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I don't quite enjoy the concept of having qualifying and the race in the same day. Personally, I got up (kinda) early to watch the race, but I don't think I could be bothered to get up four hours before to watch qualifying. I prefer F1's timetables, where you get both qualifying and the race at the same time - and that's usually a very reasonable hour.
For you maybe! :hmph:Quote:
Originally Posted by N4D13
OK , guys , I actually got up to watch the race , and saw the start , but in the end , couldn't deal with 4:00am , and went to bed .
I' seen the dopey Prost move at the end of the race , but I've heard nothing of the car switch .
So , how did that all go ?
Or , did they switch at all ?
Sat down to watch the race and passed out before it even came on!!
I have not seen any of the race except the crash, but that was enough for me to make Prost the donkey of the year, if not the decade. Unlike the Mercedes clash, there is not even any room for doubt about what happened.
That was the dirtiest piece of driving I have ever seen. He was not even turning into the corner because they were not there year. Prost just violently swerved over and collided with Hiedfield on the straight. This was far worst than anything I have even seen even Schumacher do.
I'm sure Prost will contend that he is entitled to his "one move" to defend his position. Today was the ultimate demonstration of the fallacy of that kind of rule. One move, if it is bad enough, is also bad enough to potentially kill someone.
You're right , Doc .
That was a pretty gnarly move .
He says he didn't see him .
In his defense , you can see him look to the right at least a couple of times down the straight . So , he must have been expecting a car outside .
And , it was a move that was logical to keep the position , moving to stay on the inside .
BUT , it should have been dead obvious that Heidfeld was there .
If he couldn't see him , there is something wrong with his eyes , as he was right there .
If he wasn't looking , there is something wrong in his head , as he was right there .
It could've been a "deliberate , but instinctual" move , as he's said that that was no place to make a move inside , when there was a ton of room .
And , it could be that the car suffers the same extreme lack of peripheral sighting as an F1 car , making these incidents far more likely to occur when the cars are close to each other .
He certainly deserves some serious sanction , though , all that said .
Fair enough. Let's call it a very reasonable hour for Europeans!Quote:
Originally Posted by Tazio
Is prost a total douchebag or what? I thought it was lame of him trying to blame Nick for the accident right after the race , but now, after having a chance to view a replay, he still holds the same contention.
Two things; I never knew Nick was such an even-tempered/nice guy, and even though a 10 place gid penalty is a lot on street courses, I think Prost needs to be hit in the wallet or some other added sanction, what an ass-clown.
Quote:
Heidfeld told AUTOSPORT: "It doesn't help me. It would have been amazing to come away from the first Formula E race with a victory, but instead we are leaving with nothing except a damaged car.
"I had been saving power and got a really good run out of the second to last corner; I was better on braking for the last corner and he braked early anyway.
"I was next to him and he moved over on me. That is clear, but he is a friend of mine [and team-mate at the Rebellion Racing World Endurance Championship squad], so I know he didn't do it on purpose."
Prost, meanwhile, accused Heidfeld of "totally overcooking it".
"The speed of the impact [with the wall] shows that he was going too fast," he continued.
"I was just starting to turn in at that point and he tried to dive-bomb me.
If he didn't see him, why else would he swerve over like that? I don't see anyone beside me so I am going to violently swerve just for the hell of it? His explanation makes no sense.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bagwan
Certainly, but you can't make the move when there is already a car there. If you take the inside and hold the inside, that's fair, but swerving over to block the other guy is, uhhhh, blocking.Quote:
And , it was a move that was logical to keep the position , moving to stay on the inside .
That one looked more like "deliberate but premeditated."Quote:
It could've been a "deliberate , but instinctual" move.......
Drivers know they can get away with this sort of thing and they will keep doing it until someone gets killed. Heidfield was extremely lucky.
The FIA will do nothing. They want this kind of driving. They don't understand that making the drivers race clean produces good racing. The FIA seems to think chopping, blocking, swerving and putting your opponents into the fence is what racing is all about.Quote:
He certainly deserves some serious sanction , though , all that said .
Instead, they want dirty driving and "Fan boost" to spice up the show, when all they really need is clean racing.
Like I said, they will allow this sort of thing until someone gets killed, except someone already has.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pnba5zRNskU
I felt the car change ruined it a bit to be honest. It seems to have so much of an effect on the race, people losing 4 or 5 positions or gaining the same, which seems a bit unfair.
Ultimately it gave us the race we had at the end, but it still is a bit strange
Doc, a ten place grid penalty isn't nothing. It isn't enough in my opinion, but only because Prost is continuing to try and blame Nick for the crash, and refusing to take responsibility, as I stated earlier.Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc Austin
Whether or not the FIA want this type of racing doesn't really seem to figure into the severity of the penalty that Prost has to serve for the next race AFAIC.
I'm going to have to disagree with you mate. The pit change is actually very fair. With a pit lane speed limit, and a mandatory 50 second wait as a safety precaution to make sure you are properly strapped into your second car. The only variable is how fast you can get out of the first one and run about 2 meters to the second.Quote:
Originally Posted by steveaki13
I would much rather see them run two separate heat races.Quote:
Originally Posted by steveaki13
Want to bet on whether or not Prost drives dirty again before the year is out? I say he does. 10 grid spots isn't going to deter him the next time a win or podium is on the line.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tazio
Today's drivers can't help themselves because they grew up watching Prost, Senna and Schumacher do it. Not only did Schumacher master the chop, block and swerve, but he was almost universally revered for his "hard but fair" driving. It's no wonder today's drivers think ramming another car is ok because their heroes made entire careers out of dirty driving.
Schumacher came right out and admitted that he tried to crash Villeneuve and they threw him out of the championship for that year. I think it's only fair they throw Prost out of the 2014 championship before he kills someone.Quote:
It isn't enough in my opinion, but only because Prost is continuing to try and blame Nick for the crash, and refusing to take responsibility, as I stated earlier.
I don't really think that they want it. They just don't want to do anything to stop it. The Nico/Lewis accident has brought more attention to F1 than almost anything I can remember since Rubens had to give the Austrian GP to Schumacher. This sort of thing gets press and viewers, and the FIA doesn't want to interfere with that.Quote:
Whether or not the FIA want this type of racing doesn't really seem to figure into the severity of the penalty that Prost has to serve for the next race AFAIC.
I would too mate, but a 12 or 13 lap race on tight street circuits, doesn't give the guys in back much hope of scoring points for final finishing position. Of course you could reverse the order for the second heat. Tough call Doc!Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc Austin
Massage Doc! ;) N. Prost already has a rep. for dirty driving, but this was the first race of the season. Although, as I stated, I don't think the penalty is severe enough, I have faith the next time will have serious consequences. As for Mike, and JV. that was not the first time Mike had been reprimanded by the FIA in F1, he already had a history. From here on out I have every confidence that Prost will be kept on a short leash.Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc Austin
I think eventually they will figure out how to recharge the things quickly and then they can just race them. The whole changing cars thing is, well, phoney.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tazio
I'm not going to judge the series by one race, or even the first season or so, because the technology is evolving. I think it is a minor miracle they have gotten this far. I look forward to this being a great series, but they have to ditch the gimmicks like fan boost and car changes. I can't think of another race in history where they allowed mid race car changes, and certainly not planned changes.
If they want this to be relevant to road technology, they need to be able to "refuel" the cars the same way the rest of us refuel our road cars, or recharge our hybrids.
That would be a lot of fun.Quote:
Of course you could reverse the order for the second heat.
I'm not surprised. He grew up watching his dad crash Senna on purpose and then Senna crash his dad on purpose. I'm sure he thinks that just how you go racing.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tazio
Getting someone killed would be a serious consequence.Quote:
Although, as I stated, I don't think the penalty is severe enough, I have faith the next time will have serious consequences.
Prost gets a 10 place grid penalty and Heidfield's team loses an entire car, or at least has a big repair bill. Certainly doesn't seem very fair, but fair is not what I expect from the FIA anyway.
And they still did essentially nothing considering he kept his wins and poles and points. He just lost second place in the championship, as if he even cared about second place. They should have let him keep his second place and make him sit out the next season, or at least the first three races. Why not? They banned Verstappen a couple of races in 94 for an accident that was not even his own fault!Quote:
As for Mike, and JV. that was not the first time Mike had been reprimanded by the FIA in F1, he already had a history.
I hope you are right. Today's incident could have very easily been deadly.Quote:
From here on out I have every confidence that Prost will be kept on a short leash.
I agree with you here whole-heartedly, and F-E is in its teething stages. It's too bad that simply changing batteries isn't practical. Maybe they will add KERS in the not too distant future. As for recharging that is fine, but just like adding KERS it will be expensive. They will need a supplier to provide uniform charging systems that are powerful, fast, and safe, that will have to be monitored by race control. All the improvements we want to see have to be cost effective, which means the series has to succeed. I really hope it does, because unlike a lot of my associates that are in their 60's I love change, I'm not afraid of it, in fact I embrace it. Looking forward too riding my scooter up to LA for the US race. :cool:Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc Austin
https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.n...094818e7092383Quote:
Originally Posted by truefan72
...................:sailor: :angel:
They already have regenerative braking.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tazio
Watched it this morning, I thought the racing was pretty good!
Interesting how Heidfeld saved his juice to attack until the last lap, I think he could have had the win there...
Also interesting that the cars were able to follow each other closely without losing performance, unlike in F1.
Not keen on the sound trackside, but onboard where you can hear some revs from the motor and gear changes it's not so bad.
Still not keen on that car change mid race, surely they can get the things to last one race distance with time?
Maybe it would be better long term to have all the teams share the chassis but develop their own powertrains? I appreciate this would escalate costs but it would also force on the development of electric vehicles and give the engineers a real chance to flex their brain power.
Of course what was I thinking :crazy:Quote:
Originally Posted by RS
I don't think anybody is keen on the car changes, including the organizers. Hopefully they will have a solution to that dilemma "with time". I did point out earlier in the thread that I thought the way they handle it was fair and equitable, and am actually curious how Heidfeld jumped 2 cars that pitted on the same lap he did.Quote:
Originally Posted by RS
He is quick Nick, so I guess he leapt out and ran to the other car quicker than the restQuote:
Originally Posted by Tazio
Yep 2 steps across the garage ;) He may have got himself out of the first car much faster than the others, because he sure climbed out of the car after the crash pretty damn fast. But I am sincerely curious if maybe someone in front of him was pulling some kind of shenanigans trying to slow the car directly in front of Nick down. I don't have a recording so that is only an uneducated guess! Were the three line-a-stern when they came in?Quote:
Originally Posted by steveaki13
I was pleasantly surprised that they didn't!Quote:
Originally Posted by steveaki13
To the guy in this forum who talked about the TV pictures, they do need to improve it, but that's the worldwide stream, not ITV4's
I had to switch it off. The background music was awful. Why just why?
I'm surprised about the music too - but don't blame ITV4 because they don't have any control over that!Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark
The reason is clearly because the cars don't make enough noise.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark
I don't like it either, but I didn't find it too intrusive tbh.
Yep, I hope the necessity for a formation lap is reconsidered for future events.Quote:
Originally Posted by steveaki13
Isn't the idea of the formation lap to warm the brakes and tyres? That's just as important for electric cars.
I agree Mark, but when the cars take about 4 minutes to do the lap. They can't be warming much up :pQuote:
Originally Posted by Mark
That's right. They are merely puttering around conserving battery!
Oooh what a pleasure. Unlike F1, FE has got full qualifying and race coverages updates to YouTube pretty much immediately after the event. Great stuff! Then don't have to worry about missing action.:D
Watching the stuff felt like the start of some kind of a new era. Background music is indeed weird. Cars look slooow... Then I saw from data that the top speed at the end of the straight didn't even exceed 200 km p/h. They have really a lot of development to do to match up to some of the other open-wheel-series...
But at least a start has been given. Nice to see Heidfeld fighting right at the sharp end of the field - an opportunity he missed in F1.:D Though in F1 context none of those guys reached particularly high... Hoping to see more of Trulli in the future. And then there are some other guys we didn't get much information about - like the arguable pre-season favourite Buemi.
Indeed some work to do. Most of the racing looked like it was at speeds of F1 cars behind a pace car.
I finally got to watch the whole race and thought it was pretty impressive. I definitely plan to follow the series. I'de like to see Formula E get it's own section here so all the information is in one place and easier to access.
I forgot to mention the car sound... The sound is so... squealy... or I don't know which word to use. That it is pretty hard to listen it for long before wanting to turn off because ears want to have a rest...:)
Well since you asked, here you are ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc Austin
Great. Electric engines are the future.
Nice to see it get its own section.
Robert Llewellyn has been doing a few background vids.
http://youtu.be/SKuFIrEKVwg