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That's true. But in the absense of justice, that's the most viable option to go after. Think about it as if your doctor had a chance to use a certain kind of surgery on you to cure a cancer in you but didn't tell you about it, which put your life in danger. What's the first thing you'd think about doing?Quote:
Originally Posted by Jag_Warrior
I think you misunderstood. All I meant was ALL civil cases are about money. A dollar amount HAS to be attached. The fact that it's about money doesn't affect the validity of the case.Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaparral66
As for the doctor who put me on the road to death by being either incompetent or greedy... it's probably better that I not answer that on a public forum. The first thing that would probably cross my mind isn't something that I'd want to share here. ;)
As for this case, I've read tidbits over the past few weeks. I haven't followed it that closely. I've seen people in the right be wronged. I've seen people in the wrong come out on the right side. But when NASCAR suspended these two goofs, I'd say that gave her case a definite leg up. Nothing about human behavior really surprises me anymore. But whatever happened, if NASCAR wants to save itself on the PR front, it would probably be better to settle this case ASAP. Even if NASCAR wins, it's going to lose.
NASCAR won't lose too much if it makes an honest effort to investigate the issue. If it puts out the window dressing it usually does, everyone will see right through that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jag_Warrior
$225 million seems a bit much for someone who was willing to work until she was FIRED
Mauricia Grant only made maybe $25 thousand a year and her lawsuit is bullmanure imo :p
All of that bullmanure will be a really sweet smell for Mauricia Grant when NASCAR settles with her. And they will. NASCAR has already lost.Quote:
Originally Posted by oldhippie
I hope NASCAR doesn't settle, they should seek justice against the ficticious charges ...
NASCAR should NOT bow down to the race card or the sexual discrimination card ...
if Mauricia Grant had not been fired for not doing her job there would be no lawsuit !
FIGHT for your rights NASCAR & don't bow to the threat of a lawsuit !
Sounds like you've made up your mind already, RFS.Quote:
Originally Posted by RaceFanStan
There is not one person here in this thread who knows for sure whether Mauricia Grant's allegations are true or not. We have to wait and let the legal process work. What I can say is that in my opinion, it's premature to automatically presume her allegations are "just playing the race card" or the "sexual discrimination card" (Jeez, I hate those terms, what an ridiculous and cynical way of looking at it), as it is also premature to presume her allegations are legit, as in "why would she lie?" Most people, when they go and see a lawyer about a case like this, are warned by the lawyer (if he or she is the least bit competent) up front and repeatedly that the public in general is not going to believe the charges, that the plaintiff will be attacked ruthlessly and vindictively, and that most people will assume (not without some level of justification) that it is just about the money. Most forget that the plaintiff must prove her allegations to get a verdict in her favor, and that is a tall order. There is simply no way Grant can win this case just on feeling spited as a result of getting fired. The burden of proof is on Grant. After all that, if she still goes through with it, I for one want to see what she has. NASCAR still deserves the benefit of the doubt until Grant produces something compelling.
But as some people here have noted, and Brian France has acknowledged, two people connected with the case have been suspended by NASCAR (with pay), so there is reason to believe the case by Grant may have merit, but we still don't know yet. We have to let the legal system play forth and see where it goes. Anyone believing one way or the other without seeing any real evidence is kidding themselves.
The bottom-line is that NASCAR's policys don't support discrimination of any sort ...
be it racial, sexual or whatever kind of discrimination, it is against NASCAR's policys ...
NASCAR isn't responsible for their employee's misconduct & she is seeking judgement against the wrong party ...
suing NASCAR for the alledged conduct of her co-workers is a reach & she should lose ...
sue the guilty persons IF they exist but I can't see someone trying to make NASCAR responsible for them ...
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Here is an excerpt from the article linked in the 1st post :
Mauricia Grant, a former tech official in the NASCAR Nationwide Series is suing NASCAR for $250 million
for racial and sexual discrimination, sexual harassment and wrongful termination ...
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It looks like both the "race card" along with the "sexual discrimination card" have been played to me ... http://www.motorsportforum.com/forum...ongue-anim.gif
I guess when you sue a big company you have to play the victim to get the court's attention ...
however company policy does not condone the alledged misconduct, so ...
I think the outcome will be CASE DISMISSED !!!
This is what gets me. These allegations are legal concepts supported by American law outlawing their practice, and we've reduced it to "cards". Just because someone makes the accusation, it's OK to automatically assume they are false and frivolous? I don't understand that. It's not just the two guys who got "disiplined", it's the environment in place that Grant has an issue with. The environment that turned the other cheek after, according to Grant, repeated complaints that went nowhere or had roadblocks put in their place because nobody took her seriously. If that is true, then NASCAR would be responsible since they allowed this treatment to continue by not making a serious effort at following through on her complaints. Then she would be correct in pursuing her complaint in court, presuming her issues are legitimate.Quote:
Originally Posted by RaceFanStan
Don't fool yourself into thinking that just because a big powerful company has anti racial and sexual discrimination policies on the books automatically means they are enforced. There is plenty of documented history of big and powerful organizations who didn't properly police harassment of this kind and it was only after repeated cases being brought up in court did anything happen to put the clamps on it. If you just Google this subject you'll find all kinds of things that happened that certainly are nothing to be proud of.
Now the flip side of this is, what if NASCAR is right? What if Grant didn't follow outlined procedures and make her issues known to people who were in a position to do something about it? What if this is a case of someone not doing a competent job and this is a vindictive action on her part to try to get back at the company? That is certainly a consideration that has to be looked at. It is also worth considering perhaps something prevented the complaints from getting through to the right people. NASCAR is a very big corporation, and anything can happen. As I said in the previous email, the burden of proof is on Grant, as it should be. But it would be in NASCAR's interest to show how that might have happened, and what they would have done had the proper authorities been informed about it. In a sense they have already done that, by suspending the two of the individuals named in the suit. But NASCAR, like any organization, is absolutely responsible for the behavior of their employees. Like I keep saying, we need to let the legal process work and look at all the evidence presented. It's also possible that it could get settled out of court (I can all but guarantee that Grant will not get anywhere close to $225 million, that is a negotiating ploy, so please, quit sweating that figure). That is the only way we will know if her claims are legitimate. And NASCAR has just as much right to defend itself vigorously as Grant has to pursue the case.
My question to you, RFS, is a hypothetical one, but sincere. Suppose your daughter or wife (presuming you have either or both) is getting continually harassed at work or school, and constant complaints are not getting anywhere from a company that has anti harassment policies on the books. The harassment continues, and the stress it creates becomes enough of an issue that it affects her performance on her job, affects the quality of life at home, and because of the complaints, managment stops recognizing her talents and good work history and her progress up the ladder comes to a screeching halt. What would you do? What options would you have to pursue to get some level of justice? Or would you tell your wife or daughter to suck it up, deal with it, and not make waves? I'd be willing to bet if this kind of thing happened to someone close to you, your mindset might be a bit different. If your wife and/or daughter could present evidence of this treament, then you would have an actionable case and could pursue it in court, as is your right as an American. That's what freedom gives you in a democarcy like ours.
1. The best way to address a situation is to to follow the chain of command.Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaparral66
Start with the immediate supervisor & keep going to each supervisor in the chain ...
until one is found that has the management skills to address the unpleasant situation.
2. The low-level supervisors will just want things to go away & won't want to address an issue.
The low-level supervisors are only interested in getting the job done & are insensitive to employee issues.
3. See #1. (I would also support my wife or daughter & encourage them to keep going.)
4. My job would be to provide moral support & tell my wife/daughter that eventually someone will listen.
5. Making waves is something I have always done, I would encourage my wife/daughter to be very vocal.
6. My mindset is to fight injustice wherever it exists.
If my wife/daughter were being harrassed at their job I would urge them to make it known to "upper management".
I would tell my wife/daughter to not take any abuse
I might even let the offending person(s) know that they will be exposed to management.
Most bullies are cowards hiding behind a bluff, when confronted they shrink away & look for a new victim.
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Now back on topic :
I really feel that Mauricia Grant may have faced some statements that could have been taken as offensive,
of course the offending person(s) would say it was just in jest & was only said as a joke.
Too many times people are only looking for a way of cashing-in ...
especially when they are dismissed from their job & are faced with having to find another job. :s
If Mauricia Grant was truly harrassed, she should have made upper management aware of it.
The story just doesn't ring true to me & I suspect Mauricia is just looking for a big pay-off.
As stated before we live in the United States ...
a citizen is allowed to bring suit against anyone they choose ...
and every citizen is entitled to have an opinion on those suits ...
just making an allegation doesn't make it true but now NASCAR has to defend themselves. :s