok for a Formula One racing car to be called an F1 car.Quote:
Originally Posted by RS
The problem is the rally car denotation R1-R5 were already used before (albeit in reverse).
Totally agree now it’s put like this. I liked WRC car, hated Rally1, but like R1 car. That’s what I’ll go with.Quote:
Originally Posted by RS
Thank you.
That reverse thing is THE problem.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fast Eddie WRC
Otherwise we would be calling Rally2 as R2 now.
From 2022 (if not before) we will call the new WRCar R1 the Rally2 cars R2 and so on. At least in here.
Kresta at that point (2005) had lot of experience with multiple WRC cars (Octavia, Fabia, 206, Accent and 03 Subaru) among these he certainly impressed with posting some of the fastest times ever done by the Accent WRC in his very first (and only) start with it. He has a reputation of being very good with setting up cars.
As mentioned none of these 3 at MSport now ever drove anything else than Fiesta as WRC or R5 .
Why everybody is so certain that development on new car will be on these drivers?Quote:
Originally Posted by mknight
Suninen confirmed that he will test Rally1 2022.
yes, fourmeaux as well. but I suspect the main work will be again done by Wilson jr and other non-top drivers. let's see.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom K
btw, I don't remember who were the first developers of the current wrc (before tanak and ogier came in)
Tänak did most of it, also Camilli, Evans, Wilson Jr and if i remember right also Prokop but i could be wrong here.Quote:
Originally Posted by wyler
Wilson must have been 1st in Greystoke and then Camilli & Tänak in Spain at the end of August 2016. After that in Spain (Camilli), in Finland (Tänak), in Italy (Evans), in France ( Østberg, Tänak & Camilli). Tänak & Ogier were testing in Sweden in December 2016. I think that Prokop was not testing...Quote:
Originally Posted by EstWRC
I think a driver that is slower but gives good feedback is way better than a fast driver who doesn't know what he's talking about.
A story about Francois Duval from the book of Stephane Prevot comes into my mind. He was very fast without a doubt, but when driving for Citroën he didn't even know the difference between under and oversteer...
I am not (and I don't think anyone else is either).Quote:
Originally Posted by wyler
But I am worried if it will be only those 3, off course that alone does not mean it can't be a great car.
Mikkelsen could be an option... but Skoda :D
The problem with that is that until 1.1.2022 R1 is a low-level FWD car...it's gonna sound weird and cause misunderstandings. That's why they didn't call them R1, R2, .... but Rally1, Rally2...Quote:
Originally Posted by T16
I know it's not the most convenient way...GR1, GR2....? No, wait, that's done already as well. RG1? That also means something else.
I’ll be fine - I have a pretty decent ability to forget, so R1 car it is ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by AnttiL
then someone says "Remember when Ingram drove the R5 car?". Do you think of the Skoda Fabia or the Renault Clio?Quote:
Originally Posted by T16
I wouldn’t have any historical interest in Ingram whatsoever. Still happy with R1 car.Quote:
Originally Posted by AnttiL
There will be not Fiesta R1... will be Rally1. Stop abreviate what will not be abreviate.
yeah - cheers, but I'll call it what I like. R1 Car.Quote:
Originally Posted by Andre Oliveira