The Ferrari thread !

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Originally Posted by SGWilko

So, what you mean is;

Had Massa broken the rule on first asking, it'd be all fine and dandy?

What was Smeldley's tone on the radio transmissions we did not hear?

You have to remember that Alonso's superior speed was engineered by the team.........

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No , he only got all pi$$y about it when he had it suggested to him the third time .
That is obviously why we didn't get to hear the first transmissions . They weren't as newsy .
That's why Smedley asked him to confirm he understood the message . He had been asked twice before .

And , no , he wasn't asked to move over . That would be breaking the rules .
He was told , as is required here in stupid rule land , that his team mate was faster .

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Originally Posted by markabilly

Given that press release, I think Massa's stay at Ferrari will not be much longer, and if he lines up another competitive drive before the end of the season, then we may see Massa not so willing to be in the role of move over, red rover

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The role of team player is important to any boss .

His worth when he leaves Ferrari will be great , as any look in for other teams pays off in at least the fine detail of methods used directly relating to the driver , if not other details of difference around the car as well .

If he leaves under a cloud , he would also be highly motivated to beat them , which is also an asset .

But , to defy one's employer , and not "move over , red rover" , when it is suggested they work for a team , is a poor reputation to have .

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Originally Posted by henners88

When you have drivers who are happy to lie in order to gain a position, drivers who try to blackmail a team when they are not being given number one status, or drivers who are happy to run others off the road for a WDC, I doubt dragging out the time to obey a team order is going to be much of a dent in a drivers CV. If the driver is considered good or valuable enough by a team they will employ him what ever IMO. Drivers have done alot worse in the past, and apart from the forums still going over the same old waffle, the drivers themselves seem to have moved on from the whole saga.

This latest incident (over two moths ago) has been analysed to death. Its either strengthened peoples opinions about their favourite driver or team, or done totally the opposite.

"I've been doing this for 12 years now, so please bear with me a moment while I plaster on a fake smile and plow through this sh!t one more time..." Bill Hicks. :)

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Don't be so harsh. At least Ferrari didn't ask Felipe to crash his car in order for Fred to win the race. Now we all know it's against the rules but I"M SURE other teams have used this tactic before.

Wait a minute ! Wasn't it last used where Fred came from? Never mind, that never happened, carry on. :s mokin:

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Originally Posted by SGWilko

What I am now convinced of, is that there was a lot of behind the scenes shenanigans orchestrated by Alonso during his short stay at McLaren.

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WOW!! And I am here thinking that Alonso was just a driver hired by McLaren. I had no idea he instead took over McLaren as soon as he got to Ron's office. Took his decision power away, plotted against LH, huis mechanics and engineers, and took all the Ferrari projects. Then, he had them installed on the "red-silver arrows" and still behind everyone back. And in all this time Ron & Co. were clueless of Alonso's actions. (It's true. They can be so naive at times. Especially Ron.

And then, when the whole team got caught cheating and lying, Ron made sure to apologize about the whole thing making sure Alonso would stay out of the whole story and then happily paid the huge fine).

Now, let me tell you an other little story. This time this story is based on facts, not on maliciouness. This story is about his "holyness" LH caught lying and cheating several times and barely punished for his proven misdeeds. To date no one has accused Alonso with prove at hand that he has been involved in anything illegal. Not even a ticket from the police in Australia. Not once. And these are facts. Now you can continue bad mouthing anyone you want to just for the .....fun of it. :) You are too much man :) :)

PS I know you think that FA must also be behind Piquet attempt murder. But so far........the darnest thing....not a prove. How disappointing that must be.

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Originally Posted by Bagwan

Had Massa done as suggested , when first suggested , they would not have broken any rule .

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Any driver on track knows that they can yield a position to any other driver on track at any time. You can call it what you want, but the team even suggesting that Felipe move over to allow Alonso to pass is putting pressure on him and suggesting team orders.

Felipe already knew he could move if he was under pressure. Strange that the real pressure didn't exist until Ferrari instructed drivers to change settings, then stated Felipe was slower.

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Originally Posted by airshifter

Any driver on track knows that they can yield a position to any other driver on track at any time. You can call it what you want, but the team even suggesting that Felipe move over to allow Alonso to pass is putting pressure on him and suggesting team orders.

Felipe already knew he could move if he was under pressure. Strange that the real pressure didn't exist until Ferrari instructed drivers to change settings, then stated Felipe was slower.

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As the FIA as stated, this issue is a "non issue" really. And I don't understand why getting so upset ove Ferrari's "wrongdoing" and not discussing even bigger and important issues such as RB flexi wings. This subject got momentum when it looked like Ferrari could have been involved somehow with "cheating". But as soon as people saw that it was actually RB, and McLaren I might add, at fault rather than Ferrari, then the whole thing lost all that attention. So rather than discussing what recently LH questioned, which is "HAS RB CHEATED ALL THE WAY THROUGH THIS CHAMPIONSHIP", the so called F1 fans are trying to drag Ferrari in to the mud talking about issues that have been already resolved and found Ferrari not at fault or maybe at fault.......but as much as everyone else.

PS This post is not directed specifically to you, Airshifter.

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Originally Posted by Rodster

Doesn't surprise me at all which is why Massa would have been happier with himself if he waved the middle finger as he drove by the pit wall and took home the win. As I said before Ferrari has taken on the personality of Alonso.

I don't expect Ferrari to make a move or hint about a Massa move until the season is over just for that reason alone.

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You obviously assume that Alonso could not have passed him. I wouldn't bet on that. And then there is the Monaco incident where Massa wouldn't get out of the way of JV so he got punted off the road. Massa is clearly not a team player and I would dump him. I am spending 300 million and paying a driver millions and I am going to have a driver telling me what they will do? I think not. The spring must have caused some underlying damage!

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Originally Posted by Roamy

I am spending 300 million and paying a driver millions and I am going to have a driver telling me what they will do? I think not. The spring must have caused some underlying damage!

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Excactly, here most are forgetting (or wants to forget) that when a driver signs for Ferrari, he's told that the Team is above everything and everyone must work for the same target : Ferrari's success. That's been Ferrari strategy for years and years and if a driver don't accept that then Ferrari isn't the Team to sign for. As for Massa, if he leaves he might only find a seat at Toro Rosso, Williams or Force India, he knows that, and that's why he will stay at Ferrari no matter what.

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Originally Posted by Rodster

You don't need to go any further than Monaco 2007. Remember Lewis was leading Fred and that abruptly changed and Fred took the win. Remember the press briefing where Lewis sort of looked like Felipe after the Germany race. And Fred said he told the team to tell Lewis "let me through". And Lewis had the look like he was about to kill somebody. Another example was Indy same year and Fred was so pissed at Lewis leading the race which he won btw that Fred in anger drove his car towards the pit wall because Lewis wouldn't hand over the lead.

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:laugh: alternative history? :laugh: if you insist to come uninvited to a place where you are not welcome just to annoy people you should at least have the decency not to make up facts. at Monaco FA dominated all free practice sessions but one, qualified first and won the race (i might be wrong but I think it was after leading the whole race) and posted the fastest lap of the race... the conspiracy happened only in Hamilton's head. The only thing that happened was that the team told the drivers not to race each other and secure the 1-2... only the slow witted Hamilton thought he could pass Alonso in an equal car at Monaco... the last couple of races show that brain didn't catch much speedr yet and that McLarn were wise not to let jeopardize the whole race... if they had stayed that wise the whole year they would have won the wdc easily

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Originally Posted by henners88

Using data obtained through theft is pretty serious and it may be a shock to you, but it was proven that he had this data, for which he stood on the witness stand and admitted it!. FACT. Ron Dennis having knowledge of his teams deceit is not fact, yet you are happy to pass it off as just that to support your incredibly biased bashing, Pathetic. Its on record my friend of what Fernando's involvement in that sorry sag but there is no proof to support Ron's involvement at all.. :rolleyes:

What makes me laugh is Ferrari fans still having a cheap dig about Spygate, yet are happy to support one of the main suspects in that sorry case who now happens to be Ferrari's number one driver. Wake up :D

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Alonso had no choice. McLaren tried to show the data to Lewis but the regs changed before he got passed the first 2 pages.

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Originally Posted by pino

Excactly, here most are forgetting (or wants to forget) that when a driver signs for Ferrari, he's told that the Team is above everything and everyone must work for the same target : Ferrari's success. That's been Ferrari strategy for years and years and if a driver don't accept that then Ferrari isn't the Team to sign for. As for Massa, if he leaves he might only find a seat at Toro Rosso, Williams or Force India, he knows that, and that's why he will stay at Ferrari no matter what.

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Good post Pino :up:
However I'm afraid you are howling in the wilderness! :dozey:

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Originally Posted by Tazio

Good post Pino :up:
However I'm afraid you are howling in the wilderness! :dozey:

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In Italy we say : Hope is the last thing which dies ;)

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Originally Posted by pino

Excactly, here most are forgetting (or wants to forget) that when a driver signs for Ferrari, he's told that the Team is above everything and everyone must work for the same target : Ferrari's success. That's been Ferrari strategy for years and years and if a driver don't accept that then Ferrari isn't the Team to sign for. As for Massa, if he leaves he might only find a seat at Toro Rosso, Williams or Force India, he knows that, and that's why he will stay at Ferrari no matter what.

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Same goes for my "no toilet" employee .

She can go work at McDonalds .

FFS

McLaren had Ferrari data

Alonso was implicated and tried to Blackmail Ron Dennis

Lewis told a Porky Pie at Melbourne

Ferrari ordered Massa to let Alonso past

Bagwan regrets bringing his Restaurant into the discussion

Ferrari are no better or worse these days than any other team as far as ethics go and will get away with whatever they can the same as they, and everyone else would. Just so happens they're banged to rights on the ole team orders fiasco but that's been done to death now.

Lets move on?

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Originally Posted by skc

FFS

McLaren had Ferrari data

Alonso was implicated and tried to Blackmail Ron Dennis

Lewis told a Porky Pie at Melbourne

Ferrari ordered Massa to let Alonso past

Bagwan regrets bringing his Restaurant into the discussion

Ferrari are no better or worse these days than any other team as far as ethics go and will get away with whatever they can the same as they, and everyone else would. Just so happens they're banged to rights on the ole team orders fiasco but that's been done to death now.

Lets move on?

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Just one more thing - Massa cleans the loo on every third Wednesday, capiche?

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Originally Posted by SGWilko

Just one more thing - Massa cleans the loo on every third Wednesday, capiche?

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Massa knews that before signing for Ferrari, capische ? ;)

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Originally Posted by skc

FFS

McLaren had Ferrari data

Alonso was implicated and tried to Blackmail Ron Dennis

Lewis told a Porky Pie at Melbourne

Ferrari ordered Massa to let Alonso past

Bagwan regrets bringing his Restaurant into the discussion

Ferrari are no better or worse these days than any other team as far as ethics go and will get away with whatever they can the same as they, and everyone else would. Just so happens they're banged to rights on the ole team orders fiasco but that's been done to death now.

Lets move on?

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I'd say , actually , that it is the toilet that i regret .
It got the discussion off topic .

It is the disruption within the team which is the most regrettable issue in any situation where one or more people are seen to be acting for only self-interest .

I want to say also , that now that the disruptive employee is gone , we have a great team .
We have people who think on thier feet , and look at the big picture , not just the toilet .


If they change the rules and allow team orders , we needn't mention toilets ever again .
Unless , of course , there is controversy over the change to low flow-dual flush units , but that come under hydrodynamics , not aerodynamics , so it should be ok . I'll have to check with the authorities .

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Originally Posted by Roamy

You obviously assume that Alonso could not have passed him. I wouldn't bet on that.

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He should have passed him because Felipe's car was dialed back and Fred's was not. It's like a Mini Cooper trying to hold back a BMW M5. If Fred is sooo much better than Felipe then then was no reason for the chirade, making the #2 driver's car slower to allow the team leaders car to go faster. IOW Fred's skillz should have overcome the slower pace of his teammate.

But he couldn't and so team orders were imposed to allow the great one the victory. :s mokin:

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Originally Posted by Rodster

But he couldn't and so team orders were imposed to allow the great one the victory. :s mokin:

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And of course, we have seen little snippets of what happens when 'his lordship' does not get his own way........

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Originally Posted by Rodster

He should have passed him because Felipe's car was dialed back and Fred's was not. It's like a Mini Cooper trying to hold back a BMW M5. If Fred is sooo much better than Felipe then then was no reason for the chirade, making the #2 driver's car slower to allow the team leaders car to go faster. IOW Fred's skillz should have overcome the slower pace of his teammate.

But he couldn't and so team orders were imposed to allow the great one the victory. :s mokin:

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Ferrari were sensible not to suffer a dangerous situation like Red Bull in Turkey. All this whining is so stupid.

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Originally Posted by Dave B

The big difference, though, is that team orders never used to be illegal. Ferrari chose to make Schumacher their number one, drivers like Irvine and Barrichello knew the score in advance. Now Massa, bless him, beleives he has equality when it's plain for the world to see that he does not.

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Barrichello has often claimed that it wasn't written in his contract that he was a #2 and hence he felt kinda reluctant, when he was asked to move over in the interest of the championship. Like Massa now.

It was a different story with Irvine - he had a clear contract with #2 written in it and was helping Schumacher as much as possible with great pleasure, having little ambitions by himself. Back in the day it looked like he was taking being a No.2 driver and as a result creating headaches to rival team drivers as part of fun and his life motto. :p :

I remember Rubens saying when he first went to Ferrari:

" I am not the number 2 driver, just 1B" :dozey:

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Originally Posted by henners88

Interesting I had no idea Lewis had been accused and caught more than on one occasion. Please could you list the other occasions when Lewis had been caught cheating and not punished. :confused:

Hmmm. *Scratches chin*

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I did not write LH was not punished. I wrote "barely punished".

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Originally Posted by henners88

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/spo...cle2454154.ece
Using data obtained through theft is pretty serious and it may be a shock to you, but it was proven that he had this data, for which he stood on the witness stand and admitted it!. FACT. Ron Dennis having knowledge of his teams deceit is not fact, yet you are happy to pass it off as just that to support your incredibly biased bashing, Pathetic. Its on record my friend of what Fernando's involvement in that sorry sag but there is no proof to support Ron's involvement at all.. :rolleyes:

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Everyone was implicated at McLaren. But it does not mean guilty. That's why he nor LH did not get punished

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Originally Posted by henners88

What makes me laugh is Ferrari fans still having a cheap dig about Spygate, yet are happy to support one of the main suspects in that sorry case who now happens to be Ferrari's number one driver. Wake up :D

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What makes me laugh instead is having to constantly read inaccurate and false accusations against Ferrari just for the fun of it and as for the cheap digs I don't see why they should be only one sided.

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Originally Posted by Roamy

You obviously assume that Alonso could not have passed him. I wouldn't bet on that.

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:rotflmao:
Alonso needed to have Massa lower his cars RPMs to even be as quick as Felipe, he would never have overtaken him

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Originally Posted by Dave B

Now Massa, bless him, beleives he has equality when it's plain for the world to see that he does not.

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That's where I have a great deal of sympathy for Massa. He is very much a Ferrari man but there was a time not so long ago when he was seen as a match for Schumacher and was so very nearly a WDC winner. He effectively saw off Raikkonen and, until his accident, Ferrari's was his to lead into 2010.

Now things look very different for Felipe. Perhaps his accident has had an effect and he's not quite the driver he once was, or perhaps he's just had one of those seasons where things haven't gone his way and he'll be back in 2011.

Sadly I think that's unlikely. Ferrari is now firmly in the grip of Alonso who appears to be a driver who needs and expects a team to be in his corner at all times. He had that at Renault with Briatore, but he was misguided when he went to McLaren thinking he would have that same status. Now he's #1 again. Good luck to him. Demanding that kind of position and getting it is something most drivers would probably want, whether they'd admit it or not. Was it Gerhard Berger who said the ideal team mate was someone slower than you?!!

Now Felipe's choice seems to be to stay at Ferrari in a supporting role, or move elsewhere. The rumour about him going to Sauber has proved to be unfounded, and it's hard to see what other options he may have.

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Originally Posted by henners88

OK, could you list the other ocassions where he was caught cheating and barely punished apart from the one we all know about?

Alonso and Pedro DLR were more guilty than most as they were actively discussing the data through emails and Alonso was very keen to know weight distributions, and if the information was reliable. LH was found not guilty because it was comfirmed that he had no knowledge of the data's existance. Its also unclear whether Ron had any idea his team were using stolen data and the only sources that say he did are forums. lol

Alonso was a major suspect in Spygate, he also used what he aquired, so lets please draw a line under it, because its very hypocritical to continue bashing Mclaren for this sorry saga and then openly turn a blind eye to someone who now happens to drive for one's favourite team.

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Do you even read what you write? I suspected you of some objectivity but I was dead wrong.

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Originally Posted by ArrowsFA1

That's where I have a great deal of sympathy for Massa. He is very much a Ferrari man but there was a time not so long ago when he was seen as a match for Schumacher and was so very nearly a WDC winner. He effectively saw off Raikkonen and, until his accident, Ferrari's was his to lead into 2010.

Now things look very different for Felipe. Perhaps his accident has had an effect and he's not quite the driver he once was, or perhaps he's just had one of those seasons where things haven't gone his way and he'll be back in 2011.

Sadly I think that's unlikely. Ferrari is now firmly in the grip of Alonso who appears to be a driver who needs and expects a team to be in his corner at all times. He had that at Renault with Briatore, but he was misguided when he went to McLaren thinking he would have that same status. Now he's #1 again. Good luck to him. Demanding that kind of position and getting it is something most drivers would probably want, whether they'd admit it or not. Was it Gerhard Berger who said the ideal team mate was someone slower than you?!!

Now Felipe's choice seems to be to stay at Ferrari in a supporting role, or move elsewhere. The rumour about him going to Sauber has proved to be unfounded, and it's hard to see what other options he may have.

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Sadly I think you're correct.

Massa is a fine driver. He is also a proud and spirited. He is driving for the perfect team with one small problem......

He must feel like he's stuck in a nightmare

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Originally Posted by skc

Sadly I think you're correct.

Massa is a fine driver. He is also a proud and spirited. He is driving for the perfect team with one small problem......

He must feel like he's stuck in a nightmare

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I knew this was coming and interestingly, I think the one man Massa misses is Kimi. He probably didn't realise at the time how fair a team mate Kimi was, never demanding special treatment, even as the defending WDC. A good example of that was France 2008, Kimi had a broken exhaust and was slower than Felipe who was allowed to pass him and they finished one two. I don't think that would be allowed to happen now, Massa would just follow his leader.

Anyway, Ferrari's current strategy seems to be working so there is nothing Felipe can do about it except walk away...

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Originally Posted by ArrowsFA1

That's where I have a great deal of sympathy for Massa. He is very much a Ferrari man but there was a time not so long ago when he was seen as a match for Schumacher and was so very nearly a WDC winner. He effectively saw off Raikkonen and, until his accident, Ferrari's was his to lead into 2010.

Now things look very different for Felipe. Perhaps his accident has had an effect and he's not quite the driver he once was, or perhaps he's just had one of those seasons where things haven't gone his way and he'll be back in 2011.

Sadly I think that's unlikely. Ferrari is now firmly in the grip of Alonso who appears to be a driver who needs and expects a team to be in his corner at all times. He had that at Renault with Briatore, but he was misguided when he went to McLaren thinking he would have that same status. Now he's #1 again. Good luck to him. Demanding that kind of position and getting it is something most drivers would probably want, whether they'd admit it or not. Was it Gerhard Berger who said the ideal team mate was someone slower than you?!!

Now Felipe's choice seems to be to stay at Ferrari in a supporting role, or move elsewhere. The rumour about him going to Sauber has proved to be unfounded, and it's hard to see what other options he may have.

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Be it as it may, Fred proved that he can win in the second fastest car without a wingman. Felipe needs to find some speed. That excuse about the injury is lame. I had an injury playing sports that was very similar to Felipe’s only worse. You either get over it or you don't. He is over it. He is just not on the same level as Fred. He needs to start picking up some points toward the WCC, which I'm sure he will.

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Originally Posted by Tazio

Be it as it may, Fred proved that he can win in the second fastest car without a wingman. Felipe needs to find some speed. That excuse about the injury is lame. I had an injury playing sports that was very similar to Felipe’s only worse. You either get over it or you don't. He is over it. He is just not on the same level as Fred. He needs to start picking up some points toward the WCC, which I'm sure he will.

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Whats worse than surgery that involves removing sections of your scalp?

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Originally Posted by SGWilko

Whats worse than surgery that involves removing sections of your scalp?

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Being struck under the left eye by a 90mph fastball that broke my cheekbone from the orbit of my eye all the way to my front teeth giving me double vision for 6 months.
Oh yes and breaking my nose, which the doctors didn't realize for several days as in the early 1970's MRI's were not commonly used and my face was swollen beyond recognition. Two plastic surgeries and permanent nerve damage. What was really special was being conscious while the physician shoved a pair of forceps into my nose and listening to the cartilage crack and crunch as it was being reset.
They were very similar to these:

http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:A...ukXYw9oNLLBGu8

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Originally Posted by Tazio

Being struck under the right eye by a 90mph fastball that broke my cheekbone from the orbit of my eye all the way to my front teeth giving me double vision for 6 months.
Oh yes and breaking my nose, which the doctors didn't realize for several days as in the early 1970's MRI's were not commonly used and my face was swollen beyond recognition. Two plastic surgeries and permanent nerve damage. What was really special was being conscious while the physician shoved a pair of forceps into my nose and listening to the cartilage crack and crunch as it was being reset.

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Yikes, that's not good. :eek:

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Originally Posted by SGWilko

Yikes, that's not good. :eek:

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BTW It is the left :crazy: and I didn't get over it for many years ;)

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Originally Posted by henners88

Thats why I find it confusing when people say "this is the way its always been at Ferrari". We had 3 season's where the drivers seemed to be allowed to challenge each other to a point in the season until only one was mathematically capable of winning the championship. Massa supported Kimi in the closing stages of 2007, and Kimi repaid the favour in 2008. I don't remember a driver being told to move over so early in a season, and the French GP example you give highlights that fact.

Theres nothing wrong with choosing one driver so early on, but IMO it limits the chances of winning the WDC when that support role is not going according to plan. Red Bull and Mclaren openly allow teammates to compete to the last and that maybe why we have seen such exciting team battles so far this season. Ferrari playing the team game is why F1 experienced such a drop in popularity at the beginning of the decade, although I'm sure it was exciting for the supporters who watched their driver win nearly every weekend. Winning isn't the issue though, and on a bright side its nice to see a team like Ferrari doing it differently. At least if Fernando is out of the hunt in future season's we'll know a Ferrari is definately out of the title chase. :)

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I don't understand why the drivers' title in itself is so important that one artificially has to alter race results. Isn't it enough if Ferraris (or other teams, it's not only Ferrari) are winning races all the time, who cares if they lose the drivers' championship or not. They're all in the sport for marketing reasons and team orders create negative publicity.

OK as for Ferrari strategy this weekend.
I'm wondering if Fred is really going to go balls out in a wet quali. If he stays on the edge he stands a reasonable chance of getting the poll.
If he bins it or finnishes down the grid he gets his new engine.

(That's considering if the cheats haven't already changed out Felipe's with one of his) :)

:s ailor: Thoughts?

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Originally Posted by henners88

I'm open to objectivity, and as far as I am aware everything in my post regarding Spygate was substantially backed up.

1. There is no proof to suggest Ron knew members of his team were engaging in criminal activity, and the fact he informed the FIA backs this up.
2. There is no proof to suggest LH had read the 780 page document as you suggested, and being a rookie I doubt he would understand the technical contect anyway. He was also cleared at the trial.
3. Alonso was proven to have used that data in his possession, and there is nothing to suggest he was asked to use it against his will. Quite the opposite when the email transcripts show him asking questions on the reliability of the source.

Thats 3 factual points which were touched on earlier and no longer relevant in this context. Fernando is still as guilty as any member of the Mclaren team to this day, and thats end of story. Fernando is taking on a new challenge and Mclaren and himself should be allowed to continue without this tripe being constantly dragged up IMO. :)

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I am sure you are referring to SGWilko since he is the one who first posted this:
"What I am now convinced of, is that there was a lot of behind the scenes shenanigans orchestrated by Alonso during his short stay at McLaren."

As far as I am concerned I have moved on. However there are still people (see above) who are unwilling to and lose their sleep over it. These people revisit any issue they can think, no matter how old the issue is for the only purpose to continue with the Ferrari bashing. If you dont like the Ferrari fans defend teh facts then let's talk about something that relates more with the present champioship. McLaren, RD and LH are not saints. Everyone knows that.

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Originally Posted by henners88

Thats why I find it confusing when people say "this is the way its always been at Ferrari". We had 3 season's where the drivers seemed to be allowed to challenge each other to a point in the season until only one was mathematically capable of winning the championship. Massa supported Kimi in the closing stages of 2007, and Kimi repaid the favour in 2008. I don't remember a driver being told to move over so early in a season, and the French GP example you give highlights that fact.

Theres nothing wrong with choosing one driver so early on, but IMO it limits the chances of winning the WDC when that support role is not going according to plan. Red Bull and Mclaren openly allow teammates to compete to the last and that maybe why we have seen such exciting team battles so far this season. Ferrari playing the team game is why F1 experienced such a drop in popularity at the beginning of the decade, although I'm sure it was exciting for the supporters who watched their driver win nearly every weekend. Winning isn't the issue though, and on a bright side its nice to see a team like Ferrari doing it differently. At least if Fernando is out of the hunt in future season's we'll know a Ferrari is definately out of the title chase. :)

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I don't know if Webber agrees with you. If I recall correctly he thought a couple races ago otherwise. As McLaren and LH are concerned I have my reserves about about JB having a fair shot at the championship.

:s ailor: Oh Joy !!
The video edit from Singapore is now on Formula 1.com

http://www.formula1.com/video/race_edits.html

"Felipe is and will always stay a number one driver for Ferrari," di Montezemolo told the official Ferrari website.

Monte talking rubbish once again.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/87218

Also, some nonsense of Alonso and Massa fighting equally next year.

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Originally Posted by gloomyDAY

"Felipe is and will always stay a number one driver for Ferrari," di Montezemolo told the official Ferrari website.

Monte talking rubbish once again.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/87218

Also, some nonsense of Alonso and Massa fighting equally next year.

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I would agree with you. Once Ferrari finds the winning horse, they put all their money on him. I am puzzled as someone raised this point earlier on by what happened in Ferrari when Kimi was there. It's not part of their racing philosophy to have two running horses in their team. They usually start the championship whith one first pilot, as shallow as it may be. Fair or not to the other pilot their strategy has paid over the years very well. They are not in the business to make pilots famous. These people get hired to work for Ferrari. They get paid really well but in the end they have to make Ferrari the winner. End of the story. If they don't like it they can always go racing somewhere else.