Agreed. Have never understood the hype.Quote:
Originally Posted by X-ecutioner
Printable View
Agreed. Have never understood the hype.Quote:
Originally Posted by X-ecutioner
I'll say he did pretty much as my expectation this time last year (post #735) - I said top 5/6, and he was seventh overall after the Stiggy team ran out of money meaning Foret and Pitt edged him in the end as they scored at Portimao and he wasn't there. That said, Eugene Laverty obviously had an amazing season which put all the other Hondas in the shade.
Westy seemed to go pretty well at the flowing and not-all-top-end tracks like Phillip Island and Brno, and was a bit anonymous at some of the others at times, which reflects in his position overall. It could *possibly* be argued that the Stiggy team overstretched themselves by running four bikes at the start of the year [although I think the problem was more that they got shafted by sponsors, they're clearly a decent group] which maybe meant they weren't quite as tip-top as Josh Brookes had been in 2008 for them, but then again Leon and Ant had podiums so that suggests they weren't far off the fastest things out there.
I'd say he definitely showed well enough to merit a continued international career, although I can see how you guys who fancied him for the title would be disappointed. Cal and Eugene (blowing my patriotic trumpet here) did somewhat re-write the rules on Supersport this year, mind you...
I'll bite.
I think the criticism of West is unfair as it seems obvious given that the team could not field West in the last race that they (the team) was in a dire financial situation which, no doubt would not have appeared overnight. So, to me the chances are that the team was over stretched financially for sometime which would definitely have had an impact on their competitiveness throughout the year and a rider can only be as competitive as the equipment allows.
Yes, it is true that he was on a Honda but to assume that it was as competitive as others in the field is at best naive and at worst, well best left unsaid as again, dollars buys competitiveness and without dollars one cannot buy the services or products required.
So to me, before we 'shoot' West in this case one needs to look at the whole picture which includes the talent of West but is offset by the financial constraints of the team that seemed to have less money each round and ultimately had to forfeit a round.
Now, yes it may seem an excuse but the Stiggy team is not a factory supported outfit, nor do or did they have huge sponsorship dollars and to a degree across both SBK and SS were punching above their weight. Fact is, they punched well and landed a few blows but ultimately they got tired and lost thefight.
As for West, well despite what many seem to feel the guy has talent, plenty of talent, but he does not have an attraction to sponsors nor is he marketable so ultimately he relies on that talent to get him rides. Sadly however as we know, talent opens the door to many things and if that talent comes with some backing the doors hide larger rewards.
West is IMO a large talent, but is raw and un-sophisticated in the ways fo the race world and as such for mine he will not achieve a top ride, but instead will languish in tier 2/3.
Gaz
Perhaps a 'winning' stint back in OZ is the answer. I gotta say, riding an ASBK Spec R1 seems a dud move however.Quote:
Originally Posted by gco0307
I have to agree with Gaz - a great talent, an underdeveloped bike, and a career stalled by his naivity and inability to perform off the bike as well as he performs on it. Which is a shame, but you've got to be the complete package to sit at the top in the modern racing era.
I think he'd be better off going WEC racing, or a European domestic championship, than coming home.
Yep, and even after non-performing for I don't know how long, the hype still remains. Surprising.Quote:
Originally Posted by theugsquirrel
:DQuote:
Originally Posted by gco0307
Too sure about these things, aren't we? Agreed that Stiggy were going through financial problems, but there is no way of knowing for sure if it was going on for a long time, especially from around early to mid-season, when West dropped off the map. Here, again, we are "assuming."Quote:
Originally Posted by gco0307
This is not the first time in history that a rider has had to deal with underdeveloped machinery and still has to perform under pressure. The truly talented riders shine only in these circumstances. See Aoyama in 250cc. Agreed, different class, different machinery etc. but he is punching way above his weight, lone privateer Honda in the top 6, a field dominated by Aprilias, leading the championship.Quote:
Originally Posted by gco0307
So, this excuse of underdeveloped bike doesn't really stand when he had his hands on a 2009 spec CBR600RR and couldn't perform. It's not that the other Hondas got developed to a point where they were light years ahead. Especially hard to understand when Laverty challenged for the championship on a privateer Honda.
IMO he is still only extremely hyped and overrated. I heard the same things when he came to MotoGP, and before the Supersport season even started. But the truth of the matter is, if he really is as talented as you guys say, he would have a ride on the international scene for next year, sponsor or no sponsor.Quote:
Originally Posted by gco0307
I mean the guy came to Supersport from MotoGP! That's a big step down, and with this much experience (and hype), "Westy" ought to do something special even on an underdeveloped bike. These things may not be possible in car racing, but in motorcycle racing they are. Juan Lascorz is a prime example, riding brilliantly on the Kawasaki.
I still believe, IMO that another more talented, hungrier and more talented rider would have performed better on that bike.
X-eccutioner. Im not even going to bother defending Ant, because you are clearly a WUM.
But for those who want to see Ant do well and believe in his ability, (See 2007 rides aboard R6) you will be happy to know he is getting a chance to test this years R6 at the current Portimao tests, once again with Wilco Zilenbergs team.
I really hope he can make the most of the opportunity.
http://www.motorsport-aktuell.com/su...aha-11023.html
http://pix.crash.net/motorsport/360/PA671848.jpg
couple more pics.
http://pix.crash.net/motorsport/360/PA671794.jpg
http://pix.crash.net/motorsport/360/PA671788.jpg
http://pix.crash.net/motorsport/360/PA671781.jpg
http://pix.crash.net/motorsport/360/PA671780.jpg
must feel weirrrd riding with crutchlows number.
Very mature. I enjoy intellectual discussions like these. ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by tha_jackal
Heh, I think this is the n'th time I have heard that one. That is really ALL that Ant fans have to say for him, the rides in 2007 in SSP. Again, he didn't perform any miracles. It has been done before many times.Quote:
Originally Posted by tha_jackal
I remember that in 2000, a certain Hitoyasu Izutsu, wildcard rider, on a Kawasaki won both races at Sugo beating the likes of Bayliss, Corser, Edwards and Haga, the big factory boys. Yeah, Japanese rider, Japanese machine on a Japanese track from their domestic championship etc., but this was in SBK, against the regular riders with full factory support, an even harder feat to achieve.
The following year in 2001, Makoto Tamada as a wildcard did the double, albeit on a Honda, but still remarkable (Bayliss didn't even qualify in the top 16). In the same year, Ben Bostrom won 6 races (5 of them straight) out of nowhere, yeah, he had a factory Ducati, the best bike during that time, which also enabled Bayliss to win all his championships, but still what he achieved was pretty special.
So, where are all these guys now? Were they special, flukes, or just like any other rider, they need a competitive bike to perform? So, then how in blue heaven is Anthony West more talented and special than any these guys, if he still, being the demi-God that he is on this forum, in the end needs a top bike to perform? Face it, he’s just an average joe who somehow has a tremendous amount of hype behind him.
To be honest, as a racing fan, I don’t see anything special, and if I was a team boss, I would want a rider who is consistently fast in all conditions, dry or wet, not one who just wins when it’s raining, and prays for rain every time they interview him on the grid. :rolleyes:
That’s my two cents, and I guess that’s it, because it seems to offend people around here gravely for some strange reason if someone doesn’t understand the hype surrounding this overrated rider. Well, I won’t stand in the way of this hero worshipping. Carry on please. Ciao. :)
Ok, X -ecutioner,
West needs a top bike to perform? The same could be said of anyone - take your pick of the current crop (yep, even the Doctor... even he couldn't make the Kawasaki go fast). Your argument is specious at best.
That I took time to point this out dismays me the most of all.