WRC Rally Sweden 2020

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2nd February 2020, 19:50
sghiwosh81

it arrived Friday afternoon ... we cross our fingershttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...166ce117bf.jpg

Inviato dal mio SM-G960F utilizzando Tapatalk
2nd February 2020, 19:55
masa90

Let's hope for the best but to have the rally properly would need a miracle. When is the date in which the final decision is made?
2nd February 2020, 20:02
AnttiL

Quote:

Originally Posted by BleAivano

I can see both sides of it. On one side I agree with what you say that sponsors/TV-companies, teams, specators can't be let down and etc. However if you look upon it from the other side, if the roads gets too damaged
the likely hood of being allowed to used those roads next year will become slimmer (even if the rally pays for restoration of the roads). That said I really don't see them cancelling. Step 1 is to cancel the stages that are in
the worst condition and then if needed and if possible a stage could be rerun once on another day just to get the necessary KM. Step 2 would be to cancel the historic class either completely or on some stages.

It's quite clear the Saturday stages (Hagfors, Torntorp and Vargåsen) are in the worst condition. I haven't seen pictures of Torsby stage. Likenäs, Nyckelvattnet, Hof-Finnskog and Finnskogen could possibly be run. Could they fill Saturday with third runs of those stages? Maybe one run of Torsby for the power stage, no matter what conditions? That would make 255 km. The rules say the rally must have 75% of its route to award full points. 75% of the route is 225 km, so they would still have a bit of reserve.

Simply cancelling all Saturday stages would be 183 km, which would only award half points.

However, it's worth considering that if Vargåsen, the Karstad super special and Torsby are all cancelled, the rally loses three of its most important spectator areas.
2nd February 2020, 20:07
EstWRC

man those pics are just plain awful

lets see what they decide tomorrow....
2nd February 2020, 20:11
KKS

It's not gonna be happen. 1.5weeks of warm weather require now a lot of snow, that not all melt before a rally. Now we see thin layer of snow at north stages, which will melt by one sunny day with +5 temp. Now we have continues plus degree weather all 1.5 weeks in Sweden. In Norway it colder by 1 or 2 deg, but without huge amount of snow. It's not enough (((

For me it's decision to cancel only Sweden part and hope that Norway stages probably could be driven, or cancel all event now.

No snow predicted here. How it gonna be driven?
https://scontent-hel2-1.xx.fbcdn.net...88&oe=5ECAC02A

No fresh snow here, and they must keep for 1.5 of warm week :/
https://scontent-hel2-1.xx.fbcdn.net...94&oe=5EC11CED
2nd February 2020, 20:19
linni

Snow is not the main issue here.
Icy roads are. The ones in north from Torsby look pretty solid, but Saturday loop looks bad. However you can see ice banks floating in the lake on Vargasen picture so we can assume the road base might be fifty - sixty, frozen.
2nd February 2020, 20:49
tc10a

Quite sure they wait at least until next weekend for a final decision. I still see a revised route as the most likely option.
2nd February 2020, 20:51
KKS

Quote:

Originally Posted by linni

Snow is not the main issue here.
Icy roads are. The ones in north from Torsby look pretty solid, but Saturday loop looks bad. However you can see ice banks floating in the lake on Vargasen picture so we can assume the road base might be fifty - sixty, frozen.

You think it's still possible to run event only on frozen gravel? Not good idea IMHO.
2nd February 2020, 20:59
Tauri_J

The'll run 100% if the ground is frozen. But not a chance with such a warm weather coming in.
2nd February 2020, 21:03
mknight

Quote:

Originally Posted by KKS

You think it's still possible to run event only on frozen gravel? Not good idea IMHO.

If it's cold they can make an ice layer by watering, problem is that the long term forecasts now predict no minus degrees from Saturday on. Yes predictions for 6 days ahead are hardly accurate, but they certainly don't look good atm.

IMO it is entirely possible to cancel it. But with Australia and Chile recently cancelled there surely is some pressure on the promoter to deliver "product" that manus, media, sponsors etc. pay for. Therefore they will not cancel it tomorrow, but wait until at least end of the week.
2nd February 2020, 22:17
stefanvv

Why they just not drive the gravel stages as ..... gravel stages?!?
2nd February 2020, 22:17
KKS

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tauri_J

The'll run 100% if the ground is frozen. But not a chance with such a warm weather coming in.

If it not cover by ice or snow - tyre will lose studs very quickly and it's be undriveable very quickly.

Only possible way is watering as mknight said, but too many "if"s. If weather will be below 0, if ground frozen, if watering create solid ice... too many var's for that short time :(
2nd February 2020, 22:18
KKS

Quote:

Originally Posted by stefanvv

Why they just not drive the gravel stages as ..... gravel stages?!?

it will be perfect!
Gravel and studded tyres must be available. And it gonna be gravel'Monte' for tyre decision.
Setups for gravel and snow - very similar
3rd February 2020, 04:26
linni

Quote:

Originally Posted by KKS

You think it's still possible to run event only on frozen gravel? Not good idea IMHO.

Seen snowless winter rallies before, nothing new.
3rd February 2020, 04:31
linni

If roads are soft and wet, the area will look like a Battle of Bulge after the rally.
If the roads are at least frozen, then no harm will done and studs can be used. On gravel.
3rd February 2020, 06:42
AnttiL

Quote:

Originally Posted by stefanvv

Why they just not drive the gravel stages as ..... gravel stages?!?

1. Roads will be destroyed
2. Gravel tyres don't work in ~0°C conditions. They would need a "supersoft" option.
3. I believe the cars still have to use winter tyres in Sweden on the road sections due to traffic legislations.
3rd February 2020, 07:29
GravelBen

Quote:

Originally Posted by AnttiL

2. Gravel tyres don't work in ~0°C conditions.

That would make it a good challenge for the drivers ;) :monkeedan
3rd February 2020, 08:31
Rallyper

My hope is out...

Feeling sad.
3rd February 2020, 08:49
RS

Has Sweden ever been cancelled before?

Second WRC event out of three lost to climate change, or just bad luck?
3rd February 2020, 08:54
Rallyper

Quote:

Originally Posted by RS

Has Sweden ever been cancelled before?

Second WRC event out of three lost to climate change, or just bad luck?

Yes. 1990. Also lack of ice and snow.
3rd February 2020, 08:55
HKSjbg

Edit: too slow
3rd February 2020, 09:09
RS

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rallyper

Yes. 1990. Also lack of ice and snow.

Thanks. Is this a pattern that there has generally been less ice and snow in recent years (not just in rally time) or is this an exceptional event?
3rd February 2020, 09:13
AnttiL

Quote:

Originally Posted by RS

Thanks. Is this a pattern that there has generally been less ice and snow in recent years (not just in rally time) or is this an exceptional event?

2016 had warm conditions, some stages cancelled
2017 had little snow but much ice
2018 had an excess of snow
2019 had plenty of snow but quite warm slushy conditions

It's a bit different every year. We remember some Rally Swedens with very little snow such as 2000 and 1997

As for winters in Finland, this is the warmest and least-snowy I've ever seen. In fact, my grandpa said 1924 was the previous one with this little snow...
3rd February 2020, 09:31
EstWRC

David Evans thoughts and his first article for dirtfish https://www.dirtfish.com/rally/wrc/t...-rally-sweden/
3rd February 2020, 09:31
masa90

It has been on/off for decades now. I remember seeing highlights from late 80s and even back then there was some races with really little snow. Then in the 90s there was some good races with lots of snow and some horrible with just enough to run. In the 2000s, feel like the winter conditions been more stable but generally not very cold. Even if you consider that they have partly moved the rally closer to Norway and northern parts of Sweden it is bad to still get this weather.
3rd February 2020, 10:02
Fast Eddie WRC

Time to move north or another country to guarantee a snow rally ?
3rd February 2020, 10:02
Rallyper

Quote:

Originally Posted by RS

Thanks. Is this a pattern that there has generally been less ice and snow in recent years (not just in rally time) or is this an exceptional event?

Winther 2008 was completely lack of snow where I live in eastern Sweden. But I should say yes, slowly, winters have been a bit less snow generally. However variations are hard to assess during time...
3rd February 2020, 10:04
Rallyper

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fast Eddie WRC

Time to move north or another country to guarantee a snow rally ?

I should say Östersund or Umeå.

Both are big enough cities hosting the rally. No lack of snow and absoulutely stunning stagematerial. (Östersund doesn´t really compete with Åre on hotelbeds)
3rd February 2020, 10:13
HKSjbg

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rallyper

I should say Östersund or Umeå.

Both are big enough cities hosting the rally. No lack of snow and absoulutely stunning stagematerial. (Östersund doesn´t really compete with Åre on hotelbeds)

I’d like to hear the English-language commentators attempts to pronounce the likely stage names near Umeå, they have enough trouble with Likenäs already 😅
3rd February 2020, 10:59
swanny

So long as no one needs to go to hospital they'll be fine :D
[Hit the speech button on the translation if you don't know]
https://translate.google.com/#view=h...&text=hospital
3rd February 2020, 11:13
Fast Eddie WRC

Dirtfish report
https://www.dirtfish.com/rally/wrc/t...-rally-sweden/
3rd February 2020, 11:21
HKSjbg

Quote:

Originally Posted by swanny

So long as no one needs to go to hospital they'll be fine :D
[Hit the speech button on the translation if you don't know]
https://translate.google.com/#view=h...&text=hospital

Ah, skälvklart 😁 When I asked my Svensk friends why they call ice cream ‘glass’ not ‘is-grädde’ they said why do you call it ‘hospital’ not ‘sick house’ 😅
3rd February 2020, 14:13
BleAivano

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fast Eddie WRC

Time to move north or another country to guarantee a snow rally ?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rallyper

I should say Östersund or Umeå.

Both are big enough cities hosting the rally. No lack of snow and absoulutely stunning stagematerial. (Östersund doesn´t really compete with Åre on hotelbeds)

I agree. Both also have have good connections with Stockholm by air and train. Umeå is a quit large city (130'000 in the municipality) while Östersund is about half the size of Umeå and quite a bit smaller then Karlstad.
Östersund is a bit closer to Stockholm by car and mighty attract more spectators from Norway. Umeå might attract less Norwegians but more Finnish spectators with the ferry between Umeå and Vasa (Finland).
Umeå probably have more hotels/restaurants in the actual city while Östersund probably have hotels in the vicinity although many of those are more skiing resorts.
3rd February 2020, 14:40
Fast Eddie WRC

Do either of the places mentioned above already have rallies in the nearby forests ?
3rd February 2020, 14:45
denkimi

Quote:

Originally Posted by linni

If roads are soft and wet, the area will look like a Battle of Bulge after the rally.
If the roads are at least frozen, then no harm will done and studs can be used. On gravel.

Are those gravel roads or earth roads?

If they are gravel, i don't see why they would be more destroyed than on any other gravel rally.
3rd February 2020, 14:51
tommeke_B

Quote:

Originally Posted by denkimi

If they are gravel, i don't see why they would be more destroyed than on any other gravel rally.

Maybe you also don't see that other gravel rallies are not driven with studded tires. ;)
3rd February 2020, 15:02
BleAivano

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fast Eddie WRC

Time to move north or another country to guarantee a snow rally ?

Quote:

Originally Posted by denkimi

Are those gravel roads or earth roads?

If they are gravel, i don't see why they would be more destroyed than on any other gravel rally.

In the summer on dry hard roads I would agree but there is a reason that no rallies in Sweden are driven on soaked defrosted gravel roads. The roads are too soft and thus also undriveable.
3rd February 2020, 15:03
Tauri_J

Quote:

Originally Posted by tommeke_B

Maybe you also don't see that other gravel rallies are not driven with studded tires. ;)

And during winter.
3rd February 2020, 15:05
BleAivano

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fast Eddie WRC

Do either of the places mentioned above already have rallies in the nearby forests ?

Yes Umeå/Vännas has a Swedish championship round at the end of this month. Östersund have hosted Swedish championship round in previous years.

Some road pics from Vännäs area.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/4700...0057328134079/
3rd February 2020, 15:08
AnttiL

Quote:

Originally Posted by denkimi

Are those gravel roads or earth roads?

If they are gravel, i don't see why they would be more destroyed than on any other gravel rally.

Ask the organizers of Hankiralli 1990. They went bankrupt afterwards. They should have done like Rally Sweden the same year.

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