Rally Sweden 2016

since when have they stopped using the proper slimmer winter tyres for this event?

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Originally Posted by drive

you dont want to drive full speed with gravel tyres on ice, trust me :D

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gravel tyres no, but winter tyres should be fine....

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Originally Posted by Eli

since when have they stopped using the proper slimmer winter tyres for this event?

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2011 when the new cars came, they use the same rims as for gravel tyres now. Brynildsen lost about 1min in 30min of stages to Østberg in Finnskogen last weekend so it's quite a big difference if there's snow or slush.

Yeah, new tires are much less destructive for the road surface and with these tires it is much easier to drive without loosing all studs. And I must say that cars look much better with these tires as well :)

Henning has some advice for Ogier :p https://twitter.com/rallyhelene_g/st...71642612731904

By the way ERC Rally Liepaja which was several times held on frozen gravel brought quite a unique spectacle with nice grinder effects in the darkness :p Sadly there doesn't seem to be a lot of opportunities to see that in Sweden.

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Originally Posted by Mirek

So far it looks like Pirelli will have considerable advantage.



Off topic again... but Dakar 4WD have a lot smaller suspension travel than WRC cars because of their rules ;)

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Depends if You run 4wd or 2WD?

All roads will be graded after the recce and new gravel will be put on according to Jarmo Mahonen.

http://www.vf.se/sport/bilsport/fiac...nerat%E2%80%9D

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Originally Posted by bluuford

Yeah, new tires are much less destructive for the road surface and with these tires it is much easier to drive without loosing all studs. And I must say that cars look much better with these tires as well :)

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Regarding tires:

Keeping the studs in the tire will be a decisive factor. And there is actually a lot the driver can do.

The studs grip surprisingly well, also on gravel, but the challenge is to keep the tire/rubber temperature down.
What happens in gravel is that the increased friction and movement in the studs, and the rubber, leads to higher temperatures in the tire.
First You will feel this in the car, because the softer feeling in the tire will give very unprecice feedback, and its almost like driving in mud, where the tire wallows over the road. The studs will give way, and lay down, off course affecting grip, and it gets understeered (the front wheels has a tendency to go first).
A normal tendency is to start over driving the car, and stress the front wheels to much (especially in technical parts of the stage), with corners from 2-4 in series, and especially longer corners driven on understeer.
The driver that can regulate driving and set up to combat this, will have a huge advantage.
What needs to be done is to not exaggerate under steer, or over steer (tough riding the front wheels in constant understeer is the worst).

Sorry to say it, but we are again in Ogier/Nose End First-territory. Where braking and accelerating in a straight line becomes even more important. Also shortening the turns, so instead of hanging on to a long four wheel drift with understeer on the front, You should go in deeper, turn, then go out straight.

Ogier being first on the road will also have the advantage of not having to drive in ruts on the first loop. So if You compare his tires on stage end compared to the guys that starts from 5 and down, there will be differences. The WRC 2 guys will have their work cut out, because with the god grip in the car, compared to less hp and Nm, the change in driving style will be difficult to judge. Too slow mid corner will loose time, to fast will loose studs.

Unless there is fresh snow on the rally mornings, this looks to become more and more of an Ogier runaway.

Regarding brands: In Norway on the narrow tires we have seen that the Pirelli has a softer rubber, and is more prone to loose studs in gravel than the Michelin and Hankook (I am connected to the sale of Hankook motorsport tires in Norway). If the WRC Pirelli is built the same way, i.e. being softer than the Michelin, this will be a factor especially in WRC2. And I would expect the Michelins to handle the gravel better. For DMACK, I think this will be a very challenging event.

BTW: I think the "old" narrow winter tires looks much better, because of the extreme profile. But understand the road wear factor. Gravel tires should also be made less wearing on the road (less grip), because they destroy roads.

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Originally Posted by Lundefaret

Regarding tires:

Keeping the studs in the tire will be a decisive factor. And there is actually a lot the driver can do.

The studs grip surprisingly well, also on gravel, but the challenge is to keep the tire/rubber temperature down.
What happens in gravel is that the increased friction and movement in the studs, and the rubber, leads to higher temperatures in the tire.
First You will feel this in the car, because the softer feeling in the tire will give very unprecice feedback, and its almost like driving in mud, where the tire wallows over the road. The studs will give way, and lay down, off course affecting grip, and it gets understeered (the front wheels has a tendency to go first).
A normal tendency is to start over driving the car, and stress the front wheels to much (especially in technical parts of the stage), with corners from 2-4 in series, and especially longer corners driven on understeer.
The driver that can regulate driving and set up to combat this, will have a huge advantage.
What needs to be done is to not exaggerate under steer, or over steer (tough riding the front wheels in constant understeer is the worst).

Sorry to say it, but we are again in Ogier/Nose End First-territory. Where braking and accelerating in a straight line becomes even more important. Also shortening the turns, so instead of hanging on to a long four wheel drift with understeer on the front, You should go in deeper, turn, then go out straight.

Ogier being first on the road will also have the advantage of not having to drive in ruts on the first loop. So if You compare his tires on stage end compared to the guys that starts from 5 and down, there will be differences. The WRC 2 guys will have their work cut out, because with the god grip in the car, compared to less hp and Nm, the change in driving style will be difficult to judge. Too slow mid corner will loose time, to fast will loose studs.

Unless there is fresh snow on the rally mornings, this looks to become more and more of an Ogier runaway.

Regarding brands: In Norway on the narrow tires we have seen that the Pirelli has a softer rubber, and is more prone to loose studs in gravel than the Michelin and Hankook (I am connected to the sale of Hankook motorsport tires in Norway). If the WRC Pirelli is built the same way, i.e. being softer than the Michelin, this will be a factor especially in WRC2. And I would expect the Michelins to handle the gravel better. For DMACK, I think this will be a very challenging event.

BTW: I think the "old" narrow winter tires looks much better, because of the extreme profile. But understand the road wear factor. Gravel tires should also be made less wearing on the road (less grip), because they destroy roads.

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I agree on extreme conditions protecting the tyres, Ogier will have huge advantage all over. I don't understand this "moaning":confused: