Is Sebastien Bourdais that bad?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by pits4me

He really belongs in the Renault camp instead of Alonso who's not there for the best interest of the team.

---

Why would Renault want somebody who can't come to terms with a car, the Toro Rosso, which is being driven better and to better results by somebody else?

Alonso, whilst not back at Renault for the long haul, is totally proven, knows how to work with the team and is Renault's best bet.

Bourdais had the chance to be in Alonso's seat once before....he didn't take it.

Also, if you had any actual knowledge, you would know that Renault's pro-French policy of the 1980's blew up horribly in their face with Alain Prost. There is no way on earth that Renault would risk putting a sub-par Frenchman into one of their cars now since the French press would crucify them, not the driver.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by garyshell

Much like I bet Jacques would like to forget the stint at BAR.

Gary

---

He might, but I bet his accountant has fond memories.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by tamburello

He might, but I bet his accountant has fond memories.

---

And his manager!

Gary

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mad_Hatter

That's not a flaw in f1 it's part of racing competition. All Racing. In SCCA World Challenge the guys with the Porsches have to take out wing because they are not as fast as the Corvettes and Vipers in a straight line. The drivers will have to deal with that understeer.

---

What if the Porshe driver wants to take out wing and the team says no we cant this car wasnt made to run like that just learn to drive it as it is? By all accounts including Vettel's that is what they told bourdais. The idea a driver has to just learn to live with that is crazy. If you take that postion then the traditional idea of a driver even learning how to setup a car is a meaningless waste of time since it will be given to them. There is a theoretical best setup according to the laws of physics which probably could be figured out by computer and lab testing with no driver input. Just use that then and the driver just has to becomes a robot that can drive anything. Fun?

Also, if you had any actual knowledge, you would know that Renault's pro-French policy of the 1980's blew up horribly in their face with Alain Prost. There is no way on earth that Renault would risk putting a sub-par Frenchman into one of their cars now since the French press would crucify them, not the driver.[/QUOTE]



Mr 'all knowledgeable Tamburello' - what a load of bollocks - things in F1 turn on their head in a heartbeat and that was over 20 years ago !

That whole scenario must have affected Alain Prost so much that he didnt decide to run Olivier Panis in his own team...

Can you tell me who was rubbishing that ploy one day in atrocious conditions when a certain blue French car covered in French sponsorship driver by a French driver won the Monaco GP ????

A French driver in a Renault would be brilliant. The French media would love it ! Just like the Italian media do with Italian Ferrari drivers etc etc

Seabass is hardly sub par - in fact he's a very good driver and would compliment any team given time and development - the issue is with the Toro Rosso - its a heap of crap.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by bravefish

A French driver in a Renault would be brilliant.

---

I agree.


Sebastian Loeb to F1. You heard it here first.



...Why would Renault want a driver who can't beat his teammate in a backmarker team?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ZzZzZz

Some seem to give in if the driver fights enough, such as with Jacques Villeneueve at Williams, where his input, once they listened, helped the team.

---

Yep, JV was all at sea when he first joined the Williams team (finishing a lap down at Monaco for example), mostly because they overruled him on the setup, bascially saying having a car that stiff would be crazy. But eventually they gave up and said "do what you want", he did, and then went on to challenge for the world championship until the final race.

Seb is a very good driver, his problem is that the car is bad and that Vettel might be even better. I think that his CCWS titles are not as impressive as the IRL championship winners or the old CART champions, but still he is a great driver.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by bravefish

A French driver in a Renault would be brilliant. The French media would love it ! Just like the Italian media do with Italian Ferrari drivers etc etc

---

Q - And the last Italian to have a full-time race seat contract for Ferrari was?

A - Ivan Capelli. The car was a dog and the Italian press had a field day. Ferrari have avoided an Italian ever since.

Prost (who wasn't the owner of Ligier when Panis won the Monaco GP but don't let little snippets of facts ruin your argument) ran Panis and then Alesi, both Frenchman, yet still his team went into receivership.

So much for the power of the French press.

Had they been as thrilled by the positioning of a Frenchman in a French car as you claim, then there would have been no problem for Alain to find the necessary sponsorship to replace the state-owned tobacco sponsor.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by tamburello

Q - And the last Italian to have a full-time race seat contract for Ferrari was?

A - Ivan Capelli. The car was a dog and the Italian press had a field day. Ferrari have avoided an Italian ever since.

Prost (who wasn't the owner of Ligier when Panis won the Monaco GP but don't let little snippets of facts ruin your argument) ran Panis and then Alesi, both Frenchman, yet still his team went into receivership.

So much for the power of the French press.

Had they been as thrilled by the positioning of a Frenchman in a French car as you claim, then there would have been no problem for Alain to find the necessary sponsorship to replace the state-owned tobacco sponsor.

---

--------------------------------------------------------------------------


You cant beat patriotic pride and any time a driver of the same nationality as the team gets together its fantastic for the media and the sport.

Whether the media is completely responsible for the demise of a team... we could debate that until the cows come home.. they play a role no doubt, but there are many more factors and good drivers dont neccessarily make good team owners...

Nicola Larini was the last Italian to drive for Ferrari (but dont let little snippets of facts ruin your argument)

There is no doubt that his 2nd place at the San Marino GP would have been superb hype for the Italian media had it not been overshadowed by a few other incidents that weekend...

However we can agree on one thing - the Ferrari back then was indeed a dog...