Mercedes accused of illegal tyre testing by Red Bull & Ferrari

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Originally Posted by dj_bytedisaster

My conclusion
Pirelli did it again. They massively effed up F1 and put the FIA into an impossible situation. They knowingly (and therefore deliberately) breached the rules and Mercedes went along with it.

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That's not really the right conclusion. Pirelli didn't break the rules. There are no regulations prohibiting the tyre supplier from testing. The testing restrictions apply to the competitors in the F1 world championship, i.e. the teams. If the testing regulations were broken, it was by Mercedes. Being persuaded or induced to do it by some other party doesn't change that.

Pirelli are bound by their contract with the FIA, and I haven't seen any suggestion that they have broken that.

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Originally Posted by AndyL

That's not really the right conclusion. Pirelli didn't break the rules. There are no regulations prohibiting the tyre supplier from testing. The testing restrictions apply to the competitors in the F1 world championship, i.e. the teams. If the testing regulations were broken, it was by Mercedes. Being persuaded or induced to do it by some other party doesn't change that.

Pirelli are bound by their contract with the FIA, and I haven't seen any suggestion that they have broken that.

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And the FIA have sanctioned a test in a 2013 car, for 1000KM's. So, who's in the wrong now?

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Originally Posted by AndyL

That's not really the right conclusion. Pirelli didn't break the rules. There are no regulations prohibiting the tyre supplier from testing. The testing restrictions apply to the competitors in the F1 world championship, i.e. the teams. If the testing regulations were broken, it was by Mercedes. Being persuaded or induced to do it by some other party doesn't change that.

Pirelli are bound by their contract with the FIA, and I haven't seen any suggestion that they have broken that.

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And, without everyone bound by a current Concorde agreement, is the FIA contract even valid in respect to the teams.????

It's a bigger mess that Mr Trebus' back yard! ;)

SG, so you're implying that everyone knew what had happened and 10 teams in unison played a nice theatre for us at Monaco? Damn, not even I am that cynical and I don't believe it. Usually I don't give a rats arse about the drivel that falls out of Marko's skull, but in one respect he's got a point. No matter how loudly Merc claim the opposite - by running 3 GP distances with their current cars and their current drivers they gained a valuable know-how advantage, one that RB and Ferrari cannot claw back until Silverstone at the earliest, even if FIA retro-actively legalizes it. Wouldn't it have made much more sense for them to delay or even prevent this test? As it is now Merc will go to Canada as the only team to have already run the tweaked tires on their current car. That's a significant advantage.
Merc doesn't employ retards for engineers. Even with Pirelli not telling them, which tire is which. It would take them no more than half a day to work out, which are the modified 2013 tyres and which are the beta-versions for 2014.

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Originally Posted by dj_bytedisaster

SG, so you're implying that everyone knew what had happened and 10 teams in unison played a nice theatre for us at Monaco? Damn, not even I am that cynical and I don't believe it. Usually I don't give a rats arse about the drivel that falls out of Marko's skull, but in one respect he's got a point. No matter how loudly Merc claim the opposite - by running 3 GP distances with their current cars and their current drivers they gained a valuable know-how advantage, one that RB and Ferrari cannot claw back until Silverstone at the earliest, even if FIA retro-actively legalizes it. Wouldn't it have made much more sense for them to delay or even prevent this test? As it is now Merc will go to Canada as the only team to have already run the tweaked tires on their current car. That's a significant advantage.
Merc doesn't employ retards for engineers. Even with Pirelli not telling them, which tire is which. It would take them no more than half a day to work out, which are the modified 2013 tyres and which are the beta-versions for 2014.

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10 teams have not complained......

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Originally Posted by SGWilko

And the FIA have sanctioned a test in a 2013 car, for 1000KM's. So, who's in the wrong now?

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FIA has sanctioned 1000km tests if and only if all teams are given the same opportunity to take part in the test. According to at least three teams that hasn't been the case in 2013. That qualifies as a huge honking breach of contract.

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Originally Posted by SGWilko

10 teams have not complained......

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No, only five. Only two of those have been protesting, but Sauber said clearly that they'll support Ferrari's protest if something comes of it.

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Originally Posted by dj_bytedisaster

According to at least three teams .

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Depends on what constitutes a breach? Pirelli clearly feel they have fulfilled their re-mit, and so do Mercedes.........

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Originally Posted by dj_bytedisaster

Sauber said clearly that they'll support Ferrari's protest if something comes of it.

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Shock horror! Nice cheap v6's next year if they get their tongues in deep enough I reckon! :laugh:

As for this FOTA letter, not all teams are FOTA members, are they????

Sounds like cherrypicking by some teams to me......