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OMG! Rubens Barrichello beats all of those statistics!Quote:
Originally Posted by steveaki13
How many podiums and wins did he have before he was in the fastest car on the grid? Can you count them on one hand?
In their time together, in the same car. Vettel has notched up as many wins as WINS as Webber has podiums. So what does that say?
How many pole positions has Vettel had in that time? 3-4 times more?
Yeah, I agree. He is rubbish.
Then so was Villeneuve, Barrichello and Button all of who only achieved wins and podiums in really fast cars. In fact most drivers in F1 only win in fastest cars.
Any driver that makes it to F1 is a good driver and any who does as well as Webber is a brilliant one, regardless of the car.
I think people need to remember how good all these drivers are and just how good the likes of Vettel, Hamilton and Alonso are.
There is no doubting how much skill these guys have, even the guys in GP2 and other feeder series. But we are not comparing drivers with ourselves, we are comparing them with their peers.Quote:
Originally Posted by steveaki13
And I do not for a second believe that Webber is in any way "brilliant" compared to anyone currently on the grid, with few exceptions.
He is a driver who showed much promise when he came into F1 and then showed nothing special since. He has been very luck to be in the position in which he is, but he is a number #2 driver and can't admit it to himself.
He has had the fastest car since 2009. 4 years. And what does he have to show for it? While his team mate has dominated, he hasn't made an impact. In 2009 or 2010, yes he was a good drivers. He was very lucky that Vettel had two technical failures while leading, (and went kamakazee on him) that gave him a chance - and Webber blew it.
In 2011, WTF. Vettel won 11 races. Webber won 1. And even that was an act of charity from RedBull in hope of getting him #2 in the c'ship. Now #3 doesn't sound bad, but that's 134 point difference.
Where was he last year? 6th.
This isn't a brilliant driver in my book, average, on the level DC, Rubens, even Button.
Webber was really impressive at Jaguar, so it's not just Red Bull.Quote:
Originally Posted by SlowSon
He was only impressive in the Jaguar, nowhere else.Quote:
Originally Posted by DexDexter
I can't spend too much time defending Webber against outlandish statements but if folks keep making them then I feel I sorta gotta. :) I do hope that my buttons aren't being pushed. :pQuote:
Originally Posted by anthonyvop
By you calling Red Bull the BEST TEAM I can only assume that you are saying Webber has been doing the business. He would thank you for the recognition I'm sure.
His performance in the BEST CAR has been exemplary. He has only been headed in the championship by a couple of world champions in the last 3 years. How's this, of drivers who have never won a world championship, Webber has led his category in all of the last 3 years.
In 2009 he was beaten by 2 non-world champions. Vettel and Barrichiello in the BAR with which Button won the championship.
When did JV retire again? 2006, 2007? I seem to have lost his number but if I did ask him I'm sure he is not curled up in a ball over anything Mark Webber might have done all those years ago.
Blocking is defending and if Webber is the worst blocker on the grid then he needs to work on it - even in these long dark DRS days. I would love to see a grid full of blockers but alas that pleasure is denied us by the "push to pass" and DRS fanboys who rule F1 today.
There should be only one team order and that is "you scratch it, you pay for it".
It is not time for Webber to go in my opinion but it is time for him to go for it...
A very simplistic and dismissive way of weighing things up IMO.Quote:
Originally Posted by Koz
Yes.Quote:
Originally Posted by anthonyvop
Considering that he has had the best and fastest car for almost 4 years now, in addition to that he has not had to deal with a top 3 driver as his teammate, he should have won far more. At least Barrichello had the excuse of having the best driver in the world as his teammate, webber doesn't even have that.Quote:
Originally Posted by steveaki13
To that I say:Quote:
Originally Posted by henners88
Unless you guys mean DC and Rubens are great drives?Quote:
Originally Posted by steveaki13
All three have impressive statistics while out of context, but when you compare them to their teammates, it is a different story entirely.
The credit of that lies soley in the hands of one Adrian Newey. And honorary mention goes to Vettel, for doing what the car was capable of doing.Quote:
Originally Posted by Whyzars
Yet, it is his team mate, who has always prevailed by quite a margin (lets take Vettel's engine failures into consideration).Quote:
Originally Posted by Whyzars
Where was he last year?
Where was in in 2011 when his team mate won half the races and Webber had one out of RBR's charity?
Yes, where his younger team mate, only in his second season in F1 beat him. Hum, yes that is impressive.Quote:
Originally Posted by Whyzars
Didn't really impress in the second half of that season either.