New car news!!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DBell

Why can't this be an option? Because that's not what Indycar is about anymore. They are trying to do the Nascar approach where everyone has the same car that is regulated to the hilt. Any advantage one of the engine makers come up with will be quickly neutered so it doesn't have an advantage over the others. This has already happened from what I've read. Lotus claims their engine is 20 pounds lighter than the other 2. IndyCar has already said that they will have to add 20 pounds of ballast to compensate. IndyCar has also stated that the engines will have the same amount of HP. Going back to the chassis, the specs are set with no development allowed except possibly different wing packages in the future. So I don't see how your scenario is going to happen. I could accept your scenario if that were the case, but from what I've read from IndyCar, that isn't what they are trying to do. I see this year as the same as last year, just with a newer car.

You can argue with Ken and Loneranger on the merits of speed and track records, but I think they are clearly right about this- what IndyCar is doing now will do nothing to attract a bigger audience. No more than the DP-01 did anything for CC other than give it a new car that was around the same performance level as the one it replaced.

If we are trying new slogans for IndyCar, then how about this? "IndyCar - same as it ever was"

---

On this point I would agree 100%. IndyCar needs to allow competition between chassis and engines. But that is not what is being argued right now. Speed, pure unadulterated speed, is what is being talked about. You can have competition between chassis, engines, and drivers with or without speed. Speed in-and-of-itself will not attract fans.

"IndyCar: Look we can go really fast, all in a single file line"

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DBell

I have to ask this. Why do some think that the currant car is going to be the end of pack racing? It's going to have less HP on ovals, everyone is going to have the same car, and all indications are it's going to be every bit the momentum car as the last one was. I don't see this as package that is going to end pack racing.

---

The stated goal of the current car is to end pack racing. Increased HP with less DF. Whether that pans out or not is yet to be seen. But that is (or at least was) the goal.

How would pure speed end pack racing? Perhaps that is a question best directed at LR and SF as I am not sure you are on the "pure speed and nothing but speed" bandwagon they are on.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BDunnell

I fail to see why any of this matters, to be honest. Other formulae undergo significant change — take F1 in recent years — without any diminution in the audience. Maybe the mentality of said audience is, in part, what's at fault.

---

Why it matters? Let see, a series that gets worse tv ratings than infomercials, can't get fans to attend oval races even when they give away 80,000 free tickets, and a series where the teams have go after ride buyers to stay afloat. A series where good drivers who should get rides on their talent are passed by because the teams can't actually afford to have to pay drivers for their services. A series that has a lot of trouble attracting sponsors because the ROI is woefully short of the cost it requires. A series that will eventually have to shut down if things don't improve. I'd say it matters.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Loneranger

You are right it makes no sense what so ever, but these guys all seem to think it is the solution. Go figure. Makes you wonder who you are actually conversing with........actually, no it doesn't, I already know who I am conversing with! ;)

If I understand these guys, which unless somebody is going to come in here and say point blank I am wrong and explain to me how I am wrong, these guys want to see a car that you have to lift off the throttle instead of being able to drive flat out through a corner. It's like these guys only seem to think there is one race track next year that we are talking about when in actuality there are only what? Three ovals next year, so for the rest of the year, their flat out scenario doesn't apply.

So somehow they want these guys to need to lift off the throttle and magically make it a more difficult car to drive.

I would love to hear how they propose you accomplish that.

---

Point blank you are wrong.

You have clearly never driven a race car. Or even probably your street car in any sort high speed environment. If you had you would know that a car that is hard to drives means that you MUST lift off the throttle. And if you hadn't been so busy coming up with clever little pictures and YouTube clips, maybe you would have actually had time to read, and understand, our posts. That way you would know that we all want to see drivers more in control of their races. That means the guy that lifts off/brakes the latest going into a corner, and hits the throttle the earliest coming out of a corner. THAT is racing, not who can save the most push to passes for the end, or who can set the latest track record.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DBell

Why it matters? Let see, a series that gets worse tv ratings than infomercials, can't get fans to attend oval races even when they give away 80,000 free tickets, and a series where the teams have go after ride buyers to stay afloat. A series where good drivers who should get rides on their talent are passed by because the teams can't actually afford to have to pay drivers for their services. A series that has a lot of trouble attracting sponsors because the ROI is woefully short of the cost it requires. A series that will eventually have to shut down if things don't improve. I'd say it matters.

---

Again, some people here seem to struggle with the nuances, and with dealing with all the points put to them. Why is the IndyCar audience so fickle compared with the F1 audience?

So Loneranger, are you still sticking to your guns that prior to 1996 IndyCars could go as fast as they wanted all the time? Or since you have CLEARLY ignored that point do you concede that in fact sanctioning bodies have been limiting speeds for decades?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BDunnell

Again, some people here seem to struggle with the nuances, and with dealing with all the points put to them. Why is the IndyCar audience so fickle compared with the F1 audience?

---

But then we don't get to talk about Neeeeew Traaaack Reeeeecords!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by chuck34

But then we don't get to talk about Neeeeew Traaaack Reeeeecords!

---

It leads me to wonder who the 'dumbed-down' ones are — those to whom such records are the be-all and end-all, the only indicators of a decent racing series, or the millions of enthusiasts of series all over the world who don't care two hoots about such things except as statistical curiosities.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DBell

Why it matters? Let see, a series that gets worse tv ratings than infomercials, can't get fans to attend oval races even when they give away 80,000 free tickets, and a series where the teams have go after ride buyers to stay afloat. A series where good drivers who should get rides on their talent are passed by because the teams can't actually afford to have to pay drivers for their services. A series that has a lot of trouble attracting sponsors because the ROI is woefully short of the cost it requires. A series that will eventually have to shut down if things don't improve. I'd say it matters.

---

And a new track record fixes that, exactly how?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by chuck34

Point blank you are wrong.

You have clearly never driven a race car. Or even probably your street car in any sort high speed environment. If you had you would know that a car that is hard to drives means that you MUST lift off the throttle. And if you hadn't been so busy coming up with clever little pictures and YouTube clips, maybe you would have actually had time to read, and understand, our posts. That way you would know that we all want to see drivers more in control of their races. That means the guy that lifts off/brakes the latest going into a corner, and hits the throttle the earliest coming out of a corner. THAT is racing, not who can save the most push to passes for the end, or who can set the latest track record.

---

Point blank I am wrong? Do you even read before you start responding.

What am I wrong about? I said you guys want to see guys need to lift and not be able to drive flat out. How am I wrong about that? I think you need to take some of your own medicine.

!@#$%, I really am on the short bus.....