I'm pretty sure that Pike's Peak did count for AAA Championship points from 1948 to 1955 but not after USAC took over in 1956 or CART in 1979Quote:
Originally Posted by Stan Reid
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I'm pretty sure that Pike's Peak did count for AAA Championship points from 1948 to 1955 but not after USAC took over in 1956 or CART in 1979Quote:
Originally Posted by Stan Reid
Thanks D-Type. I didn't start to seriously follow racing until 1958 (heard Jimmy Bryan win the Indy 500 on the radio that year) so I was never familiar with the AAA points system.Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Type
i could be mistaken, but I don't believe that CART ever had any involvement with Pikes Peak or in counting it toward their championship.Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Type
My firsts in following racing:
The first race I attended was a local jalopy type stock car race in about 1949. I was only about 3 years old so all I remember is a lot of crashes and some fires.
The first major race I attended was an IMCA Big Car (the old name for sprint cars) race in 1951 at Peoria Exposition Gardens. Frank Luptow was the feature winner.
First race on radio-1958 Indy 500 won by Jimmy Bryan.
First USAC Championship Race attended-the Springfield 100 won by Len Sutton in 1959.
First event attended at the Indianapolis Motor Speedway-1964 pole qualifying day-saw Jim Clark take pole position.
First Formula One race attended-1979 U. S. Grand Prix at Watkins Glen won by Gilles Villeneuve.
All five drivers I listed above entered at least one World Championship event.
The first driver to compete in the Indianapolis 500 with only one leg was Al Miller.
The last one legged Indy 500 driver was Cal Niday.
The only other Indy 500 driver to run with a prosthetic leg was Bill Schindler.
It looks like the AAA points were the same as USAC except that USAC didn't award points in races that were scheduled to run fewer than 100 miles.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stan Reid
There have been two (and soon three) father-son-grandson racers in the Indy 500-Bill Vukovich Sr., Bill Jr. plus Bill III and Andretti-Mario, Michael and Marco. This year, Matthew Brabham is scheduled to start to add to dad Geoff and grandpa Jack.Quote:
Originally Posted by D28
The first Unser to race in a World Championship event-Jerry Jr.(1958 Indianapolis 500)
The last Unser to race in a World Championship event-Bobby(1968 U.S. Grand Prix)
The first time three World Championship event drivers were killed in racing crashes on the same day-July 29 of 1951-Cecil Green, Bill Mackey and Walt Brown
The last time three World Championship event drivers were killed in racing crashes on the same day-June 19 of 1960-Chris Bristow, Alan Stacey and Jimmy Bryan
Corrections welcome
I had forgotten Bobby Unser's appearance at the 68 USGP, though I witnessed it; safe to say his F1 career wasn't a huge success. Just recently I learned that this was not his first F1 outing; both he and Mario Andretti were entered in the 68 Italian GP for BRM and Team Lotus respectively. They practiced at Monza on Fri, Andretti setting a very quick time for Lotus, Unser's time, I do not know. Both flew home together to race in the Hoosier 100 on Sat, then flew back to Monza for Sunday morning. Race officials promptly disqualified both from the Grand Prix because they had raced elsewhere within 24 hours. Andretti's time from Fri would still have been good enough for a 7th grid position. The heavy hand of Ferrari is suspected, either directly protesting both drivers, or influencing race officials to ban them.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stan Reid
It was Andretti, not Unser they were concerned about, and with good reason, he put the same Lotus on pole for the USGP a few weeks later. This race was Unser's first and last start in F1.
I believe (correction welcome) the first father-son racers in the Indianapolis 500 were Earl Devore (1925-1928) and Billy Devore (1937-1948).
Billy was also the first driver to race a 6-wheeled car in the Indianapolis 500 (1948).
Earl was the first and last Indianapolis 500 driver to die being eaten by a shark (1928).
Interesting. If the criteria were changed to father/son running a major international race, could the Devores be the first? They would be quite a bit earlier than the Ascaris by about 10 years.
I would go with that right now D28. Earl actually won a major event; the 250 mi./400km. AAA Championship race on the 1.25 mi./2 km. board track near Charlotte NC in 1926. I don't see any wins on that level by Billy, born Louis Devore. The younger Devore did enter two World Championship races; the 1950 and 1954 Indianapolis 500s but he failed to qualify on both occasions. Years before 1937, when Billy began driving in the Indianapolis 500, he was a riding mechanic in the event.Quote:
Originally Posted by D28
The first and last engine purpose built for the Indianapolis 500 that was later modified to race in Formula 1 was the 1964 Ford 4-cam V-8 Indy engine that was later downsized and raced in the McLaren during the 1966 F1 season.
Correction welcome
And it must be said the conversion was a disaster for F1 racing. the engine and gearbox were too heavy and the hp inadequate. A rare dead end for McLaren, as Bruce spent most of the 66 season trying to get the Ford unit to work. Ironically, he had a lot of experience with the Traco modified Olds engine in sports cars, the same block that Brabham and Repco used to win 2 World Championships. A Ford F1 effort was being pursued independently by Colin Chapman and Cosworth, and evolved into the most successful F1 engine ever. McLaren eventually acquired one of these and things were fine, but first they had to go through the Ford, Serenissima and BRM engines on the way.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stan Reid
Six wheel -three axle cars as best I can tell:
First 6 wheel/3 axle circuit racing car to compete in a major series=Pat Clancy Special Kurtis Offenhauser in the 1948-1949 AAA Championship=2-4 layout=Driven by Billy Devore, Jackie Holmes and Mack Hellings=Best finish - 4th in the 1949 Milwaukee 100 by Jackie Holmes
Last 6 wheel/3 axle circuit racing car to compete in a major series=Tyrrell P34 Cosworth in the 1976-1977 Formula 1 World Championship=4-2 layout=Driven by Jody Scheckter, Patrick Depailler and Ronnie Peterson=Best finish - 1st in the 1976 Swedish Grand Prix by Jody Scheckter
I actually saw Ward race in the 1959 Springfield 100 but his luck ran out that day. Four laps into the race, he burned a piston (probably too much nitro) and "finished" in last place.Quote:
Originally Posted by D28
Yes, the McLaren-Ford could do no better than a 5th place in the U.S. Grand Prix.Quote:
Originally Posted by D28
I had forgotten that result. Still a quick comparison with the Cosworth engine in F1 would read:Quote:
Originally Posted by Stan Reid
Ford Indy Engine 2 points Ford-Cosworth Engine 4336 points.
Of course the Indy engine was very good at what it was designed for, which was not F1.
Although it was the first rear engine to race, I believe the first rear engined car to enter and practice for a World Championship Race (the 1950 Indianapolis 500) was the Rounds Rocket, a Lesovsky-Diedt Offenhauser. Indy practice began on May 1 of 1950 (almost 3 weeks before Monaco FP1) and the car was driven by both Sam Hanks and Bill Vukovich. Neither of the two future winners could get the car up to qualifying speed. The Rounds Rocket was a 4.5 liter normally aspirated racer so it was fully Formula 1 legal. I believe Al Miller also practiced one of the old Gulf-Millers in early May and it failed to qualify as well.Quote:
Originally Posted by D28
Attachment 974 Click to enlarge
Rounds Rocket
A beautiful machine ahead of its time, I'd say.
I agree and if those two couldn't get it into the show, then no one could. This was the second year of trying as the car debuted in 1949(post #67)Quote:
Originally Posted by Stan Reid
Yes, rookie Bill Taylor was the driver in 1949 and was only about one mph short of making the field even though the car was excessively heavy. Taylor returned to the track in years following 1949 but never qualified for the race. In 1950, Hanks went on to qualify a conventional car and Vukovich tried to qualify a Maserati but didn't make the field in that either.Quote:
Originally Posted by D28
Matt Brabham is set to start this year's Indy 500 from the 27th position. There is one other "sorta" three generation family group of Indy 500 starters. Foyt adopted his grandson so A.J., his stepson (bio grandson) Larry and grandson A.J. Foyt IV would be three generations on paper but not biologically.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stan Reid
Please explain the AJ Foyt family more clearly - I'm totally confused. :confused:
Yes, Larry Foyt is Indy winner Foyt's biological grandson who he adopted as his stepson after some sort of family issue. Larry is also A.J. Foyt IV's cousin as well as his step-uncle. Larry's biological mother is also his step-sister. That clears it up I'm sure.:DQuote:
Originally Posted by D-Type
First and last car to win both a Nascar Championship and an Indianapolis 500:
The 1939 Wetteroth Offenhauser won the 1941 Indianapolis 500 with Floyd Davis and Mauri Rose sharing the wheel. In 1952, the same car, now with a Cadillac engine, won the championship in Nascar's short lived Speedway Division; this time with Buck Baker driving.
Corrections welcome
Not counting the Indianapolis 500, the first World Championship Grand Prix with two American drivers was the 1953 Belgian Grand Prix with Harry Schell and Fred Wacker.
Corrections welcome
Not counting the Indianapolis 500, the first World Championship Grand Prix with more than two American drivers was the 1958 French Grand Prix with 4 - Harry Schell, Troy Ruttman, Phil Hill and Carroll Shelby.
Corrections welcome
Not counting the Indianapolis 500, the first World Championship Grand Prix with five American drivers was the 1959 Portuguese Grand Prix with Harry Schell, Phil Hill, Carroll Shelby, Masten Gregory and Dan Gurney.
Corrections welcome
Not counting the Indianapolis 500, the first World Championship Grand Prix with six American drivers was the 1959 United States Grand Prix with Harry Schell, Phil Hill, Roger Ward, Harry Blanchard, George Constantine and Bob Said.
Corrections welcome
First and last non American to compete in the World Championship era Indianapolis 500 (1950-1960) - Alberto Ascari of Italy in 1952.
Not counting the Indianapolis 500, the first American to finish on the podium a World Championship Grand Prix was Masten Gregory who finished third in the 1957 Monaco Grand Prix.
Corrections welcome
Not counting the Indianapolis 500, the first American to finish second in a World Championship Grand Prix was Harry Schell in the 1958 Dutch Grand Prix.
Corrections welcome
Not counting the Indianapolis 500, the first American to win in a World Championship Grand Prix was Phil Hill in the 1960 Italian Grand Prix. It was also the first time Americans finished 1-2 (WC) with Richie Ginther in the runner up spot.
Corrections welcome
Not counting the Indianapolis 500, the first time two Americans finished on the podium a World Championship Grand Prix was the 1959 German Grand Prix with Dan Gurney/second and Phil Hill/third following winner Tony Brooks.
Corrections welcome
Pre- World Championship, Jimmy Murphy and Ralph DePalma were 1st and 2nd in the 1921 French GP
The last (mechanically driven) supercharged Championship (Indy) Car to win a race in that series was Roger Ward's #8 Wolcott Special that won the 1957 Rex Mays 100 at Milwaukee. It was a Lesovsky roadster with a 170 cubic inch Offenhauser engine that was boosted with a centrifugal type supercharger.
Corrections welcome
The last major race won by a car with a straight eight engine - the October 16, 1955 Targa Florio won by Stirling Moss and Peter Collins in a Mercedes-Benz 300 SLR.
Corrections welcome
The first and last NASCAR premier series (now Sprint Cup) race won by a car with an OHC engine was the 1954 International 100 in Linden, New Jersey won by Al Keller in a Jaguar XK-120.
Corrections welcome
Here's the car. If you are wondering how the engine and driver can be on the same side of the chassis in an upright roadster, it's because the Offy was mounted on about a 15 degree angle which allowed the driveshaft to pass to the outside of the driver's right hip.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stan Reid
Attachment 1017 Click to enlarge