M-Sport Ford World Rally Teams

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by wyler

I don't see any contradiction. Everybody knows that breen is not a championship contender, so of course, they want him deliver podiums and points to be in the mix with the manufacturer team. that's the aim foe m-sport.

of course they will not change breen for another breen-like driver. top tier drivers are unlikely to downgrade to m-sport, so why change? there's no assurance unemployed drivers will do better (and established drivers like lappi and suninen didn't shine with them either at their time...)
.

---

He says Breen was hired for stable results and podiums and doesn't deliver that now.

At the same time he says they will only change for a championship contender.

That's the contradiction.

----
I don't think they should change Breen (for sure not mid-season). But they should get someone to accompany him at least for a few starts. Loeb should be easiest but even that is not happening (expanded program).
---

A few weeks ago Millener was interviewed saying they were "looking for ways to bring experienced drivers" so that Breen isn't alone. Now it's not on the table anymore.

Translated to plain english:
1. We want experienced drivers but someone else has to pay (sponsor or driver(s) themselves).
2. Nobody experienced wants to pay and we won't use own money.

----
Regarding looking at split times....sure when it's young driver in one of his first few rallies. But here it's drivers that have been 1 to 3 years in top tier car.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by mknight

He says Breen was hired for stable results and podiums and doesn't deliver that now.

At the same time he says they will only change for a championship contender.

That's the contradiction.

----
I don't think they should change Breen (for sure not mid-season). But they should get someone to accompany him at least for a few starts. Loeb should be easiest but even that is not happening (expanded program).
---

A few weeks ago Millener was interviewed saying they were "looking for ways to bring experienced drivers" so that Breen isn't alone. Now it's not on the table anymore.

Translated to plain english:
1. We want experienced drivers but someone else has to pay (sponsor or driver(s) themselves).
2. Nobody experienced wants to pay and we won't use own money.

----
Regarding looking at split times....sure when it's young driver in one of his first few rallies. But here it's drivers that have been 1 to 3 years in top tier car.

---

man, you are just repeating the same things as before...:confused:
there's no one experienced to hire, money or not. hope this is not slipping again toward some infamous unemployed drivers...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by wyler

man, you are just repeating the same things as before...:confused:
there's no one experienced to hire, money or not. hope this is not slipping again toward some infamous unemployed driver...

---

Man, the contradiction you missed to see was written to you in plain text. Instead of addressing it you go with "but but Mikkelsen", when I was arguing for expanded program for Loeb.
When out of arguments...

EDiT: Btw. The only unemployed experienced driver available atm is Meeke (though he is getting paid for Fabia tests). He would also be interesting to see for pure speed on a few rounds. Mikkelsen and Suninen have paid driver positions, Paddon afaik as well (Hyundai NZ). Guess that's part of the reason while none are at MSport. Sure they are likely not earnings millions, but better than paying at MSport.

Millener is saying what I've been saying for months. M-Sport won't hire someone like Mikkelsen to get "decent results", they will only put the money down to get a title, like with Ogier, and it succeeded.

But with that logic, why did they hire Breen? But then again we don't know the details of that contract.

And I remember many people expecting Breen to be there in the title fight before the season started. Even after Monte it was "clever tactics" to get a better road position for Sweden by not going fast on the power stage. I remember also Miika Wuorela on twitter expecting a similar first-full-season-championship like Grönholm in 2000. And you can also check the Crystal Ball thread here. Everyone was expecting him to step up after the podiums in the Hyundai, and I don't know either why it isn't happening.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by AnttiL

But with that logic, why did they hire Breen? But then again we don't know the details of that contract.

---

They had to have at least one experienced driver as a "safe bet" to bring results. (That attract sponsors and most notably other paydrivers like Loubet).

Breen looked like the safest bet "on the way up". You could say they can use Loeb alone for that, but before this year Loeb was not safest bet at all (two third.places as best in Hyundai over 2 years).

Might say Loeb is the reason they don't need anyone else on "Breen level" even when Breen doesn't deliver. Undeniably Breen now does worse than in Hyundai, not even same level, but I don't blame him. Rather blame MSport for him been alone with no testing.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by AnttiL

Millener is saying what I've been saying for months. M-Sport won't hire someone like Mikkelsen to get "decent results", they will only put the money down to get a title, like with Ogier, and it succeeded.

But with that logic, why did they hire Breen? But then again we don't know the details of that contract.

And I remember many people expecting Breen to be there in the title fight before the season started. Even after Monte it was "clever tactics" to get a better road position for Sweden by not going fast on the power stage. I remember also Miika Wuorela on twitter expecting a similar first-full-season-championship like Grönholm in 2000. And you can also check the Crystal Ball thread here. Everyone was expecting him to step up after the podiums in the Hyundai, and I don't know either why it isn't happening.

---

It's like he's a different driver to what he was in the Hyundai and even Citroen.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by seb_sh

It's like he's a different driver to what he was in the Hyundai and even Citroen.

---

To me it's actually quite similar now to the Citroen days

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by AnttiL

To me it's actually quite similar now to the Citroen days

---

I thought he was more consistent but had a quick look at his results and you're right. In 2017 he was always 5th or had some issue and after that it looks a lot like this year.
In fact it looks like the series of tree podiums at the end of last year was the anomaly.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by seb_sh

In fact it looks like the series of tree podiums at the end of last year was the anomaly.

---

If the timeline listed during the interviews with MSport last year is correct all these podiums happened after he signed for MSport.

(They said that negotiations started during Sardinia and contract was signed before Estonia)

Can be an indicator he performs best when not under pressure.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by mknight

Man, the contradiction you missed to see was written to you in plain text. Instead of addressing it you go with "but but Mikkelsen", when I was arguing for expanded program for Loeb.
When out of arguments...

EDiT: Btw. The only unemployed experienced driver available atm is Meeke (though he is getting paid for Fabia tests). He would also be interesting to see for pure speed on a few rounds. Mikkelsen and Suninen have paid driver positions, Paddon afaik as well (Hyundai NZ). Guess that's part of the reason while none are at MSport. Sure they are likely not earnings millions, but better than paying at MSport.

---

the funny thing is that is you alone that come up again with the mikkelsen broken record.

i said driverS (plural), referring totally to the same list you did after (i used "unemployed" referring to wrc1, of course), it took you an edit to get into the discussion, that speaks for itself...

on the main topic, i ll not repeat again for the 3rd time. it is totally ok for me if you believe it's a contradiction.
i hope you already know because speaking about "more Loeb" is pure nonsense. he's doing wrc to fill the gaps between his true employment, and greece is the best example to testify.