Agreed. Tamburello definitely thinks that Senna is a reincarnation of Hitler. FACT.Quote:
Originally Posted by elis
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Agreed. Tamburello definitely thinks that Senna is a reincarnation of Hitler. FACT.Quote:
Originally Posted by elis
That much is apparent :)Quote:
Originally Posted by elis
And now we're well and truly derailed, aren't we..Quote:
Originally Posted by ArrowsFA1
Perhaps this should be about Senna after all, and not a pissing contest between the Troll Coalition and the Anti-Troll Coalition? :)
There have been many good contributions to this thread. Actual memories and impressions, by fans (say, Jag_Warrior) and non-fans (say, BDunnel) alike. I don't agree with Tintop, in that I think there's no need to overlook Senna's faults in this thread, "a memorial thread on the anniversary of his violent death" though it may be.
But equally, I fail to see the value in a certain forumer's endless mantra of "Senna sucked", delivered at times in truly offensive manner.
So back to memories of Senna, perhaps? ;) Maybe even some new ones, from people who haven't posted here yet!
I see we have had a serious clash here. Separate threads are probably the best solution in this case.
Hmm... :)Quote:
Originally Posted by studiose
My "memories" about Senna derive from videos/books/articles as during his lifetime I knew nothing about him. So I don't have exact emotions or feelings about him and his racing. But all kinds of available information plus films of "The Right to Win" and "Racing is in My Blood" certainly create a very interesting vision of him. A person, who I'd have certainly liked to meet.
We all know his ruthlessness, but what is great, is that he tried to explain his attitude and racing philosophy as well as possible, making it quite comprehensible to me, so in the end there really isn't anything annoying about him. Only the situation at Suzuka '90 is for me, what I really don't approve in any way. Even Schumacher's antics and acts of desperation seemed more logical. But in the end - doesn't matter as so much time is past. We have had more interesting situations/characters in the sport and of course - more to discuss about. :)
Thanks Jens, that's a good contribution. :cool:Quote:
Originally Posted by jens
About Suzuka '90... I think it was an act of a man who perceived that he had been grossly injusticed by the events that occurred before. The year before at Suzuka - in the title-deciding race -, Senna and Prost collided. Prost stepped out of his car, while Senna (with the help of marshalls) continued and - in his mind - won the race. Only to be prevented from going to the podium by the, then, FIA boss Balestre (a Frenchman like Prost, one might add), and later disqualified.
And in the qualifying for Suzuka '90 - another title-deciding race - it had been agreed before qualifying that the starting lanes would be switched, so that the pole-sitter would start from the clean side. Senna got pole and then, at the last minute, FIA's Ballestre decided that the starting lanes would not be switched after all...
And then Senna decided that if Prost, from P2, would get in front of him at the start, he would not "concede the corner"...
It was clearly wrong. I'm not saying it was right. But I hope you can see his reasoning for what he did...
----
Here's the thing in his own words.
[youtube]Fef6blfYvrw[/youtube]
Now that the thread has (rightly — for which thanks) been reopened, I hope studiose won't mind me posting a comment that I ended up sending him by PM, as the thread had just been locked before I finished typing it as a post.Quote:
Originally Posted by studiose
In response to the above, I certainly wouldn't class myself as a 'non-fan' of Senna. I continue to have the highest regard for what he did when he was at his best. Watching him in those circumstances was, as I said earlier, a privilege. Of those who came before Senna, I would put him (and indeed Prost) on a par with Fangio, Moss, Clark and Stewart. But, in my opinion, none of their careers were tarnished by one particular incident in the same way as was Senna's.
Indeed, and that's fair, I think. And I also wouldn't put Senna in the same class as a GP driver as, say, Fangio and Clark, because of the bad things he did on the track (as I also said in the PM to BDunnell).Quote:
Originally Posted by BDunnell
Sure enough, he had his reasoning and that's good (I'm still waiting, what has MS to say about his Monaco '06 for example :p :) . But in any case it's difficult to approve that deed as it seemed like a blatant revenge, which was largely led by emotions. But from his point of view, it was an 'easy' solution to the championship by using the "winning at any cost" concept. In this respect I think he was fortunate that we didn't have as strict rules then as we have now as I suppose it's highly likely a driver would get DQ'd from the championship after a similar manouver nowadays.Quote:
Originally Posted by studiose
I think that's right. But Senna was/is best characterized by the indomitable will/need to win, isn't he. More so than any other driver ever, I think. And occasionally, that indomitable will/need to win led to behaviour that just wasn't/isn't acceptable...Quote:
Originally Posted by jens
He probably couldn't help it - it was just a part of his nature he couldn't always control.
I don't think he was ever purposefully unfair/unsporting though. I really do think he was essentially a good man. Off and on the track.. It's just that his very strong emotions sometimes got the better of his very strong mind...
I love it how some (mostly prost/ferrari) fans cry about Suzuka 1990, but omit to mention how that little bitch prost tried to ram out Senna the year before at the same race and when he couldnt do it properly, he had to get his asshole friend Balestre to finish the job for him. I personally, after the treatment Senna had at Suzuka both of these years, would have done the same he did, floored it and made sure Prost was out of the race. In fact, I remember myself laughing and being quite happy about what Senna did, justice was done.
As for the irvine incident, I would have hit him too, but I would like to think I would have made a better job of it and I doubt he would have ever been that arrogant again.