Well Massa might have a better value/point ration than MS for last season as far as I'm concerned!Quote:
Originally Posted by Ian McC
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Well Massa might have a better value/point ration than MS for last season as far as I'm concerned!Quote:
Originally Posted by Ian McC
Panis? He is 40 years old already.Quote:
Originally Posted by ArrowsFA1
Anyway, I don't usually care much, how much anyone is paid, but what I think we should take into account in Toyota's case, are previous years and how they hired their current drivers. It means - offering a lot of money is their method to get a driver. In 2004 they were slow and how could you say to a top team driver (who was Ralf then) that hey we are going to pay you 2 million $ per year and you should be content with driving among backmarkers.
Toyota has offered a lot of money to others as well.
In 2002 they offered 10 million $ to Barrichello.
In 2004 they asked Webber to drive for them. Not sure about the salary amount, but definetely bigger than the offer from Renault or Williams.
They offered "the riches of the world" to Räikkönen and Alonso, but also failed to get them.
Trulli has been another rare guy, who had belief in Toyota and refused from the offer of BAR in 2004 (how enticing it could have been THEN!) and preferred Toyota.
There is never such thing that someone is paying a lot of money just with a good will. "Pay as little as possible, but enough that the employee is satisfied and motivated to work," is the principle for an employer. And also Toyota has its own reasons, not just "oh we have nothing to do with our money, so let's give them so much".
Well. As Willi Weber is not Ralf's manager any more, then it would be interesting to see, how successful Ralf will be in his further negotiations.
Added to that, its not Ralf who is failing toyota. Its toyota. I really cant understand this hatred for Ralf, its amazing how he gets bashed no matter what he does, yet a certain former teammate of him can whine for 365 days and still get praise. He has outperformed Trulli, who was easily the equal of Alonso in 2004. I am not saying he is the best driver, but he is a good driver for sure. Someone suggested that Toyota should have hired panis? hahahahahahahaha. Panis is nowhere the driver Ralf is, and Toyota doesnt have problems with lack of money. They have loads of it, the problem is the management. Ralf and Trulli have driven well, any other driver in that car wouldnt have produced better results, with the exception of Michael Schumacher. But then again, you only have one Michael, a big big difference and then come other drivers.Quote:
Originally Posted by ioan
when Ralf was on his day he could as fast as his brother, remember San Marino 01 or France 03?
problem is that in the last years Ralf has been way too erratic. he's usually faster than Trulli yet when he's slower he's as slow as a Toro Rosso...
surely not the 3rd best driver on the grid but still a decent one(he has won more races than Button and Trulli together), but I don't he's worth what he's paid
True enough, Toyota have failed but the point being made is Ralf is not worth the money, there is no hatred for him.Quote:
Originally Posted by Garry Walker
True to a degree. The team have consistently failed to deliver, but neither Ralf (nor Jarno) appear capable of pushing & motivating the team to improve. They appear comfortatble where they are, and where they are (and probably will stay at this rate) is midfield.Quote:
Originally Posted by Garry Walker
Disagreeing with the criticism does not mean the criticism is hatred. You clearly have a higher regard for Ralf's abilities than many others. Fair enough.Quote:
Originally Posted by Garry Walker
I suggested Panis simply because he was available and would have provided what Toyota needed at the time. You say that "any other driver in that car wouldnt have produced better results" but that's unprovable. Even if true it raises questions about the amount spent by the management on drivers. Throwing money in the wrong direction achieves little, as Toyota have shown in the last two years.Quote:
Originally Posted by Garry Walker
Even da Matta, Panis and Zonta didn't get so much criticism during the years of 2003-2004 as Trulli and Ralf get now... :dozey:
da matta was good toyota should have kept him! but then i like trulli and ralf aswell so 3 into 2 doesnt go i guess
True, but I wouldn't turn Toyota down if they offered me the same amount! As always, there are two sides to the story.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ian McC
Well, looks like it's all pretty much even at the moment Ralf/Trulli-wise. Interesting Toyota race tomorrow ;) Let's see how many points-per-dollar these two wasters bring home eh :p