that quite an aggressive response, Kiwitahi was only expressing his opinion. plus he is new to the forums, and is a fan of rallying, so I really think you should try and be less rude in your posts.Quote:
Originally Posted by N.O.T
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that quite an aggressive response, Kiwitahi was only expressing his opinion. plus he is new to the forums, and is a fan of rallying, so I really think you should try and be less rude in your posts.Quote:
Originally Posted by N.O.T
I do think you might be being a bit harsh on Tommi there. Colin in the Subaru, Carlos and Didier in the Corollas and Burns, Eriksson or Kankkunen sure would of scared me more than Mikko and co.
Its not luck that hes a champion. Its not luck that he never ever makes a mistake while at the same time setting fastest times. No ones downplaying what Sebastian has done or trying to upset the Loeb fanclub. Records wise he is the most successful.
I just don't like comparing statistics across generations. Theres too many complications.
I'm not Loeb fan by any means, but somehow somebody seems to forget all the record he has broken over the past 9-10 years. I'm just all down to numbers and they don't lie. Loeb is the best ever according to numbers (by a mile), we can all argue about who has the most talent which is more down to individual preferences and therefore irrelevant :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Kiwitahi
I'll agree on your last sentence, too many complications for comparing different generations.
Shame, but this time i have to agree with N.O.T. about Loeb :)
About Tommi's titles, i can also put up a wordfight with you :) , this is my opinion (don't take it too seriously though cause everybody vcan find excuses):
Carlos - too unlucky, could've had at least 1-2 titles during that period
Colin - too unreliable, crashed a lot, otherwise phenomenon
Didier - was past his prime
Eriksson (???) - not a contender by any means, down to at least one level if we compare him with Tommi, Carlos, Colin, Juha...
Kankkunen - almost past his prime
Burns - was just a "schoolboy", his prime started during 1998
Loeb has been up against almost all of the mentioned drivers + Grönholm, Petter, Märtin, Panizzi (tarmac), Hirvonen, Latvala, Rovanperä, Galli and more.
You are right, there is really no other way to measure, but the results, everything else does not mean anything, because his job is to win, first Championships then rallies.Quote:
Originally Posted by cali
I do not see much news or rumours in the last coupe of posts, even more we had the same ""who is the greatest rallydriver"" discussion many times before. Go start up a new treat for this never ending discussion and leave this one for news and rumours.
thanks :)
Stoneacre Ford Rally Roadshow:
http://www.maxrally.com/news/entry/y...d_rally_event/
http://www.m-sport.co.uk/index.php/n...rally-roadshow
The roadshow will be held at the Stoneacre Ford branch on Seamer Road in Scarborough (on Thursday 23 September and will run from 5:30 – 8:30pm).
Cali - how old are you. Where you just a playing kid when Makinen, Kankkunen, Burns where fighting?Quote:
Originally Posted by cali
You must have been because you just don´t seem to have all the facts. Makinen lucky? No. Sainz unlucky? Yes one time. Burns? - 0ne of the greatest. He was the best ever driver driving in fog. And was unlucky when he signed the frog team in 2002. And of course went ill and sadly died. He would have proved a lot if he´d lived on.
So Loeb who won most of his titles when all these master was gone is one of the best but please don´t give him the skies. He´s just one of them all!
Sorry, I'm old enough to remember even H.Toivonen driving though i was a kid back then. Like I said in my previous posts, you can find any excuses you want, but the number will speak for themselves. Maybe our kids will remember Mikko and JML as masters, generations will change but facts will remain the same :) Enough OT from me ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Rallyper
It's quite pointless discussion. Talking about what would have been if... leads nowhere. In that point every possible statement has dozen adequate replies.
Just an example... What would be if Loeb stayed in gymnastics? Would we call after some time Latvala, Sordo or Hirvonen legends like Sainz, McRae or Burns? Most probably yes because they would have epic fights for titles. Unfortunately for them Loeb came in and gave others no chance.
Telling that he kept winning for almost a decade just because there weren't any drivers like in good old days is short-sighted. There is no reason why good drivers would have suddenly been missing in the world.
As some here already stated, what matters is facts and statistics. In achievements Loeb is by far the best driver ever. There's no discussion about that as it's simple fact. Alternative histories are good for movies but don't count in reality.
By the way a sentence saying that "the good old times will never return since present time is just messed-up" is as old as history of man kind, it was found written on five thousand years old ancient column :)
Point and statistics is true yes - for the number man. If you have a heart and been aware of the drivers thrue the centuries you will never say LOeb is the one and only. There are more drivers obviously.Quote:
Originally Posted by cali