maybe ioan has finally seen the light :laugh:Quote:
Originally Posted by ojciec dyrektor
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maybe ioan has finally seen the light :laugh:Quote:
Originally Posted by ojciec dyrektor
Mark, anything interesting that Alonso is saying?
That leave Fisichella or possibly Sutil (FI still owes ferrari, right)?Quote:
Originally Posted by Easy Drifter
I feel sorry for your Ferrari blindness.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hawkmoon
WT
It's always the race engineer who have to do this.Quote:
Originally Posted by DazzlaF1
And the race engineers are the people who have the closest relationship with the drivers.
Imagine you have to tell your best friend to do something you, and he, don't agree with just because the management favors someone else.
$100,000 fine
I couldn't care less about what you think. :DQuote:
Originally Posted by ojciec dyrektor
What? You sure you didn't forget the additional 000 for bringing the sport into disrepute?Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Brockman
This is a joke. They've got a million fine back in 2002.
No. Money buys wins. That's the moral of today's story, children. You can cheat so long as you're rich.
A report is being sent to the World Motorsport Council, but result unchanged... for now.
I hope both Massa and Smedley leave soon, maybe they can attempt to win in Hungary and then give them the finger.Quote:
Originally Posted by Easy Drifter
Any team on the grid would sign them without thinking, just imagine the wealth of knowledge Smedley would bring with him.
#Quote:
Originally Posted by ioan
Agreed (again!!). On BBC digital Eddie Jordan has said quite clearly that when he gave team orders at Spa to stop Ralf overtaking Damon he was the one who told Ralf - not expecting the engineer to do the dirty work
Do Ferrari management really think they don't just look like the bunch of cheap liars that they are?
Only Massa and Smedley come out with any credit - exposing the truth and then bowing to the inevitable team-speak
WT
Fines mean nothing at all. Disqualification was the only punishment which would mean anything.
Where is Max when you need him?Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Brockman
For perspective, the fine was one-tenth of the £1 million they were fined in 2002 when team orders per se weren't illegal, but they breached podium etiquette.
about as effective as wheeling in Julian Clary to say "ooh, you naughty boys, don't do it again or i'll spank you"
I hope that is your comment rather than the outcome!Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Brockman
If it really is a $100k fine the stewards have failed in their responsibility to uphold the rules.
Come on McLaren, Red Bull , .......anyone apart from Alonso now
WT
They shouldn't have given in.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wasted Talent
Sooner or later, I suspect sooner, they will both be pushed out anyway.
Once you bend over you lose your integrity both in your and your boss' eyes and he will not want you around anymore once this happens, for plenty of reasons.
100,000?
So that's the equivalent of a roll of toilet paper for us?
The minimum should have been total disqualification from the race for both driver and team and probation till the end of the season.
What a joke.
DC said the same during the race too, Denis made the calls not his engineer.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wasted Talent
This means that Domenicali is not only a crappy team manager but also the biggest coward on the pit wall.Quote:
Originally Posted by Koz
for sure, but I suspicion the real problem was or is how stupid ferrari was about this.....Smedley must have caught hell from Stevo and LucaQuote:
Originally Posted by Dave Brockman
.
So Freddie is smiling and leaving the meeting with high fives and massa is looking as glum as ever, as though he just did hari-kari for good of the team......so now they have to say massa is a liar when he was in the meeting with the stewards to punish anyone or they can just accept it and move on. My guess is the latter :rolleyes:
as to the team orders, forget not when Jensen was told to save fuel so as to stop the tusssle between him and Lewis....and I am sure there have been other such moments with other teams, but they are just not have been as stupid as ferrari.
Put the big body slam on them and this might stop even the more subtle games....outside of Singapore, I can not think of one time there has been a penalty :confused:
If You want to penalize everybody You should remember that Felipe Massa is adult man, who made decision to gave away his place to Alonso. Team wasn't asking for it, Alonso wasn't asking for it. They only told him that he is slower. Massa made a decision. He's not a child, slave or a dog. He has his own intellect, reason, understanding ability and free will.
He did it, because he wanted to. End of story. ;p
Well, the stewards don't have the power to throw Ferrari out of the championship. That's reserved to the WMSC themselves.
They *could*, however, have given a retroactive drive-through/stop-go (+20/+30s), grid penalties in Hungary, DQed them or banned them for X races.
Instead, they've basically passed the buck up the line.
penalise Ferrari if you must, but why Alonso, apart from you dislike the guy?Quote:
Originally Posted by Koz
a joke indeed... dock it off Smedley's wages :p
WTF!!!! a 100,000 fine???
Huh, never would have thought that...guess they were willing to do a Monaco Qing and look behind what the driver said....
But a 100K???
So what?
It is like that 10k fine on Lewis for running out of gas at the end of Qfing
Ferrari spends a 100k for hospitality at each race...guess that means the lunchs crowds will be a little smaller for a couple of races
at least they have decided that Ferrari were wrong, they did break the rules and they have not drawn a line under it. I, however, Expect the WMSC to do pretty much bugger all about it now, but i hope they take the hardline. Take their constructors points at the very least.
But above all, they have been found guilty of breaching the team orders rule and of bringing the sport into disrepute. and rightly so, hopefully more will follow, when do the WMSC next meet?
I wonder what your stance would be if as many of you wish Alonso's team mate was Kubica?!Quote:
Originally Posted by ojciec dyrektor
BTW, this was a rhetorical question.
my 2 cents? The anger (certainly on my part) is the bare faced lies we have to put up with. Fernando (the worst culprit - anyone still in any doubt that he knew all about crashgate is blind), Smedle & Domenicalli. The only one trying to have a little dignity is Massa himself.
Well say he goes on to win the championship by a couple of points - points which he was gifted by an illegal action. How would that be fair?Quote:
Originally Posted by donKey jote
He's already been allowed to keep one fake "win" in his career, to win two races as a result of team cheating would be a disgrace.
"as many of you"?
I thought there was only one ojciec director :eek: :crazy:
Whenever it is summoned.Quote:
Originally Posted by Robinho
The question is why do we need stewards if they can not take any decision related to a race incident.
its funny how the bad smell seems to be following Fernando around wherever he goes, he seems to be the catalyst in all of the controversies
Poor guy, he sure must feel very down right now.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonic
How true.Quote:
Originally Posted by Robinho
sure, and I won the lottery last week......but that is the difference, it is very hard to prove it, unlike here, where it was so slap your faceQuote:
Originally Posted by henners88
People, again, the US$100k *is not the end of the matter*. The stewards not only found them guilty, they passed the buck up to the WMSC, who can impose further penalties (up to and including the penalty given to McLaren over "spygate", since Ferrari were found guilty of the same "bringing the sport into disreptute" offense).
The German GP result stands, unfortunately - but since they've been found guilty and sent upstairs pending further punishment, they've got more pain to come.
It's also telling how he's fast picking up a reputation of not being able to handle having a team mate who challenges him.Quote:
Originally Posted by Robinho
So what should he have done, missed a few gears and stayed behind Massa to get in trouble with Vettel?Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Brockman
Team cheating, disgrace, scum...
I get the feeling some of you are getting a bit carried away simply because it's Alonso :)
If Massa was so much slower, and Alonso was in danger from Seb while stuck behind Massa, then why didn't SV get Massa before the end of the race?
The whole excuse was balderdash.
Great commentQuote:
Originally Posted by Wasted Talent
Strangely if the Team Orders present today was Ferrari telling Alonso to hold position and not try to pass the slower Massa, nobody would be up at arms!!!
The way I see it, Vettel managed to finish less then 2 seconds behind, which means it would be dumb to have Alonso stay behind Massa, and would be better if the 2 Ferraris to refrain from have a serious on track battle for position with Vettel in a position to take advantage.
I haven't read ferrari's whole race transcript to know whether Massa was given the opportunity to pick up the pace prior to being told Alonso was faster.
I also like how everyone is getting on Alonso for his "ridiculous" comment when he was just as liking commenting on the traffic as he was about massa holding him up... After todays race his "How is Massa? " question gained him some respect in my books...
I'll just assume this board is just right full of McLeran fan's who where hoping for a repeat of Turkey, but in Ferrari colors.
Absolute disgrace - I turned the TV off immediately when I saw what was happening. Luckily I also tuned back in for the press conference which was great fun.
I probably won't make the effort to watch next weekend's race anymore, it wouldn't have been easy to anyway as I'm out but I probably would have found a pub or something. I simply won't bother anymore.
More like "how is he after we shafted him?". Any respect I had for Alonso went out the window today.Quote:
Originally Posted by PSfan