Not really. His life is so sad he has to live Lewis's by proxy,
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Just telling Danny what he has to expect, because we've seen it before. I would say I'm not obsessed with Vettel. Unlike those who wank over Lewis, I actually met the man, so I've got a reason to like him. Liking a driver is okay, that's what the sport thrives on. It becomes unhealthy if you give up your life to live through someone else's.
Good race, well done Lewis on a determined and clean drive.
Threads like this are embarrassing for the forum though.
Good race. Sad that Daniel didn't win.
We talk about drivers and strategies etc. But the stewards of the Monaco GP were the best l have witnessed in while. They could have spoilt the race by slapping penalties left right and center. But instead they were very measured and recognized racing incident where it was deservedly so. They did a great job. And the marshalls, how quickly they mopped up the carnage today was exemplary. And they definitely were taken through their paces weren't they?
Red Bull.
At the pinnacle level of auto racing their driver comes in for tires - and the needed tires are stuck in the back of the pit.
LMFAO.
Comparing an unprepared pit crew to a driver who crashes by exceeding the limit by a hair is ludicrous.
Red Bull sucked (this time)...
So the ladyboy won because Ricciardo was given wings, insted of tyres. What a disaster for the former championship team.
Is someone sulking after today's result ?
Come on guys, let's have less of the name calling, you're better than this.
Great race, it had it all. So many great individual performances that choosing a single DOTR is impossible. Ric, Hamilton, Perez and Alo all equally deserving I think.
I have to agree with Henners on this occasion.
The clear pro Hamilton fans at the expense of anything else and the clear anti anything to do with Hamilton fans are becoming embarrassing
Reading through after watching a cracking race this morning, I reckon 9 of the 14 pages are all either fan boy posts or anti fan boy posts.
Makes me just skim most of what has been said:confused:
Anyway for the race itself I thought it was maybe the best Monaco GP since 2008? and the last wet race. 2010? or 2011 was good too.
Hamilton drove really well, to handle the car from wets straight to slicks was amazing. Not sure I have ever seen that done.
Ricciardo however was massively unlucky. He hounded Hamilton to make a great race and should have won but for Red Bulls inability to find some tyres. What surprised me was Lewis pitted for drys right ahead of Daniel and yet despite a long long stop Ricciardo exited the pits just behind him. A normal stop and he would have easily rejoined ahead. Not sure why Hamilton was so slow.
Perez was exceptional too. Played the conditions just right and got a great podium.
Alonso done a good job too. 5th and lots of points. I dont know if Rosberg had a problem? He was slow at the start on a wet track, then couldn't even stay close to Alonso in the last 20 laps.
Plus I never really saw what happened on the last corner? Did Rosberg slow to early or just get a bad run.
I also agree with someone above who said they were happy with less penalties. I have said for a long time, I get fed up with nanny state and so many penalties. Definitely better to see less being given in race. This should be the outlook at every race.
I also think Charlie Whiting needs to retire. No need for 8 laps under SC at the start. 1 or 2 at most. To be honest could have gone for a proper start like we used to.
I enjoyed the race a lot.
That race is best described by a four-letter-word that starts with S and ends with T - and it isn't 'soot'. Not because of the winner or the weather. Just because it embarrassed so many people.
First: Whiting. Seriously? Eight laps behind the SC? These are supposed to be the best drivers in the world. On a day when there was the Indy 500 and the Nürburgring 24h, F1 was made to look like a bunch of Eunuchs.
Second: Ferrari. Seriously? What the heck were you doing this weekend? And Vettel? How much more lacklustre can you drive? Seriously...
Third: Max Verstappen. Reality Check, kiddo. That funny noise you seem to find so interesting is the noise your car makes when it disintegrates after hitting the armco. Three crashes in one weekend. We haven't seen that since Maldonado left. An absolutely abysmal job that just emphasized how worthless your gifted win was at Barcelona. Need to do better than that, mate.
Fourth: Rosberg. The hell, man? Have you taken leave of your senses? You have ONE opponent and you follow team orders to let him pass? In a race where you can even defend your position even when you're three seconds slower? What's the point of trying to become world champion if you're not even trying? The very guy you let pass would have ignored the team order as he has done so often in the past. What in the wild world of sports are you trying to achieve by playing the team game when the other half doesn't and runs off with the silverware? Grow a pair, will you?
Five: Merc. Seriously? What's the point in being the bloody championship leader when you tell him to let pass his only realistic competitor? How much more obvious can you tell a driver that he's the 'wrong winner'?
Six: Red Bull. 'Nuff said. Danny, call Maranello and ask for Seb. He'll tell you what this is all about.
Seven: McLaren. LOL. Podium, my arse... Eric The Believable must feel like a complete and utter idiot now after his 'bald statements' last week.
Too bad there was no donkey of the race thread. We could have nominated the whole lot of them.
Yeah it was a good race with plenty of suspense. I felt sorry for Daniel as the teams cock up cost him the race and that's even more of a bitter pill to swallow at Monaco.
Hamilton was pretty solid apart from that period during the Red Bull pit and I don't know either why he lost so much time?
An enjoyable race though nonetheless.
Rosberg's car was completely messed up. According to Wolff they taped the brake ducts wrong (whatever that means), which meant that he never got tyres and brakes up to working temperatures (hence the abysmal lack of pace right from the start).
Interesting theory from Alex Wurz on ORF though: He straight-forwardly said that Toto was not telling the entire truth and that the taping most likely caused the brakes to overheat and the discs were glazing. As for the last corner: Rosberg didn't manage to get the tyres warmed up all race. When it started raining in the closing laps, the already cold tyres cooled even more and he had no grip whatsoever, so Hulk simply out-accelerated him.
BTW. Hulk was equally shafted as Danny was. Team apologized for messing up what should have been Hulk's podium. Instead Perez got it. I'd be a trifle po'ed about that, and he was, badly. That interview on German TV was, lets say, not a very diplomatic one.
Which Team Orders has Hamilton ignored in the past? Just as many as Rosberg I'd venture. At least the THREE TIMES CHAMP has never pulled the 'let's end Q3 early by spinning' trick.
What you saw yesterday was a driver who simply doesn't have the cojones for a wet race and one that comes into his own when balance and touch become a premium rather than gizmo management. Hulk rubbed that fact in when he decided tippy toe driving wasn't warranted with just a few spits!!
To address points made elsewhere, clearly the Merc chassis is behind the RBR -witness the inability to make the tyres perform from cool - the reason for Hamilton's very slow out lap on the US and how RIC almost jumped him on the restarts.
As for the chicane incident - at least it was consistent with the Barca decision though on this occasion RIC needed to realise that Hamilton was in an unstable state exiting the chicane - I don't think there was a deliberate squeeze in the manner that the aquaphobic one did 2 weeks ago.
It would have been interesting had Hamilton been behind RIC after the stops. Given the clear power advantage the Merc had in the DRS zone it isn't a given that the Red Bull would have kept ahead.
I thought it was a great 'race' and agree that it showed up the men from the boys from the over the hills from the never wills.
Watch Hungary 2014. Also, I don't know which race it was (Spain 2015 I think), where he was told to save the engine by switching to Strat-mode six, the same that Nico in the lead was told to use (and used). Lewis ignored three clear orders to go from Strat-10 to Strat-6 trying to close in on Rosberg. The team then told Nico to go up to Strat-10 as well. There was another incident where the team told him to come in and he ignored them until his engineer told him that they would give Nico the undercut if he doesn't come in. And that's just three examples I readily remember.
As for your rant about Rosberg. Cut the hate, man, his car was completely messed up. I don't think Toto would apologize for it if it wasn't the team's fault. Lewis might be somewhat better in the rain, but he is not three seconds better, even a certified Hamfosi would not claim something like that.
Dj,
Giving Rosberg a team order to let his teammate through just as Rosberg's slow car was about to create a long train of following cars, while Ricciardo was allowed to run away for the win right from the beginning of the race, was certainly a smart thing to do. The goal of any team is to win a race rather than create a colorful fight on the track for the fans while letting the race leader get away.
The GP of Monaco was certainly underwhelming because of Red Bull's pit crew mistake. Many, many people were so oh disappointed about this, but I wonder if these were the same people who were cheering when a bad race engineer call at the last year's Monaco GP made Hamilton lose his certain win. This random crap always happens in racing.
Well, we'll have to agree to disagree. Most other drivers, including Hamilton himself, would have told the team where to shove it. What if Rosberg loses the championship by less than seven points? Seven points he wouldn't have lost if he had held Lewis behind him long enough for Ricciardo to escape? It would mean that he would still be 31 points ahead instead of 24. Two of Vettels four titles have been won by less than that small margin.
I have no idea why Rosberg does that to begin with. Everybody knows that, if the roles were reversed, there would be no chance in hell that Lewis would have followed such an order. So what's the point? There's no prize for being a team-player, especially not when your opponent doesn't play by the same rules.
No , dj , Nico would have been pilloried by all and sundry , had he decided to hold Lewis up any longer .
He knew he was slow and he didn't have any answer , other than to do the honourable thing .
I guess he now knows why he was slow , with brake ducts taped too much .
Hopefully , they'll give him enough justification on why his were as they were , different from the other car .
We'll see if he'll still find it to be a good idea should he lose the championship by, let's say 5 points. Then those seven points that RIC would have stolen off Lewis will be sorely missed. Championships are decided not on the days where things go well, but on those days when something isn't right. Imagine it would have been Lewis who'd been asked to let Rosberg drive past. Not counting that he would never have done that anyway, his fanbase would have made the internet explode over the team's decision. I think that's why they dared giving that order. They knew that only Nico would obey something like that. I think, even in a compromised car, you should be allowed to race and Monaco is a track where he could have managed to keep his position, even in a car that was a second or two off the pace.
I don't think there really is a justification, other than it being a bad team mistake, as Toto admitted after the race. They also praised Nico's team-player qualities, but sadly such things aren't rewarded in F1. Had he been allowed to keep Lewis behind until he would inevitably be passed through pitstops not even RB's blunder could have prevented RIC's win and he would still have 31 points lead instead of 24. Even with Lewis's engine-related grid drops looming on the horizon, Rosberg's chances to win the title have just massively reduced.
If Rosberg loses the championship by 7 points, then that's not going to be a big deal for the team. They take the double championship title wins (constructor and driver) as well as the Monaco GP win. Nobody is going to lose sleep over letting Hamiltoon overtake a wounded Rosberg car as early as the Monaco GP in the season.
Morevoer, if Hamilton wins only by seven points then that's going to be a really interesting season!
I love the Merc spin machine! (This is not a rant by the way !) Is Toto going to say to the press 'Nico couldn't get the tyres to work because he cannot handle damp conditions' - Of course not.
I'd save your fingers for trying to reason with DJ here. He will take any incident he can involving Lewis and find an excuse to lay blame on him.
Regarding your chassis analysis, I am afraid you are incorrect in your assessment that RBR have the best chassis. They might have had a package better suited to Monaco but that alone doesn't and never has been a standard by which to assess best chassis.
Barcelona is where everyone sets their stall out. In fact, you can very clearly see the pecking order in terms of chassis in qualifying there:
Mercedes, Red Bull, Ferrari.
Ferrari's engine is better than RBR's but couldn't out qualify them because their chassis isn't as good.
The 7 tenths and 1 second to pole of both Ricciardo and Max respectively can't be explained off by engine alone. The RBR might be better in slow corners requiring great traction but in the medium to high speed corners Mercedes sets the standard and this is why they have the overall best chassis on the grid but RBR isn't far off.
I beg to differ. You completely take my words out of context. In fact if you actually read the thread, you'll know that it started with me criticising Rosberg for moving over in the first place, because we all know that his team mate wouldn't do the same if the roles were reversed. And rolling over that easily is certainly not winning him the title.
You may have forgotten that, while the drivers are in it for the title, the teams are in it for the money. There is no profit in accepting lower place finishes which affect both end of season payouts and next season's sponsorship. Rosberg was going to get passed by several drivers when he made a pit stop no matter how wide his car was up to that point. And the longer he held up the train the more cars would be bunched up to pass. It was much better to let Hamilton go for a try at the win.
That is correct from a team's point of view, but not for the viewers and Bernie-money aside, F1 first and foremost is a spectator's sport and most viewers root for a driver, not a team (except perhaps the Tifosi). I woulod have understood that if Mercedes would be in any danger of not winning the WCC this year, but that isn't happening and it makes no difference in money if you win it with a 200 points margin or a 300 points margin. That is exactly the reason why Mercedes are extremely unpopular in Germany of all places. Many people feel like they stage-manage things way too much, especially given their hugely dominant position. Their car always struggled a bit on twisty tracks, but those are rare on the calendar.
And, as I said earlier, the internet would have melted down had it been Lewis in Rosberg's shoes. Just remember the multitude of conspiracy theories when Lewis didn't win any of the first seven races. Everybody and his dog kept harping on about how the team had given Lewis's mechanics to Nico and how that was the reason why his car kept on breaking down. Funnily enough it were the same mechanics who ballsed up Nico's car. Suddenly nobody demands anymore that Lewis gets his old mechanics back.
From a team perspective, I agree. But for most spectators it was unnecessary given how far ahead the Merc is on most tracks. This isn't 2012 or 2013 where RB can suddenly out-develop everybody as the engine disparity makes that practically impossible.
After Spain I think both Mercedes drivers would have been reminded they work for the team and not themselves. Toto made no secret that if they don't get along then one of them will have to leave too. No doubt Lewis will find himself in a position later this season where he has to give up his position so there is no point crying about it.
Lewis would have either passed Nico in the pit stops or forced a pass anyway so the order made sense in this instance and meant the team had a victory rather than just a podium, or at worse no points at all.
There is only one dirty driver out there,who couldnt perform in the best machinery on the track in the wet on Sunday And there is no defence
How come then, that as soon as he was reminded that he was expected to let Nico pass, his lap times went down? ;) He knew very well that the 2014 tyres were shot immediately if you did run too close behind another car. I understand that you as a Lewis fan try to spin it other way round, but he did ignore what had been a standing order within the team from the very start. He might not have blatantly said 'no' on the radio, like Verstappen did not too long ago, but on a track like Hungary it would have taken at least some slight lifting from Hamilton to let Nico pass. He didn't do that and it was deliberate and cost the team a possible double-podium.
They finished less than 2 seconds apart, which was about the minimum required distance to prevent the tyres from dying, so it wasn't like Rosberg was too slow. What Lewis achieved was gaining three measly points on the back of ignoring team interests, as he failed to overtake Alonso, something that Nico might have had a better chance at with his much fresher and softer tyres. So, all those who say letting Lewis past was better in the interest of the team, would have to criticise Lewis for ignoring the teams interests there. Rosberg was in a much better position to catch Alonso and perhaps even Ricciardo, who only finished some 5 seconds ahead of Lewis.