Yeah, I also thought Nico was overrated :laugh: ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by CaptainRaiden
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Yeah, I also thought Nico was overrated :laugh: ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by CaptainRaiden
Finally you got pretty close to the reality with this claim. :) Or I may add, depending on the sport, the prime can be either in 20s or (early) 30s. Indeed, depending on the sport, one may not be useless in early 40s either. Schumacher is indeed not useless, as we can see, being able to more or less match Rosberg now. But as you agreed, he is not in an athlete's prime. He is still good, but not that good.Quote:
Originally Posted by CaptainRaiden
Think about this: Schumacher may not be the best in the world right now, but I'm pretty sure he is clearly the best 40+ F1 driver and would beat other 40+ ex-drivers with relative ease. Other drivers have lost their performance even more than MS by this age. You may talk about Mansell, but after his comeback at the age of 41-42 he wasn't doing anything special any more, getting beaten by Hill and Häkkinen. Or you'd think this was his real level too and he was at his best?
Your attention span seems to be slowly improving.Quote:
Originally Posted by Knock-on
But then Mansell won back-to-back WDCs at age 39 and 40, beating much younger guys, and then suddenly he was too old at 42? We all know the 1992 Williams was a class above, but were the other drivers chumps, same as in Indycar, were they all useless to be beaten by a 40 year old, clearly out of his prime, man? Until last year Barrichello was soundly beating a much younger Hulkenberg in the same car, and this year his performance has gone down a bit, but he's still outqualifying and outracing Maldonado sporadically. What, in one year his reflexes became worse and he got out of his prime? Or the reality is that Pastor is just a better driver than Nico?Quote:
Originally Posted by jens
I still didn't get an answer to my previous two questions.
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If people say that MS is way past his prime at 42, and his time away from F1 is a huge factor, then every time he's outqualifying or outracing Nico, he's doing something superhuman, way beyond his capability or what his body can do, and something which goes beyond science and everything that makes sense. Do you guys actually believe that?
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OR that Nico Rosberg is so useless that he can't even beat an out of prime, out of practice, fat, almost blind has-been, in which case Mercedes are getting seriously shortchanged in terms of the quality of drivers they can get, isn't it? That car could be a world beater!
I think the bigger issue is that older drivers simply find it more difficult to adapt efficiently. And that's why a drop in performance at a relatively high age can appear like that - within a season, especially if rules change. Barrichello was good in 2010, but suddenly found new Pirelli tyres and DRS in qualifying harder to master than many young drivers. Even Schumacher, who was known for being excellent in adaption, has found it difficult to master several issues quickly with ease.
Also Schumacher's Canadian GP drive doesn't mean he was superhumanous, simply sportsmen at his age are more inconsistent. And find it more difficult to be competitive on a consistent basis. Mansell also qualified on pole for Australia '94, but didn't manage that feat more often.
To bring an example from another sport like you did, Mr CaptainRaiden. For example I have been following cross-country skiing a lot. And older athletes (close to 40) find it impossible to be at or close to their peak form throughout the season, so they concentrate on just a couple of events, where they aim to really shine. They can win that one specific (like a World Championship) event, but are unable to be at the front more often.
May I suggest another reason , unrelated to age , regarding the red shoe , is that he is not able to gain the edge on the rest , including team-mate , by pounding around the test track endlessly at red tracks .
Personally , I don't think he's lost much speed , but is only just starting to feel one with the car , now that he's been back for the second season .
The Merc design team now have some consistant feedback with which to build , and I expect good things .
It's not the same as when he ran for the reds .
New car .
New tires .
Almost no testing .
None of that has anything to do with age .
Or, or, or, or.......
Or maybe he's just past it?
I think motivation, dedication and drive have a lot more to do with it than some people here give credit for.
In Nigel Mansell's case, ask yourself why he missed the first two races in 1995.Quote:
Originally Posted by CaptainRaiden
Hint: It wasn't because he was too old...
This I agree with.Quote:
Originally Posted by jens
So much crap sometimes, I dont honestly know whats going on with Schumacher, that why he is good sometimes and less then average some times. None of us have ever seen a F1 driver retire at 38, do less then 5% of what he did for 3 yrs and come back to the sport with radical rule changes before this. People who used to drive in their 40's in F1 is a story gone by a long time ago. Fangio won championships in his 50's, doesnt mean if he was given a modern car he would come even close to anyone whos racing today, perhaps he would be at the same level as some of the drivers back then, different era's had different level of fitness in drivers. It has slowly changed with Schumacher becoming a benchmark in the 90's, drivers these days spend a lot of their time in fitness. And its no mystery as has been said we peak from 25 to 35. And also if you keep doing something you stay good at it for longer. Schumacher was probably past his best earlier this decade itself, but somehow or another he had an edge, probably a feeling of having the exact car he wanted.
Anyway comparing athlete from different sports is bs, comparing people who could do great at certain age and saying the same for or against schumi is useless. Barrichello 2 yrs younger, was handily given his arse on a place several times by schumi, he NEVER left the sport, that is the biggest difference between him and Schumi, so pls dont bring him in an argument again. I still feel 90% of schumacher is still one of the best in the field, if he gets a fast car under him we'll see. And I think Rosberg is a WDC material, but Schumi in his prime would have done the same to him what he did to others although he is probably his strongest team mate ever.
I really don't buy this crap about his age and time away from F1. It's been "TWO YEARS" since he returned to Formula 1. In those two years, he has had almost 40 races + 40 qualifying sessions + 120 practice sessions + 2 winter testing sessions with hundreds of laps. How much more time does he need?!? What the hell? In contrast a fat, unmotivated, 42 year old Mansell troubled Schumacher and Hill in 1994 (albeit really rarely, but still did).
And if his age and "time away from F1" :rolleyes: are really holding him back, then what I don't understand is why a professional team like Mercedes is still persevering with him?
A: Is it just because he's German?
B: Or is it that he's bringing billions of dollars of sponsorship money to the team that no other driver can?
C: Or is it that they're such bug-eyed fanboys of schumi, with their mouths full of his nuts, that they'll tirelessly prepare a car for him each weekend, dump silly money into the development of the car, only to get sub-par performance every weekend because of him being old and his "time away from F1"? :rolleyes:
D: Or the fact that Rosberg is just a better driver and Schumacher is way past it?
E: All of the above.
I find the excuses very convenient, because whenever he's doing bad, it's his time away from F1 and his age. And when he does good, it's the Schumi of old. :crazy: