Renault investigated by FIA !

Printable View

Show 40 post(s) from this thread on one page

9th November 2007, 12:43
ioan

Quote:

Originally Posted by rohanweb

how can you combat one of your thousand employee steal information from the work place and sells it to a competitor? well..sacking is the only thing can happen of the employee both side, WHY PUNISHING THE TEAM AS A WHOLE????

Because the team works as a WHOLE!
9th November 2007, 12:44
Daniel

Quote:

Originally Posted by passmeatissue

Well, there is a level of copying that everyone accepts - photographs, sound recording, debriefing new recruits. So "cheating" is not an on/off thing that starts at zero.

What we know about McLaren's use of Ferrari information is...

There was a 780 page dossier which was a blueprint for a team, but McLaren don't need a blueprint, and there's no evidence that it was used at all.
An email about tyre gas which was immediately poo-poohed by Brdigestone.
Emails about weight distribution which only showed that Ferrari and McLaren cars were completely different in concept, to the point where the simulator couldn't emulate the Ferraris, they were off the scale.
Emails about pitstop plans.
There was a lot text and phone traffic but no-one knows what was said. It couldn't have contained any detailed data, though.
McLaren told some lies at the hearing, trying to deny any wrongdoing at all. They should have admitted what did happen.

This was wrong, clearly, but trivial. There is no evidence that the McLaren car benefitted from this. The 2007 car had already been designed long before, so di Montezemolo's cracks about the McLaren being a Ferrari in disguise were just unsporting off-track hostility. McLaren offered to let the FIA inspect the car, and the FIA didn't want to. Everything else is speculation and you can't issue punishments on that basis.

Renault, by contrast, had at least 7 McLaren-logoed documents on their computer system, and there were several specific parts on their 2007 car which were copied from the McLaren data and used through the season.

So having set the bar at $100m and no contsructors points for what McLaren did, Max is in trouble now to be consistent without losing Renault altogether.

I hope you don't mind if I break into your house and steal all your credit cards. I won't buy anything with them of course and I won't benefit from it at all so I expect not to face any sort of prosecution.
9th November 2007, 12:48
ioan

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daniel

I hope you don't mind if I break into your house and steal all your credit cards. I won't buy anything with them of course and I won't benefit from it at all so I expect not to face any sort of prosecution.

Give it up Daniel.
There is really no use to start it again just to get the same results like in the previous threads.
Unless you have plenty of free time for this! ;)
9th November 2007, 13:03
passmeatissue

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daniel

I hope you don't mind if I break into your house and steal all your credit cards. I won't buy anything with them of course and I won't benefit from it at all so I expect not to face any sort of prosecution.

pssst. F1 data is not a credit card ;) .

Much easier to
(a) pretend the other person said something extreme and indefensible, and
(b) concoct some irrelevant analogy

than follow what is going on in F1 and construct a reasoned argument in response to what was actually said.
9th November 2007, 13:03
tinchote

Quote:

Originally Posted by rohanweb

how can you combat one of your thousand employee steal information from the work place and sells it to a competitor? well..sacking is the only thing can happen of the employee both side, WHY PUNISHING THE TEAM AS A WHOLE????

You seem to have got something really wrong here. You don't punish the team whose employee sells the info. You punish the team that buys the info.
9th November 2007, 13:08
Daniel

Quote:

Originally Posted by passmeatissue

pssst. F1 data is not a credit card ;) .

Much easier to
(a) pretend the other person said something extreme and indefensible, and
(b) concoct some irrelevant analogy

than follow what is going on in F1 and construct a reasoned argument in response to what was actually said.

WHAT?!?!?!? pass meat issue. Correct me if I'm wrong but I thought F1 data was credit cards! Oops! :rolleyes:

Unless entrapment can be proved you do as Tinchote said and prosecute the team who received the information. Of course you can "cheat" by looking at photos but cheating from documents is just not on........
9th November 2007, 13:09
ArrowsFA1

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daniel

I hope you don't mind if I break into your house and steal all your credit cards. I won't buy anything with them of course and I won't benefit from it at all so I expect not to face any sort of prosecution.

No-one broke in and stole anything. Nigel Stepney used the company credit card ;)
9th November 2007, 13:11
Daniel

Quote:

Originally Posted by ArrowsFA1

No-one broke in and stole anything. Nigel Stepney used the company credit card ;)

I wasn't trying to liken it exactly to what went on ;)

But lets say pass meat issue's significant other gave me their credit card? Should I not just report it straight away?
9th November 2007, 13:29
pino

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daniel

WHAT?!?!?!? pass meat issue...

Daniel, please write/spell usernames correctly...thanks !
9th November 2007, 14:07
aryan

Quote:

Originally Posted by ArrowsFA1

And therein rests a real problem. With rules being open to interpretation, and penalties being inconsistent, how can fairness be applied consistently for all competitors?

Ah! Civil Law Vs. Common Law... here we go again!

Show 40 post(s) from this thread on one page