i dont like these crazy futuristic designs....
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i dont like these crazy futuristic designs....
Actually it was San Jose in 2006 and raced in 2007. First serious test took place weeks before Las Vegas by Roberto Moreno at Sebring.Quote:
Originally Posted by BobGarage
It was a rush job like the Atlantics the year before.
(NO REFERENCE, IMPLIED OR REAL TO ANY POSTER, LIVING, DEAD, or NOT YET BORN.)
I know... "shame on me for remembering the good old days". But remember when there were new car(S!!!) EVERY year? Sometimes the new car from one manufacturer was an evolution of the previous year. Sometimes it was revolutionary. But multiple manufacturers took multiple approaches. But this discussion just reinforces how pathetic this has become, with people hoping that maybe a better looking, better performing (single make spec?) design can be cobbled together in a couple of years, and be launched three seasons from now.
Other than counting my gray hairs, it doesn't get much worse than that.
I agree, you think that an F1 car is a 1.5 year introduction process? Ummm..... No!
Ive said it before, set some design specs and let the manufacturers build a car... then let the teams buy them.
If you want to control cost you set a max amount allowed for the builder to sell the car for. You set a max price for parts. It can be done.
You'd think that if they designed it based on aesthetics the designs would look better than the Dallara...Quote:
Originally Posted by nickfalzone
How wrong we were!
Fresh sheet of paper - design a car around a wingless formula. Make sure the important things are taken care of and then worry about aesthetics. The racing will sell itself a lot better.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vegasguy
If you go that route, you'll end up with one of two scenarios:
a) Car at set price isn't up to the job
or
b) Car is up to the job, but is too expensive for enough teams to purchase.
The highest priority right now is economic control, not getting a kubillion manufacturers competing for limited dollars from a cash strapped pool.
One of the advantages of having a spec series is the costs can be spread out allowing prices of parts to come down from mass production. Panoz would not have been able to produce the DP01 at Champ Car's asking price if they only had 3 teams out of the entire Champ Car paddock purchasing from them. The logistics of hiring personnel on the project and delivering in timely manner would've forced Panoz to raise the price of the car.
Opening up manufacturing of the chassis to multiple vendors is something you do after economic control has been established and teams are back on their feet. That's still a few years away. the next new car needs to be a spec car. After that contract runs out, they'll be able to allow multiple manufacturers to compete.
I think we've already seen wingless designs in other series. they all look alike, and for good reason. If you build something purely for function, chances are it won't look too pretty. that's how the Dallara ended up the way it did.Quote:
Originally Posted by theugsquirrel
GOOD SWEET JEEBUS those student cars were HORRIFIC. There are people (Gordon Murray) and cars, THe McLaren M-16, The Lotus 56 Turbine (my favorite Uhm...Wingless car of all time) the AAR EAGLE OLSONITE LIVERY, that were race cars that were works of art not works of art that become race cars!
Stangely, I see so little drawings and hypthesizing about real possibilities and I would give my uhm...well a lot to see and talk about some ideas even radical, battery powered ones!
How about it?
I do remember...and that's what we need again. I've said this for a couple of years now...we need multiple manufacturers. It adds drama and storylines. When Danica isn't winning a race, and when the race is actually boring, we (and the media) will be able to talk about the performance of different chassis manufacturers, engine producers, and perhaps even different tire makers. What a world it will be!Quote:
Originally Posted by Jag_Warrior
Hey, Doc. Yeah, sweet times, weren't they?
I think as long as everything comes down to cost control (instead of increasing the value), nothing is going to change. Formula car racing is going to require a certain budget, no matter the cost of a chassis or engine lease. But if it's seen as a commodity, the value won't be there to encourage sponsors and others to invest. CCWS found that out the hard way. And (IMO) as long as the IRL relies primarily on Danica and Gene Simmons (or other gimmicks) to bring long term value to the series, it'll be in the same boat.
Personally, I think Grand Am has a pretty good model. I'm not crazy about some of the designs. But they've found a way to affordably get a good number of chassis and engine manufacturers involved... and keep costs in line with the expected returns/value.