You´ve missed one great US GP in 2006 ´cause I don´t recall you going so coo coo about it then...Quote:
Originally Posted by ioan
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You´ve missed one great US GP in 2006 ´cause I don´t recall you going so coo coo about it then...Quote:
Originally Posted by ioan
It was a disgrace.Quote:
Originally Posted by eu
There is a significant difference, it is not a normal situation - Alonso before the world press with I reckon most of the British journalists there generally hostile to him, having to answer questions without accidentally saying anything that can be used to attack Ferrari?Quote:
Originally Posted by ioan
And you think it is so easy in a language that is not his own?
Honestly it was unpleasant. I understand why Ferrari did it and I am against punishment other than the fine, but it was very ugly and bad for Felipe. Also I missed PR opportunity - Felipe wins a year after his horrendous crash. But maybe they felt that Vettel is threatening the 1-2 and Fernando was, IMO, faster.
Still, what happened is not great for the sport.
Did Alonso whine about Fisichella being faster or what?Quote:
Originally Posted by eu
I do use a language that is not my own for 99% of the time, big deal we all get used to it and after a few months it becomes a reflex.Quote:
Originally Posted by Saint Devote
Language is not an excuse anymore, not in this day of globalization.
After the courts decision the result will be nullified for the reds. I see it as a Seb win today.
we have to wait and see, I think that they may nullify their WCC points. I personally think that the fine is enough. It's their team, after all.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mia 01
Agreed, they will nullifie all their points, afterall, it was the most blatant team orders in the whole decade. F1 is in disarepute.Quote:
Originally Posted by F1boat
And then it´s the legal side of the biznizz, all thoose who betted on felipe, they got a case now.
In a civil court this can go on for some time.
If fearri fix races, why watch?
I have been using a language that is not my own for the last 8 years (including regular public speaking), and I have to say that I disagree with your statement. One gets to a certain proficiency, but nowhere near the one from a native language.Quote:
Originally Posted by ioan
I find it interesting that no one made anything from the fact that David Coulthard commented on team orders during his tenure at McLaren, when he "had to let Mika pass". For years here at these forums McLaren was the "example of fair racing" ;)
well, first in defense of Ferrari, at this very race when Button came out right behind Lewis, Mac said, like they were all in a panic, save your fuel....well then towards the end, they said, okay, no worries about fuel, you can go for it....yep, once again....drain them tanks a little bit so it don't look like team orders......
Now being much smarter appearently than their peers at the big red, no one is fussing at mac....... :D
Poor Smedley, no doubt, Luca has him and Massa both in the cross hairs.... :eek:
and Ferrari has now decided "no appeal"....(much like DonKey Jote's old lady, no appeal there either, but dude, you can not get better prices than hers :dozey: ....)
Anyway sounds like the old mercy mercy please plea to authorities......but guess they will still hear the matter anyway... :vader:
But since the meeting is in Italy, ferrari will be serving the kool aid
I disagree.Quote:
Originally Posted by tinchote
I can write an official document and keep a speech at a much higher level in French or English then I could ever do it in Romanian, and it's all down to regular daily use.
Anyway invoking language barriers is just an excuse when it comes to answering question that one fully understands.
Indeed :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Bradley
That’s an example how UNBELIEVABLE it can be, now Ferrari drivers are speaking that there wasn’t any team orders - HOW STUPID :p imp: :p imp: THEY THINK PEOPLE ARE ????
Team orders are not allowed and that is.. believe Ferrari that they are an exception?
100 000$ fine is too little (and too late?).. take points away from Alonso.. at least.. and give the win they steal BACK to Felipe..
There were occassions like that and it has been that way in f1 until the FIA let emotion get the better of sense and intefere after Austria 2002.Quote:
Originally Posted by tinchote
"Fair racing" pertains to the concept that the FIA will not favour any team [such as during the Schumi years when the Suderia had technical veto power] and will try to emnsure no team cheats.
Just like freedom of speech pertains to government and does not refer to forcing any private entity - tv or radio station to act against their own interests.
Ferrari was fair today and acted in its own rational interests. The question is when did anybody else suddenly become relevant to that process? Only Scuderia Ferrari management have say over employee actions and if any employee disagrees they can always leave.
You know nothing about fairness.Quote:
Originally Posted by Saint Devote
Wow, a real case of pot-kettle. You mean like telling Webber to lean out his mixture to save fuel while telling Vettel to speed up? Only Ferrari had the intelligence not to run into each other!Quote:
Originally Posted by ioan
It's been done for years and any other team would have done the same with drivers in similar standings - nothing to see here folks, move along...
Because when Red Bull try to fix races, their drivers run into each other! :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Mia 01
F1 is about business first, then fairness - it always has been.Quote:
Originally Posted by ioan
That's one thing and makes claiming fairness in this case absurd.Quote:
Originally Posted by wmcot
http://www.formula1.com/news/headlin...0/7/11071.html
a team with a budget like Ferrari this should have been US$20,000,000Quote:
Ferrari have been fined US$100,000 by the FIA after race stewards deemed they had breached sporting regulations. The case has also been referred to the World Motor Sport Council (WMSC).
now if alonso can get massa to lie what part did alonso play in crash gate ?Quote:
For his part, Massa suggested he and not the team had made the decision to surrender the lead to Alonso: “In my opinion this was not a case of team orders: my engineer kept me constantly informed on what was going on behind me, especially when I was struggling a bit on the hard tyres: so I decided to do the best thing for the team, and a one-two finish is the best possible result, isn’t it?”
It is fair. Fair to the rational self-interests of Ferrari whose aim it is to leverage their assets rationally in order to attain their stated goal of winning the titles.Quote:
Originally Posted by ioan
This is after all how Schumacher did it and it works. It always has done and was done by people such as Chapman and Mayer and all the great team managers down the years.
Come in from the cold and join us over here on the Dark Side :vader:
After all - we have pizza, Ferrari, motor racing history and pretty girls on our side :D
:rotflmao: :beer: :s mokin:Quote:
Originally Posted by thunderbolt
Don't leave Ron Dennis off that list - DC will be mad at you! :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Saint Devote
And that is how F1 works, folks. If you want to eliminate it, you better only allow teams to have 1 car and 1 driver. Then you can't have team orders.Quote:
Originally Posted by Saint Devote
F1 isn't just about racing, it's a mix of racing, politics and business.
:p : :s mokin: :monkeedan :roll:Quote:
Originally Posted by wmcot
I don't have a problem with it. Team orders has been in F1 for decades.
We've seen team orders applied, one way or the other since 2003.
I guess its been a mixture of Ferrari being gullible with their comms now that radios are scrutinised and Massa throwing his toys out by making out how blatant he was asked to move over cf. Kovy pretending to make a mistake and letting Hamilton through in 2008.
I think its tricky for some kind of compromise/halfway house to enforce.
:D Perish the thought! Dennis was a team manager in the mould of Colin Chapman which as we saw did NOT go down too well with Alonso.Quote:
Originally Posted by wmcot
:eek: Sometimes dear old David Coulthard, like Eddie Irvine has a tendency to be something of a legend in his own mind!
I agree. It's nothing new. Mark today on your calendars as the day that a whole lot of F1 fans realized that teams use team orders!Quote:
Originally Posted by wedge
Yes Ferrari do deserve a fine for being so lame about making the call.Quote:
Originally Posted by wedge
I guess Flav didn't have a chance to line them out in that regard during his visit :s ailor:
excellent press conference, let them squirm.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Brockman
the headlines tomorrow will damage Ferrari and as the reporter from Brazil said, Felipe will not be so seen the same in Brazil. If he had refused to yield and won the race he would have instantly been raised to hero status. But now he will get the Rubens treatment and with these times of twitter, internet, forums, facebook, cellphones, etc, it will only be much worse.
Team members should not portray a disunited front at any time publicly, but even this could be neutralized if the core problem was elminated - revoke the rule of no team orders.Quote:
Originally Posted by wedge
Sorry guys, but nothing more will come of this. The $100,000 fine is a pittance by Ferrari standards and will probably be covered by a happy sponsor.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark
No matter how many threads you guys open, or how much you rant in numerous posts, nothing more will come out of this.
That's it. The FIA, WMSC and anyone else won't have the balls to go any further.
They will regret this and pay for it in any way.
those radio messages were to Hamilton not Button, and he was ahead, so are you saying they were telling hamilton to move over and let the guy behind him in the championship by?Quote:
Originally Posted by markabilly
and by not doing so does this not make Hamilton a better character in your book to ignore that?
or is save your fuel now a coded message meaning something else than what you were going on about during the turkish GP :\
Nah!! nothing more will happen.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mia 01
Nothing can damage Ferrari. People who buy the cars understand what Ferrari has to properly do, and respect that.Quote:
Originally Posted by truefan72
If any Brazilians do act negatively towards Massa, then it will be a gross injustice. He may not be happy and he should have shown decorum, but Felipe is a team player and this is something that has to be realized.
If Felipe decision is attacked then the attackers will be disgracing themselves and do not deserve being represented so well by such a decent fellow as Massa.
Look at what he has been through over the past year. He is a brave, quick and determined racing driver that has earned his Ferrari drive.
Dont know 'bout that mate!Quote:
Originally Posted by thunderbolt
Looks like they finished ONE - TWO to me. It was Red Bull that became the Red Donkey today!