2012 Presidential Race

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Originally Posted by DanicaFan

These pictures say it best. They are so true.... Sorry, I know the truth is hard sometimes. :)

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Again, forgive me if I don't consider you someone whose opinions are worth taking seriously.

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Originally Posted by Malbec

Your description of "people who stand for unlimited competition" presumably is aimed at the right. However this political group is often against immigration because ultimately it increases the level of competition within society, therefore they are only for unlimited competition where it suits them and not as a universal principle.

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Indeed — also, the sort of person who has no problem with both complaining about immigration and moving to the Costa del Sol.

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Originally Posted by D-Type

Just a thought:

Was it Obama, the Republican Party, the Democrats, the Communists, the Socialists, the Liberals, the Green Party, al Qaeda, the Taliban, or someone else who made the decision enabling the US lending agencies to grant mortgages to "sub-prime" customers? And who made the decision to fund these from the world's banking system. Who tried to sort out the resultant mess?

In other words, are people shooting at the right target?

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A certain section of the US electorate will believe they are so long as the President is black. Sad but, I feel, true.

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Originally Posted by Malbec

The problem with simplifying is that it doesn't describe accurately what people stand for.

Your description of "people who stand for unlimited competition" presumably is aimed at the right. However this political group is often against immigration because ultimately it increases the level of competition within society, therefore they are only for unlimited competition where it suits them and not as a universal principle.

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Not true. It's the illegal immigration most are against. America has a fine tradition of welcoming new people - it has been one of the factors which built the country.

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Originally Posted by Starter

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Not true. It's the illegal immigration most are against.

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Simply saying 'Not true' doesn't make it so. Certainly in the UK it is the case that many don't make the distinction, and thus is the 'debate' shaped.

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Originally Posted by Starter

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Not true. It's the illegal immigration most are against. America has a fine tradition of welcoming new people - it has been one of the factors which built the country.

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The right wing isn't limited to the US.

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Originally Posted by race aficionado

DanicaFan.
Better start getting accustomed to the fact that President Obama will be re elected to a second term - and that eventually many of the republicans in congress will stop the battle to avoid Obama's re-election - because that battle was lost - and will now put the interests of the country first.

** my second thought is wishful thinking of course but I can't give up in humanity.

My first comment . . . . put that one in the bank.

:s mokin:

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He wont get re-elected. And sorry but Obama doesnt have the country's best interests in mind, he has his OWN.

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Originally Posted by DanicaFan

He wont get re-elected.

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I look forward to looking back at this statement in a few months' time.

Tell me — were you impressed by Romney"s behaviour when he came to Europe? Even conservatives on this side of the Atlantic were acutely embarrassed by him.

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Originally Posted by DanicaFan

And sorry but Obama doesnt have the country's best interests in mind, he has his OWN.

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Nice slogan — no doubt one you've heard elsewhere and decided to copy — but essentially empty and meaningless. I wouldn't even say that of David Cameron*, a man for whom and for whose party I would never vote, and whose policies I consider terribly misguided. Trying to second-guess someone else's personal motivation for doing something is, I tend to think, problematic.

(* — David Cameron is the Prime Minister of the United Kingdom, in case you were unaware.)

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Originally Posted by Starter

It was two parties. First, the US Congress who required lenders to loan to pretty much anyone regardless of creditworthyness in order to eliminate "redlining" and second, some, but not all, of the lenders who were busy lapping up commissions and kick backs for all the loans made.

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As the former owner of a mortgage company and a former mortgage banker (who worked for a bank accused of red-lining), I'd be curious to know more about this requirement by Congress, that forced banks to lend to anyone regardless of creditworthiness. Even my bank was not "required" to make loans, even though we had indeed used red-lining principles in making decisions.

Unfortunately, what you're talking about is an urban legend created on right-wing talk radio a couple of years ago. Usually Barney Frank is touted as the author of this non-existent legislation. One version even has the U.S. government paying banks a "stipend" (complete misuse of the word) for the loans they made to minorities. There were efforts to bust up red-lining. But no bank was forced to make the first loan to a borrower that did not meet a bank's minimum lending standards - they just couldn't use different standards based on race, gender or location. Also, FNMA and FHLMC set minimum lending standards for their conforming mortgages. But just as right now, banks can elect to tighten those standards. But they (on their own) cannot lower the underwriting standards, they cannot discriminate and they cannot red-line.

For those who aren't well versed in the mortgage market, here is a factoid for you: banks and mortgage companies made subprimes because of the profits. That's why. They even placed many borrowers, who qualified for primes, into subprimes because the rate and fee profits were 300%+ greater. The bank that I'm doing my refi with right now never entered the subprime market. The free will to make or not make loans was never put in the hands of Congress.

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Originally Posted by Malbec

Can you link to the exact bit of legislation you're referring to?

The last time someone claimed this (might have been you but not sure) it turned out that Congress banned lenders from using demographic information such as race and religion as lending criteria but did nothing to ban credit ratings assessments.

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Sorry, I didn't see your post before I addressed this as well. But you are correct. Again, this claim has become an urban legend that was spread mostly (as far as I know) on right wing talk radio. And yes, it is a false claim.