Stephane Consani's livery for Rallye de France
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Stephane Consani's livery for Rallye de France
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Another dead spectator/photographer... R.I.P
I znowu tragedia na rajdzie - Rallyonline.pl - rajdy samochodowe!
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Tarmac again.
Esapekka Lappi told to MTV3 that he is not getting a change to test Skoda before Poland but he'll takes that a possibility to show his skills. Great attitude! :) .
Also he said that couple non-WRC tarmac events are planned for this year.
Actually he is right. I don't have statistics but I guess maybe 90% of all fatal accidents happen on tarmac and it seems the trend is increasing with the ongoing development of cars and tyres. It's hard to say what shall be done to make asphalt rallying safer as there are many different opinions but not to act at all is the worst solution for the future of our sport.Quote:
Originally Posted by tommeke_B
You know that I'm a fan of hi-speed asphalt events but what is happening is too much. It's not possible to stick our heads in the sand...
I have thought about this also. Probably there is nothing much to be done for the moment in respect to cars regulations.
But I notice something else also. The cars appears to be very safe for the crews, there are rare cases with fatal incidents for them. The majority of the cases the spectators are involved, so it should be their(our) own responsibility (in places with no marshals) to stay at safe distance/places as in tarmac Rally the speed is very high which increases the risk also something to go wrong for a thousand of a second in some corner.
I think that's part of his point.Quote:
Originally Posted by tommeke_B
Yeah the rules for cages make the cars very safe to roll violently..Quote:
Originally Posted by stefanvv
My take---although my experience on tarmac is extremely limityed and only did those few SS with gravel tires, is like always with a "predictable" GOOD surface, different people are attracted to the driving of asphalt events.. since you generally don't need to make a lot of judgement "where" the grip is better, the big question become budget for motors, razor sharp set up and truck-loads of tires so more more "casual" type guys get in and I belive they count on grip---and lose control bad when grip disappears and then you're just along for the ride.. Gravel guys know there is only so much grip and are more keenly aware. If there's more, then good, but they're not trying to shave onion skin thin slices off tenths of seconds every corner.. and are far less surprised and helpless when grip suddenly changes, like disappears....
Add to that the increased cornering speeds once anything is up to speed, even lower power cars, and if you corner faster and are trying for the last 0,01%--you make mistakes..
And spectators die..
I've always looked at asphalt as treacherous.....so simple it fools you.
But what do i know, I only drive dirt and mud and then gravel for 40 years.
It is not always possible to predict what the grip will be at every corner during the race. On recce it might be clean, during the race previous drivers might throw some dirt or little stones on the road. And as drivers rely on tarmac's grip much more heavily than on gravel, there might be such surprises and the time for reaction decreases significantly as the speed is really high.
All of You have part of the truth I think. First is that grip on tarmac is normally much higher than on gravel. That means normally You can take the corner much faster. But what is problem in my opinion that while on gravel Your grip even between the best ad worse place on stages varies quite small and it is still somewhat low on tarmac it changes suddenly from huge to nothing in a fraction of a second and than another bad thing comes because it can in another fraction of second change back from nothing to huge and **** happens because You are just a human and Your reaction on loosing the grip was slower than the tyres found new and You are overreacting.
Tommeke is right that the grip changes a lot on a bad asphalt like we have in CZ or they have in Belgium but in my opinion it's very difficult to be prepared for these changes. It needs a lot of experience and part of the problem in my opinion is that thanks to this You just can drive faster than the old experienced guys because it is really physically possible but You do take a lot of risk which without the experience You are not aware of.
Agree. One fact is also that the difference in static vs. dynamic friction between the tire and the road is much bigger with wet tarmac than with dry tarmac (or with any type of loose surface).Quote:
Originally Posted by Mirek
I don't think that the problem of asphalt rallies resides only on the high speed and the changes on the tarmac grip. I think the main problem is the spectators.
In tarmac rallies you can be really close to the stage, and at least in here Portugal (and I see movies of Spain) the public is almost on the road, not in a safe place (at least the most of it). And when something goes wrong with the car/driver, people don't start running, they get "stuck" looking to see what happen...
I think that to make safer rallies, we need to put a new mentality in rally spectators, specially on tarmac!
Full Wrc 2012 standings Driver, Manufacturers, Stage winners, Power Stage Classements Saison Wrc 2012
Loeb with 2 wins at asphalt rallies and a second at Sardinia can reach 300 points i think
Theoretically - yes. Assuming he wins remaining 3 rounds + most of PS. Ford showed some progress here, it might be difficult...Quote:
Originally Posted by dimviii
Spectators on gravel and asphalt rallies are same. In my opinion the problem is in different thing. On asphalt it is much harder to estimate the outcome of a crash especially for non-experienced people. On gravel the car behavior is quite predictable even for spectators. Crashes when cars take some very strange direction or crashing very suddenly without previous warning are rather rare compared to asphalt accidents when many of the crashes comes out of a sudden and often in very strange way. When You are in a gravel corner where 9 or 10 cars are very wide You expect someone can roll but if You are at an asphalt corner where 9 of 10 cars go like on rails or when You stand behind a small bump where 9 of 10 cars just goes straight over...Quote:
Originally Posted by TheFlyingTuga
On gravel it's much more dust so guys aren't infront of the cars, they're much higher. :D
Interesting...
Khalid F Al Qassimi @khalidbinfaisal A lot of great surprises to come !!!
.....
New future, being the Boss of every thing related in Motorsport. It's a challenge and want to give the sport the Maximum support :-))
Michael Park's anniversary today, 7 years since the accident.
Al-Attiyah and Qatar leaves the WRC?
Al-Attiyah und Katar gehen*:: rallye-magazin.de
The combination of heated, grippy slicks and bumpy/broken/damaged tarmac surface makes it extremely unpredictable. Its not like a racing cirquit with an even and flat asphalt surface. When rally cars lift wheels off the ground because of bumps or jumps and then touch ground again, with hot slicks gripping a dry tarmac surface, and possibly with some steering-lock on, even a world champion driver will end up as passenger. For spectators it is almost impossible to foresee what direction the cars will take, and if they are standing close, they will be in danger. Statistics isn`t always the only truth, but in this instance it is clearly a strong indication that tarmac rallying is more dangerous than on loose surfaces, both for competitors and bystanders.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mirek
Some rumours that the WRC event in Aus may be moved to Canberra. Sounds like a club down there is pushing for the move with govt backing. Not sure how strong the rumour is as Coffs has already said they were hosting the event for 2013.
Once again, Nasser Al-Attiyah is the focus. To the dismay of Citroën read leaked Qatari that the upcoming Rallye de France will be his last ride in the DS3 WRC, and thus the end of the Qatar World Rally Team
In Wales, employed not only the question of the future of life champion Sebastien Loeb the scene, also Nasser Al-Attiyah took care to talk about. Qatari spoke openly about his plans in the upcoming Dakar Rally to use two developed in-house buggies and again skip the WRC season opener in Monte Carlo.
To the World Rally Championship, the 41-year-old seems to have lost interest obviously. He wants the coming year the Cross Country World Cup and the FIA championship contest in the Middle East. Thus should all speculation, Qatar could occur in the future are unnecessary as the main sponsor of Citroën or even a new owner. Instead, was to learn that a former sponsor of Abu Dhabi returns to the World Rally Championship and fills the gap.
Meanwhile, Qatar has already ordered a new 1.6-liter Fiesta RRC for Al-Attiyah at M-Sport in order to keep the opportunities available in the Middle-East championship. Trying to move to build a Citroën DS3 RRC/Turbo-S2000 failed so far. Even the last clouded relations between the two parties
From Thursday 4 to Sunday October 7, 2012, all the special live on SPORT +.
SPORT +, official broadcaster of the WRC, offers subscribers to follow the rally of Alsace France 2012
First time in the rally world, completeness of the stages, 22 stages of the France rally, will be filmed and broadcast on SPORT +.
A single device, made possible by new means of production, with about 20 cameras by ES, including 2 helicopters, 1 aircraft activities, 10 cameras embedded systems and many cameras on the ground.
From 4 to 7 October, the greatest drivers of the world are expected on the lands of Alsace with the regional stage, 8 times Champion of the World Rally, Sébastien LOEB, and also Mikko HIRVONEN, Peter SOLBERG, Mads ÖSTBERG, without forgetting the French Sébastien OGIER, Yvan MULLER and Romain DUMAS.
This new edition of the Rallye de France, Sébastien LOEB will have the opportunity to win not only the round but also his 9th world title.
On-site SPORT + Teams will be closer to the crews, with comments Stéphane GENTI and a consultant. Thomas SENECAL will be on him on the ground at the start and the arrival of the special, but the assistance Park to collect the impressions of pilots and technical teams.
Programmation en direct sur SPORT +
JEUDI 4 OCTOBRE
18h10 : ESS 1 « Strasbourg »
VENDREDI 5 OCTOBRE
09h15 : ES 2 « Hohlandsbourg-Firstplan 1 » et ES 3 « Vallée de Munster 1 »
11h15 : ES 4 « Soultzeren-Pays Welche 1 »
13h45 : ES 5 « Hohlandsbourg-Firstplan 2 » et ES 6 « Vallée de Munster 2 »
15h50 : ES 7 « Soultzeren-Pays Welche 2 »
18h30 : ESS 8 « Mulhouse »
SAMEDI 6 OCTOBRE
08h30 : ES 9 « Massif des Grands Crus-Ungersberg 1 »
10h45 : ES 10 « Pays d’Ormont 1 », ES 11 « Pays de la Haute Bruche 1 », ES 12 « Klevener 1 » et ES 13 « Massif des Grands
Crus-Ungersberg 2 »
16h15 : ES 14 « Pays d’Ormont 2 »
16h45 : ES 15 « Pays de la Haute Bruche 2 » et ES 16 « Klevener 2 »
DIMANCHE 7 OCTOBRE
10h40 : ES 17 « Vignoble de Cleebourg 1 », ES 18 « Bischwiller-Gries 1 » et ES 19 « Haguenau 1 »
12h40 : ES 20 « Vignoble de Cleebourg 2 », ES 21 « Bischwiller-Gries 2 » et ES 22 « Haguenau 2 »
http://www.ffsa.org/article.php?id=25739
Great stuff, only for those who have that channel :p though
@René Are they going to show every stage live?? :eek:Quote:
From Thursday 4 to Sunday October 7, 2012, all the special live on SPORT +
Yes, 22 stages in live ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by bf1_IRL
Chapeau to Sport+
Good to see them getting behind their country's WRC event.
It's said that Abu Dhabi is going to sponsor Citroen next year. Maybe he will join the team.Quote:
Originally Posted by garais22
Khalid can join any team or car he wants! He doesn't even need to sell his limited edition two door Maybach to join a team!! Hahaha
He's doing well and I think he's progressed and he's doing it the right way entering the WRC. I say he should stay one more year in the S2000 and then jump to WRClass! Unlike some drivers who drive a WRCar for 5-6 years and get no where... ;)
Matt, I think you are talking about Yazeed Al-Rahji, but this forementioned article was about Khalid Al-Qassimi. See the difference?
Al-Attiyah und Katar gehen*:: rallye-magazin.de
according this article Nasser will concentrate on RallyRaid in 2013 - e.g. he will join Rally Dakar with two self-made buggys and wants to join more events like this in 2013.
2 weeks ago Citroen talkad about having 70% of the budget for 2012 (from Qatar), but Qatar had ambition to sponsor 100% of Citroen WRT. Now they speak of 100% quiting Citroen. Did Seb Loeb piss off one of the sheiks? Why this 180 degrees turn around?
Oh crap...
Well that's silly of me.... I read it wrong when I first woke up and posted... Sorry
Abu Dhabi with Citroen
Qatar or Kuwait with Ford
Red Bull with VW
Who knows, who knows..
It's too difficult for the partnership Ford Kuwait Qatar!!
Abu Dhabi al rescate del equipo Citroën ABU DHABI TO THE RESCUE OF CITROEN Yesterday seemed like a rumor, but today the sponsorship agreement between Abu Dhabi and Citroën team seems a reality . The accredited journalist Martin Holmes speaks today that the contract would be for the next five years taking the French team of potential trouble that could bring the sales crisis that currently suffers the group PSA .Obviously this movement understood only if accompanied by two others. The first is clear, Abu Dhabi takes months announcing with fanfare that wants to host a round of the World Rally Championship . With the calendar now closed this would occur for the 2014 season. The other could result in the return of an old acquaintance, Khalid Al-Qassimi, one of the standards in competition from the capital of the United Arab Emirates.
For now there is nothing official, but everything seems to be announced during the upcoming Paris Motor Show next to the future of Sébastien Loeb (expected to be known between 27 and 28 September) and the presentation of several model competition among which is the Peugeot 208 R5 and the Hyundai i20 expected WRC .
As for the French, the rumors are that ultimately the decision to challenge Loeb will loose some tests only the second seat sharing official team with Thierry Neuville, while Mikko Hirvonen dispute the whole championship as first pilot.
I was (am) hoping that Loeb would have been man enough to face Ogier and VW for a whole season.Quote:
Originally Posted by Red bull
Loeb is sissy and lucky.Quote:
Originally Posted by MJW