Raise the age of driving to 18

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Originally Posted by Brown, Jon Brow

Simple solution to that, why not use the green 'P' plates for people who have passed their test but haven't passed the motorway segment. ;)

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That wouldn't work, when I was 16 I drove 4 separate vehicles at different times, my mom's car, my dad's truck, my truck, or my motorcycle. Many 16 year olds only drive mom or dad's car, you wouldn't want a special plate attached to the car. Heck, my dad's been known to borrow mine from me.

On the original topic, 16 is good for licensing. Here you get a learner's permit at 15 to ride with another licensed driver. There are some wanting to make it a graduated license with restrictions until 18. It would be similar to the motorcycle license here in Tennessee. I got my motorcycle license at 14, and was restricted to 125cc, 7 miles from home, and daylight hours only. I never broke those restrictions either :angel: :D not! :devil:

Restricting the capacity/power of vehicles that young men can drive is being tried here in some states of Australia. It will be a dismal failure as it's not the power of the vehicles that is the problem, it's the yahoos behind the wheel. Unfortunately, young guys like to screw about. It's in their nature. I have no idea how it will ever change.

There was a study done at one of the universities here in Australia that found no link between engine power/capacity and fatalities amongst young drivers. Don't have time to find the link right now.

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Originally Posted by Flat.tyres

there are suggestions that the minimum age for driving may becaome 18 and drivers should have to undergo more rigerous tests and restrictions.
while I think this is a good idea, I think that the figures are misleading.

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Let me think about these two statements in conjuction. On one hand you want more rigorous testing yet you also want to cut their ability to gain experience? Please explain.

I think ALL drivers should be retested every 5 years as part of regular licensing requirements. Why stop at young people? It's possible for someone to get on the roads at age 20 and go through 50+ years without ever being retested - this is preposterous.

I note that you say this:

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Originally Posted by Flat.tyres

I would suggest restricting drivers with less than 3 years driving experience to a maximum litreage of 1.1 and power of 50 hp to slow the little buggers down.

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and yet in another post say this:

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Originally Posted by Flat.tyres

a 1.1 car will do 90mph and tow a small trailer.

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Clearly restricting people to a 1.1L car isn't the answer then is it? By your own admission a 1.1L is already capable of breaking the speed limit. ST205GT4 and Iain both correctly point out that the car is not to blame but the driver.

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Originally Posted by Flat.tyres

we also need to have a insurance scheme that young drivers can afford because £1000 for a baby car is taking the piss and encouraging them to drive without it.

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Complusory 3rd party insurance exists in NSW. You can't register a car in the first place unless you're insured. Problem solved. Please enact this in the UK.

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Originally Posted by Rollo

Let me think about these two statements in conjuction. On one hand you want more rigorous testing yet you also want to cut their ability to gain experience? Please explain.

I think ALL drivers should be retested every 5 years as part of regular licensing requirements. Why stop at young people? It's possible for someone to get on the roads at age 20 and go through 50+ years without ever being retested - this is preposterous.

I note that you say this:


and yet in another post say this:

Clearly restricting people to a 1.1L car isn't the answer then is it? By your own admission a 1.1L is already capable of breaking the speed limit. ST205GT4 and Iain both correctly point out that the car is not to blame but the driver.


Complusory 3rd party insurance exists in NSW. You can't register a car in the first place unless you're insured. Problem solved. Please enact this in the UK.

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ok Rollo, let me explain.

at the moment, the test can be taken on your 17th Birthday and you can jump into a bently twin turbo if you have the dosh.

part of the proposal was to have a minimum number of lessons prior to being able to take a test which would increase the level of competence and experience of any new driver to a specific, minimul level.

this will give them more rigorous testing and a minimum level of experience that is higher than what is currently in place. agreed?

2nd point. Agreed. I think it's crazy that people think they have a licence to drive how they bloody well like just because they got a licence out the top of a pack of cornflakes 50 years ago. every 5 years is fine by me but drivers will have to accept that there will be a financial cost for this improved safety.

3rd point. some agreement. a 50hp, 1.1 car is still capable of exceeding the speed limit. what it does do is limit the speed kids can accellerate / drive at and the potential energy involved in a crash. it is not some way of changing the drivers mindsets as the proposed testing improvements will address that. it is a way of minimising the effects of a crash should it happen. after all, it's pretty easy losing a soooooped up calibra booting it round a corner showing off but a little more difficult and not quite so impressive in a 1.0 litre punto that would have trouble wheelspinning on a skid pad.

last point. agree 100%

5 year retests - no thanks. :s

[quote="Rollo"]
I think ALL drivers should be retested every 5 years as part of regular licensing requirements. Why stop at young people? It's possible for someone to get on the roads at age 20 and go through 50+ years without ever being retested - this is preposterous.

quote]

In principal a good idea, but I can't see it really working. All that would happen is that the drivers would drive sensibly for 1 day in every 5 years just so they could pass!!! The only real benefit would be to see if people can still have good eyesight or not.

If someone wants to drive they will regardless of age, engine size, ability, as a certain minority already do (as thet are banned, no insurance, licence).

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Originally Posted by Flat.tyres

ok Rollo, let me explain.

at the moment, the test can be taken on your 17th Birthday and you can jump into a bently twin turbo if you have the dosh.

part of the proposal was to have a minimum number of lessons prior to being able to take a test which would increase the level of competence and experience of any new driver to a specific, minimul level.

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If they did this then they should reduce the cost of driving lessons.

How many lessons?

£20 per hour, if you had 12 lessons then that's £240 plus £60 for using the car for your test.

The DSA recommend about 40 lessons. :s

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Originally Posted by Brown, Jon Brow

If they did this then they should reduce the cost of driving lessons.

How many lessons?

£20 per hour, if you had 12 lessons then that's £240 plus £60 for using the car for your test.

The DSA recommend about 40 lessons. :s

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I cant see how they can reduce the cost.

if a driving instructor does 6 lessons a day, with 15 mins driving / break between clients and an hour for lunch, not taking into account any holdups or traffic, he will work about 8.5 hours a day or 42.5 hours a week.

take off 8 days for bank holidays and 20 days Holiday leaves him with 232 working days a year and a Gross wage of £26,840 not including any sickness etc.

you take out of that a new car every 3 years, his tax, petrol, insurance etc and the poor bugger hasn't got much to live on as it is.

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Originally Posted by Rollo

I think ALL drivers should be retested every 5 years as part of regular licensing requirements.

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In order to achieve that, pretty much everybody would have to become a driving instructor in order to deal with the backlog!

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Originally Posted by Flat.tyres

ok Rollo, let me explain.

at the moment, the test can be taken on your 17th Birthday and you can jump into a bently twin turbo if you have the dosh.

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Not here you can't. All Bentleys are insurance group 20 and you have to be 25 before you can have any car in that group.
I would support more age-banding with insurance groups, plus tighter rules, enforceable by spot-checks, regarding modified cars.