Is There a God?

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Originally Posted by ioan

So what exactly is that I didn't understand?!
With regret I have to say that you don't understand what you read and write. .

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Really? In the future I’ll try to correct this….

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Originally Posted by ioan

BTW I'm not sure what you Matache market is, I personally learned history from books not from your neighboring market, nor from the soap operas. .

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“ Matache Macelaru’ ” is a famous market in Bucharest. Its name sounds so trivial to me that I often associate it with this city’s boorish. :laugh:

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Originally Posted by ioan

People working in the Securitate were not closing their eyes to anything, every person over whom they've got an information has been interrogated and the means they were using were in many cases extreme.
Many thousands of people have been imprisoned for life and/or sentenced to hard work at the Danube / Black See channel, and you have think these brutal beasts were turning a blind eye to the information?! Tell that to all those poor political prisoners and to their families!
And those priests you try so hard to protect were the ones who spilled teh beans for many of those thousands who roted in prisons and in work camps! .

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I’m not trying to protect priests- why should I ?-. I’m only trying to see the the 2 sides of the coin.
I’m tired to explain you that the communist period in our country had different stages.
All of them were horrible but you can’t compare the Stalinist period with the 70-80’s years. The first is associated with the crimes you mentioned ( let’s not forget that the work at the Channel as a punishment for bourgeoisie was ceased in 1955 ) and also with a resistance movement. I’ll be glad if you can tell me the name of a priest who denounced in that period.
In the years of Ceausescu’s regime, Secu’ was still a fearful institution but however we felt somehow a liberalization. I dare say it was the period when Secu’ expanded its network of informers and priests were not exception. Let’s not forget either that Secu has its own role when Ceausescu was ousted.

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Originally Posted by ioan

Sure it is a fact, and the proof is where?!
How many of them turned into secret police informants and how many did something good. If you knew the facts you might be surprised. Though it seems that you are a bit misinformed. And BTW even though they have been proved to have been secret police informants those priest are still part of the church and still preaching to people about their gods teachings! Funny eh?! .

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Maybe you forgot that I’m aromanian and (too) many members of my community were political prisoners. I had relatives who spent about 17 years in those jails and it’s a miracle they survived.. One of my sources is their testimony. If they lied then I also lie you.

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Originally Posted by ioan

I'm not into religion, as you might have already realized, hopefully, so I don't really care about any one cherry picked examples of yours. I'm sure you know it by know, given how knowledgeable you are, that picking one case to counter another thousand is not really useful, though it might work well with the masses. :p .

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Sorry but you shouldn’t be religious to have knowledge of a special man. You can’t ignore a personality just because he was a priest.
BTW if the proportion is 1 to 1000 let’s be useful: I named one now it’s your turn to name 1000 delation priests to counterbalance my example. :laugh: With proofs of course….

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Originally Posted by ioan

I've read not so long ago a story about a priest who recently did something good for the village that he is assigned too and I say good to him that's a person who deserves praise, the problem is that he's one of the very few priests who do such things even though the Church has the means (read money) to help the people in need.

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First of all the orthodox church is not as rich as the catholic one. But how can you know such cases when you live abroad and your information is based on what you read from time to time about what’s happening here? Charity is not a thing to make fuss of. and a lot of people does it keeping it in anonymity.

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Originally Posted by gadjo_dilo

Sorry but you shouldn’t be religious to have knowledge of a special man. You can’t ignore a personality just because he was a priest.
BTW if the proportion is 1 to 1000 let’s be useful: I named one now it’s your turn to name 1000 delation priests to counterbalance my example. :laugh: With proofs of course….

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Huh? Don't you think you are getting a bit over excited there? 1 to 1000?!

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Originally Posted by ioan

Huh? Don't you think you are getting a bit over excited there? 1 to 1000?!

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Who? Me???!!!?!

To quote you " given how knowledgeable you are, that picking one case to counter another thousand is not really useful ". So it's you who choose the proportion. I picked up a case and I'm still waiting for your 1000....

I believe there is a God. I find it very fulfilling to live my life believing that there is.

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Originally Posted by gadjo_dilo

Who? Me???!!!?!

To quote you " given how knowledgeable you are, that picking one case to counter another thousand is not really useful ". So it's you who choose the proportion. I picked up a case and I'm still waiting for your 1000....

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It looks to me that you either do not understand what you post or you are just looking for a fight, which you wont get, I hope it's the later.

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Originally Posted by ioan

It looks to me that you either do not understand what you post or you are just looking for a fight, which you wont get, I hope it's the later.

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It looks to me like she called your bluff and you have nowhere to go with it. It is a quote.

[sarcasm]I change my vote! I am no longer an atheist.

Long live Frigga...[/sarcasm]

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Originally Posted by 52Paddy

I believe there is a God. I find it very fulfilling to live my life believing that there is.

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Why? If you didn't believe in God, would that mean that your family, possessions and feelings would be less fulfilling? I'm not sure I see the connection.

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Originally Posted by gloomyDAY

Why? If you didn't believe in God, would that mean that your family, possessions and feelings would be less fulfilling? I'm not sure I see the connection.

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If I didn't believe in an afterlife, maybe. I can't answer that because I do believe in God. Anyway, the fulfilling part of my life is not solely bound up with family and possessions. Living my life by God's word, to the best of my ability, makes me feel good inside and also confident about a place in heaven. Having a relationship with God is like having a really solid friend continuously by your side and that is fulfilling.

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Originally Posted by 52Paddy

If I didn't believe in an afterlife, maybe. I can't answer that because I do believe in God. Anyway, the fulfilling part of my life is not solely bound up with family and possessions. Living my life by God's word, to the best of my ability, makes me feel good inside and also confident about a place in heaven. Having a relationship with God is like having a really solid friend continuously by your side and that is fulfilling.

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Well, I do respect your belief in God, but as an atheist I still find it hard to believe that there is some omnipresent-being who is constantly by your side. I guess I like the fact that I can be in control of my own life.

I'd probably end up getting stoned to death for apostasy if I were in a Muslim-led nation.

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Originally Posted by 52Paddy

If I didn't believe in an afterlife, maybe. I can't answer that because I do believe in God. Anyway, the fulfilling part of my life is not solely bound up with family and possessions. Living my life by God's word, to the best of my ability, makes me feel good inside and also confident about a place in heaven. Having a relationship with God is like having a really solid friend continuously by your side and that is fulfilling.

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It's nice to see someone that is at peace with his faith. and this doesn't mean that "I see it how he sees it."

It would be so cool if we all followed the Golden Rule which simply states that we are to treat other people as we would wish to be treated ourselves.
*not to be confused with "whoever has the gold, makes the rules."


And we will be closer to all be at peace. :andrea:

Now I will switch my peace mode to: Spain will destroy Portugal today in the Eurocup. :D

:s mokin: