Guns Guns Guns, Now Paris!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by gadjo_dilo

I'm not as religious as you might think....And don't have too much christian knowledge either. However I think that God only showed the path to follow. We're free to decide what to do. The tragedies are the result of our own deeds

---

I struggle with degrees of religiousness, if you believe in god you are therefore religious to me. If you are comfortable in your beliefs and not so insecure as to feel to covert or kill alternative beliefs or lack thereof then you are arguably more religious than extremists who feel the need to defend their omnipotent and omnipresent god by killing people who worship differently or don't believe at all. That said you sound like a spiritual person who is not enamored with organised religion, beyond the local cultural traditions. I have plenty of time for that.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Robinho

You've hit 2 nails on the head for me there. One is culture. Religion, for the masses, I contend, is more about culture than belief. And I feel strongly about preserving culture.

As for offending religious feelings, why are they more important than either the alternative religious feelings (answer because only 1 can be correct and therefore the alternative is offensive, whatever it is) or the feelings of the non religious. I feel offended by pretty much all religion, and to me, from a standpoint where I don't believe in any god, everyone who is religious is extreme or fundamentalist.

---

While I always support a persons right to free speech and opinion in any situation, I'm finding that you seem to be overlooking a very obvious point.

Your contention is essentially that since you believe in no god, those that do are incorrect, and those religious beliefs are the cause of many bad things. Has it ever occurred to you that any time you take 98% of the world population, regardless of what binds that 98%, that the majority of all things done, both good and bad, will be done by that 98%?

I would strongly contend that if the 98% of the world population that either claims religion of some type or are agnostic were all in fact extreme or fundamentalist, the 2% of the world population that claims to be atheist would likely have long ago been wiped off the face of the planet.







I find it interesting that a number of comments by several posters on this thread are so biased in regards to religion and/or gun control, yet nobody really seemed to have acknowledged that this is a case of a few nutters doing what nutters do. Regardless of their religious views, weapons, physical characteristics, etc they are extremists of a level well beyond most humans.

And I would think that any intelligent person would realize that when they take actions intended to offend a large group of people, they are essentially trolling for one of these nutters that does have extremist views to do something about it. As tragic as this incident is, it could have IMO most likely been avoided by someone not going out of their way to intentionally offend others.



And it appears that as I type this, a town has essentially been put in lockdown, and there are reports that the two remaining suspects may have been killed in the final raids after taking hostages.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Robinho

....... extremists who feel the need to defend their omnipotent and omnipresent god by killing people who worship differently or don't believe at all.....

---

I don't think they kill for such reasons.....They don't have a problem if people don't worship Allah.
Otherwise they should kill more than half of the world. For God's sake.....We lived under the Ottoman empire for a few hundreds years and never been forced to convert to Islam or deny our religion....
I don't have time to follow the news but in this particular case I understood there were some cartoons involving prophet Mahomed. We know his image is taboo and the offence to their prophet is punished by death. I think there are some limits in everything. Come on.....We also don't make jokes about the Holocaust.....

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by airshifter

And I would think that any intelligent person would realize that when they take actions intended to offend a large group of people, they are essentially trolling for one of these nutters that does have extremist views to do something about it. As tragic as this incident is, it could have IMO most likely been avoided by someone not going out of their way to intentionally offend others.

---

The peak of political correctness.

If fanatics weren't fanatical there would be nothing to lampoon. Feel free to have any views and expressions you wish. But when you take deadly action against me and mine because of my views and expressions it's time for your removal from the planet.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by gadjo_dilo

I don't think they kill for such reasons.....They don't have a problem if people don't worship Allah.

---

Quite obviously they do as witnessed by their actions against civilians in the territory controled by ISIS, the Taliban etc.

Quote:

---

Otherwise they should kill more than half of the world. For God's sake.....

---

The only reason they don't is that they don't have the ability to do so.....yet.

Quote:

---

..... I understood there were some cartoons involving prophet Mahomed. We know his image is taboo and the offence to their prophet is punished by death. I think there are some limits in everything. Come on.....We also don't make jokes about the Holocaust.....

---

I make jokes about almost everything including the holocaust. Laughter is a great tool.

There is no subject that you can't joke about. It depends entirely on what the actual joke is

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Starter

. .....Feel free to have any views and expressions you wish.....

---

So.....
You'll be ready anytime to express your views even if you know from the very start it's a sensitive issue for me and it will hurt me? :confused:
Interesting to know.....:eek:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by gadjo_dilo

So.....
You'll be ready anytime to express your views even if you know from the very start it's a sensitive issue for me and it will hurt me? :confused:
Interesting to know.....:eek:

---

Self limiting your own expressions as a courtesy toward a person or group of persons is not the same thing as someone telling you you MUST limit your expressions.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Brown, Jon Brow

There is no subject that you can't joke about. It depends entirely on what the actual joke is

---

Totally disagree with this. What joke could be made regarding Rwanda? About the Sudan? About Slavery? About starvation that would be acceptable.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by gadjo_dilo

I don't think they kill for such reasons.....They don't have a problem if people don't worship Allah.
Otherwise they should kill more than half of the world. For God's sake.....We lived under the Ottoman empire for a few hundreds years and never been forced to convert to Islam or deny our religion....
I don't have time to follow the news but in this particular case I understood there were some cartoons involving prophet Mahomed. We know his image is tabu and the offence to their prophet is punished by death. I think there are some limits in everything. Come on.....We also don't make jokes about the Holocaust.....

---

Extremists like Muslim fanatics are no different to the fundamentalist Christians and any other extremes of religion. Your religion is a happenstance in my opinion. If you were born in India you would be praising the Hindi God, Mid-East Muslim or in the western world some branch of Christianity of which there are many freaks. Take for instance Kurt Cameron (sic) and his buddy claiming the banana they hold at their filled out junkets is in fact a man made genetic alteration. Take Robertson, Falwell (dead) the Swaggerts "Oh, I have sinned, and the myriad of fools that go to Kentucky believing that T-REX walked amongst them as well as all the other dinosaurs because the earth is only "5,000 years" old.
Evolution is a sham to them. How do educated people believe that Noah built an Ark and collected all these animals in pairs? Does anyone believe in simple biology? Genetics, Mendels Law, cross breeding and the annihilation of Humanity in a very very short time because of the inability to further the races of even the most base of animals due to inbreeding.