How good is Sebastien Loeb?

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2nd February 2018, 22:34
AL14

Quote:

Originally Posted by denkimi

i don't know what you are trying to say. your stage analysis proves exactly what i'm saying.

on day 1 he was 17 seconds faster than everyone besides loeb, on day 3 he was 37 seconds faster than everyone besides loeb.
and on day 2? 5th fastest, losing 30 seconds to everyone besides loeb. even without his offs, he still lost 14 seconds to gronholm.

his times on day 2 were clearly slower than those on day 1 and 3. coincidentally he was slower when he was a threat to loeb, and faster when loeb was uncatchable and he was a threat to loebs challenger gronholm.

i could very well be coincidence, but as mintexmemory said, similar story's are being told about sordo, ogier and solberg.

Man, you're really thinking that a legend who won 9 championships straight needed help to beat Duval? Are you really serious about this?
2nd February 2018, 22:49
N.O.T

Quote:

Originally Posted by AL14

Are you really serious about this?

I think he is which is funny and sad at the same time....
2nd February 2018, 22:54
focus206

Quote:

Originally Posted by AL14

Man, you're really thinking that a legend who won 9 championships straight needed help to beat Duval? Are you really serious about this?

Not "just" Duval... but Duval who was without a drive for 8 months... while driving an old Xsara vs the C4 of Loeb. I mean, he did a pretty great rally, but let's remember he managed to win only 1 WRC event in his career (Australia, because every fast driver retired) after years in works teams, because of his many mistakes.
3rd February 2018, 08:05
René

Revisionism is trending right now ! What is this strange disease that grips you, which consists in wanting to constantly rewrite history every time it doesn't suit you?
3rd February 2018, 09:30
A FONDO

Quote:

Originally Posted by AL14

Man, you're really thinking that a legend who won 9 championships straight needed help to beat Duval? Are you really serious about this?

I do.
3rd February 2018, 10:05
Watson

Quote:

Originally Posted by A FONDO

I do.

Dude, Duval got beaten by Märtin almost every round as well and Ford surely didn't have the luxury to sabotage their second driver at the time.
3rd February 2018, 13:59
AL14

Quote:

Originally Posted by A FONDO

I do.

I had no doubt.
3rd February 2018, 14:20
spiderem

pardon me if it has been said here already, but i foresee that the 3 outings Loeb will do this season will provide answers to the question... positive or negative.
3rd February 2018, 14:31
focus206

Quote:

Originally Posted by spiderem

pardon me if it has been said here already, but i foresee that the 3 outings Loeb will do this season will provide answers to the question... positive or negative.

I don't think so... maybe it's just me, but I don't have high expectations on Loeb for these 3 rallies. He has retired in 2012, I see him struggle to get a podium in these events, let alone a win. It doesn't make much sense to rate a driver based on few events he'll compete 6 years after he retired.
3rd February 2018, 15:32
dimviii

Quote:

Originally Posted by spiderem

pardon me if it has been said here already, but i foresee that the 3 outings Loeb will do this season will provide answers to the question... positive or negative.

what answers will provide?
3rd February 2018, 15:37
denkimi

Quote:

Originally Posted by AL14

Man, you're really thinking that a legend who won 9 championships straight needed help to beat Duval? Are you really serious about this?

can you believe someone who won 7 tours de france needed doping to help him beat basso or klöden?

when duval said he wasn't treaded fair, i didn't believe it because he seemed like a bad loser. when the same story's where told about sordo, i didn't believe them because he seemed just to slow. when petter said kinda the same thing, i also didn't believe it.

but since i've seen how ogier got treated when he was a threat to loeb, i believe it all to be true.
for me, loeb is the best rally driver ever. but as Mintexmemory said, he isn't the nice guy some believe him to be.
he didn't wanted to win fair, he just wanted to win. and he had no problem with sabotaging his team members if they didn't wanted to listen to team orders an let him take the win.
3rd February 2018, 15:49
dimviii

Quote:

Originally Posted by denkimi

but since i've seen how ogier got treated when he was a threat to loeb, i believe it all to be true. .

how was treated?
3rd February 2018, 16:08
focus206

Quote:

Originally Posted by denkimi

can you believe someone who won 7 tours de france needed doping to help him beat basso or klöden?

when duval said he wasn't treaded fair, i didn't believe it because he seemed like a bad loser. when the same story's where told about sordo, i didn't believe them because he seemed just to slow. when petter said kinda the same thing, i also didn't believe it.

but since i've seen how ogier got treated when he was a threat to loeb, i believe it all to be true.
for me, loeb is the best rally driver ever. but as Mintexmemory said, he isn't the nice guy some believe him to be.
he didn't wanted to win fair, he just wanted to win. and he had no problem with sabotaging his team members if they didn't wanted to listen to team orders an let him take the win.

Yet, I've never heard Loeb complain particularly when he had to retire or was beaten by his rivals, he never sounded like someone who wants to win no matter what. Also, judging that he's not a "nice guy" not by what he says, but by some rumors that Citroen would have handicapped other Citroen drivers to give Loeb single rally wins is laughable.
Do you really believe that Loeb would have asked Citroen to mess around with the cars of Sordo, Duval and Solberg, who where absolutely nowhere near him in the championship classification and in pace in 90% of the rounds, just to win a single event for each case? I'm sorry, but this sounds absolutely ridicolous...
3rd February 2018, 18:41
spiderem

Quote:

Originally Posted by dimviii

what answers will provide?

Well let say he gets a podium on his first event (Mexico?), then one could easily say that it is an amizing performance considering it's his first outing in the new generation car and he hasn't been competing in rally for few seasons. Hence yes sebastien Loeb was and is really good.
Let say he finishes 8th or 9th, then one could say, yes Loeb was the best driver of his era for sure, but every era has its own best driver...
3rd February 2018, 19:11
Watson

Quote:

Originally Posted by spiderem

pardon me if it has been said here already, but i foresee that the 3 outings Loeb will do this season will provide answers to the question... positive or negative.

I don't think so. I think he will struggle and that will simply be explained by being absent for too long, not having the experience in the car that most of the other drivers have, lack of incentive and a general motivation not to put the car into a ditch.

He's pretty much a tourist driver like Kremer, Serderidis, the Sheikh and Bertelli.
5th February 2018, 23:54
Zico

Quote:

Originally Posted by Watson

I don't think so. I think he will struggle and that will simply be explained by being absent for too long, not having the experience in the car that most of the other drivers have, lack of incentive and a general motivation not to put the car into a ditch.

He's pretty much a tourist driver like Kremer, Serderidis, the Sheikh and Bertelli.

Yes, I think so too.

If Meeke is to be believed, the Citroen is also lagging behind in development compared to Toyota, Ford and Hyundai. Some might say Kris is just blaming the car for his mediocre Monte performance... but even just looking at the car, Aero development at very least, still looks waaay behind on the C3 compared to the others, especially Toyota.

I don't expect Seb to be very competitive, but that in no way detracts from how good he clearly was/is.
6th February 2018, 10:06
Marcco

Quote:

Originally Posted by spiderem

pardon me if it has been said here already, but i foresee that the 3 outings Loeb will do this season will provide answers to the question... positive or negative.

Pardon me but, if he fails to deliver good result, you can't blame him, he is out of WRC for 6 years now, the cars has changed, he got older etc etc etc. but if he delivers... well he is a legend (but we already know this) :) So all in all couple outings after 6 years of absence in WRC means nothing, just nothing :)
6th February 2018, 14:02
ESTR

My crystal ball says that he will get lucky and most of guys will retire or make some minor mistakes. He will be there slowly behid and climbing to the top.
6th February 2018, 15:23
er88

Quote:

Originally Posted by ESTR

My crystal ball says that he will get lucky and most of guys will retire or make some minor mistakes. He will be there slowly behid and climbing to the top.

He's certainly chosen the 3 events wisely, where the car generally worked well last year and the team will have good data/setups.

Would be great to see him challenge at the top but the fact he's even back for these events is the main thing. Will be a great extra buzz for the WRC.

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk
27th February 2018, 02:49
Zeakiwi

The question might be 'How good is Loeb at 43 years of age in a wrc citroen rally car'?
I'm more concerned for Elena after his dakar problems.
27th February 2018, 05:17
racerx1979

If Loeb nails a few good stages and is within the top 3 as far as times are concerned I will say he still has it.
27th February 2018, 05:46
AnttiL

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zeakiwi

The question might be 'How good is Loeb at 43 years of age in a wrc citroen rally car'?

He just turned 44.
9th March 2018, 22:07
Zico

After 5 stages he is sitting a solid 3rd overall, I was not expecting that, maybe the upper half of the top ten at best. To even be even competitive after so long out speaks volumes and shows just how good Loeb was... and still is. Incredible!
10th March 2018, 02:57
KiwiWRCfan

Can an administrator please change word "was" to "is" in the thread title.
I did not expect to see a stage win, I did not expect to see a top 5 overall result,.
Can anyone give me directions to an edible hat shop. I need to prepare a meal for myself.
10th March 2018, 03:41
pino

How good is Sebastien Loeb?

Topic title changed :)
10th March 2018, 10:21
AL14

Quote:

Originally Posted by KiwiWRCfan

Can an administrator please change word "was" to "is" in the thread title.
I did not expect to see a stage win, I did not expect to see a top 5 overall result,.
Can anyone give me directions to an edible hat shop. I need to prepare a meal for myself.

I think we should also remove that question mark
10th March 2018, 11:07
AnttiL

Quote:

Originally Posted by racerx1979

If Loeb nails a few good stages and is within the top 3 as far as times are concerned I will say he still has it.

Yup.
10th March 2018, 11:14
dimviii

any news from this interview ?
https://youtu.be/fwlUDWy5bQY
10th March 2018, 11:25
A FONDO

Slower than Sordo on gravel (Sordo on gravel!) despite perfect road position http://yoursmiles.org/ssmile/fun/s0205.gif
10th March 2018, 11:47
Rallyper

Quote:

Originally Posted by Watson

I don't think so. I think he will struggle and that will simply be explained by being absent for too long, not having the experience in the car that most of the other drivers have, lack of incentive and a general motivation not to put the car into a ditch.

He's pretty much a tourist driver like Kremer, Serderidis, the Sheikh and Bertelli.

Oohh. So you say that. But it was before the magic day... :)

Tourist? No matter how it ends: Naahhh. ;) ;)
10th March 2018, 12:16
dimviii

Michel V.
Also 72 rallies in a row he won at least one stage : from Germany '04 until Sardegna '09. (I excluded the 4 rallies in '06 he missed through injury)
12th March 2018, 14:23
Jarek Z

Quote:

Originally Posted by Watson

I think he will struggle and that will simply be explained by being absent for too long, not having the experience in the car that most of the other drivers have, lack of incentive and a general motivation not to put the car into a ditch.

He's pretty much a tourist driver like Kremer, Serderidis, the Sheikh and Bertelli.

A tourist?! What will you say about the regular WRC drivers, who couldn't keep up Loeb's pace then? ;)
12th March 2018, 14:51
Jarek Z

A typical tourist ;)

https://scontent-frx5-1.xx.fbcdn.net...8c&oe=5B0446C6
12th March 2018, 15:02
Coach 2

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jarek Z

A tourist?! What will you say about the regular WRC drivers, who couldn't keep up Loeb's pace then? ;)

I can ask you FIRST, don't you think the discussion will END up with something to do with their NOSE.
12th March 2018, 15:29
sindroms

How good is he? Excellent rally driver bad bike rider :D
(Old joke of course related to 2006)
13th March 2018, 16:15
dimviii

another record we havent mention

From July 2005 (Argentina) to April 2012 (Argentina) Seb Loeb and Daniel Elena were unbeaten on Latin American soil. They won all 13 WRC rounds held in Central and South America over this 6 years and 9 month period.
https://rallysportmag.com/6-and-13-r...c-stats130318/
13th March 2018, 20:24
danon

We just know who is The Maestro. His wife knows how good is he.

https://media.giphy.com/media/fCUTGg...VdSs/giphy.gif
9th April 2018, 12:16
Rallyper

Well, no tourist he is ...
10th April 2018, 09:36
Mintexmemory

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rallyper

Well, no tourist he is ...

Still got the natural talent but the reflexes and concentration appear to have faded - one more event to come and I stick to my prediction of no podium from the project. It would have been great to see a full season battle in 2014 but it seems that while SL is capable of better pace over any given stage than most of the current drivers it is no longer within a comfort zone of driving.
10th April 2018, 09:46
EstWRC

i think we can close this thread now? no?

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