Why not? If it allows at least 10-15 competitive entries for each rally, Rally 3 it is.
Printable View
Why not? If it allows at least 10-15 competitive entries for each rally, Rally 3 it is.
Is there any news since last week or will we be in the dark until the end of June?
Because we are talking about the flagship class of a commercial world championship.Quote:
Originally Posted by macebig
Be honest, would you rather pay for JWRC+ instead of the Rally1s and current top drivers?
Yes. If it allows every rally to be competitive for more than 2-3 drivers, brings back local surprises and helps young talents shine, 100%. Fancy cars mean nothing on their own. Look no further than WEC.LMP1s were much more advanced than the current LMDh/LMH combo. But, LMP1s ended up being a 2 car/1 team affair,while now there are close to 20 competitive entries from 5+ manufacturers and even more teams.
There'll never be a standalone series at JWRC level touring the globe. That doesn't even leave Europe, is only 5 events now, and is subsidised by the FIA. You think drivers would aspire to go from winning their national championships at Rally2 to go round the world in a Rally3? Or even stay at home and drop a class when WRC visits? It's not happening, WRC3 can show you that.Quote:
Originally Posted by macebig
WEC schmeck. Bored of hearing how it's got all the answers. And all this local driver crap too, it's simply not marketable however romantic/nostalgic it is.
The WEC is far from perfect; but they addressed their issues.....and are reaping the rewards. You, and too many others have your heads in the sand.......Quote:
Originally Posted by WRCStan
But WEC did exact opposite of what you described. They opened the class as much as possible while keeping the costs low. It allowed either custom chassis or one of 4 spec chassis, they allowed to use any engine the manufacturers wants, they allowed manufacturers to choose if they want hybrid or not, but they limited aero, power inputs, etc.... Proposed 2026 Rally1 is somewhat similar to that.Quote:
Originally Posted by macebig
Asking for new rules being based on a stock car in 2024 is completely ignorrant to the development in automotive. In the future even Rally2 and Rally3 rules will face troubles to find suitable base cars (but not only cars but also stock-based components, especially engines) and there is zero hope that some other manufacturer will repeat what Toyota did with the Yaris GR.
Are you saying that the Puma is unsuitable become Ford's future Rally 2/ 3 car ? It's the best-selling car in the UK and the trend for such crossovers is strong looking ahead.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mirek
I think mr. Sainz is right, skip Rally1
If we look a little longer in time, FIA can make a safetycell-based Rally2 ruleset that can be the next generation or for teams that don't have a suitable car-option.
https://rallyjournal.com/how-can-the...l07IVYVbzcW_dw
Sent fra min SM-S901B via Tapatalk
You can't base future regulations on something what is on the market today. You have to look ahead in the future. Otherwise you will have to come over and over again with some last minute mess. A successful championship needs long term stability and a stability without taking the future into account is impossible.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fast Eddie WRC
Maybe, if the context is how to ensure WRC survives one more season by only changing the car regs and not tackling the issues, then it looks like I do.Quote:
Originally Posted by AndyRAC
From another POV, mine, thinking a WRC sustains without the manufacturers' might as entrant sponsors is having your head in the sand. That's where the FIA now sit IMO. If they want long term sustainability they need to rip up both the commercial arrangements and sporting principles and think again. Nobody seems to want to have these conversations here but then not enough people understand/take interest in the former, and not enough people even want to see the latter change. But that's where I sit when I support RC1 using Rally1 as proxy.
So you propose... the proposed 2027 Rally1 cars?Quote:
Originally Posted by skarderud
But important question is - what is the future?Quote:
Originally Posted by Mirek
Exactly. I stated here plenty of times in the past that it's a million Dollar question however we can, at least, say what is not the future - and thirty years old model for regulations is definitely one of those things.Quote:
Originally Posted by PLuto
Ask the manufacturers, most have long term strategies.Quote:
Originally Posted by PLuto
They dont know also...Quote:
Originally Posted by WRCStan
Whether they go the 'correct' route and whether they put all eggs in one basket or not is not the point. All have a plan they are working to and can get a marketing team behind.Quote:
Originally Posted by PLuto
So what's better? Long term for nothing or "sailing by sight" with little changes?Quote:
Originally Posted by PLuto
A lesser version actually, the proposed was something between todays Rally1 and Rally2.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenneth
Rally2 as is, a safetycellbased rally2 for teams that not have suitable car.
And i really don't care if the manu's keep up or not, if its Hyundai or Redbull as "brand" .
Sent fra min SM-S901B via Tapatalk
Well but aren't the future Rally1 basically that? Rally2 with safety cell, a bit more powerful and a bit larger aero. So FIA can make a variant with less aero, less tuned engines, limited suspension or something and call it Rally2. Basically like an old LMP1/LMP2 situation.
To me it seems like future Rally1s are closer to today's Rally2 than Rally1, excluding the safety cell.
Dirtfish podcast on this suggests the only long-term future for WRC is to allow whatever car / propulsion / fuel manufacturers want to use and equalise performance through handicapping.
this may sound really weird but "autonomous" "transportation" are "part" of the future, right? if wec is cleaver, they will add that to 24h of Le Mans. where hypercars must do a "1 hour stint on fully autonomous mode". i understand thats really weird, but its a really interesting challenge and it could attract some investments and casual eye balls.Quote:
Originally Posted by PLuto
wrc would get some clicks if one driver starts competing with an "a.i. / gps" as co-driver in one or two events lol totally not what i think motorsport represents but it is a world championship after all. and if we want to talk about future. (meh)
also talking about "the future", after "millenials" and "gen-z" we have the people born after 2011. the "gen alpha".
they are staaaarting to reach that age where people start to get hooked on stuff, like musical genre and sports.
i dont see rallying being on the top of these fellow's lists =/
I doubt AI driving is future of motorsport lol. Chess engines are much better than homo sapiens for years but people still prefer to watch Carlsen vs Nakamura than Stockfish vs AlphaZeroQuote:
Originally Posted by saco0o
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9fv2HR6Sc48Quote:
Originally Posted by Backa
unless alphazero is using a buttplug.................. (weird inside joke, hope you got that lol)Quote:
Originally Posted by Backa
but yeah, no. NEVER, honestly. buuut i dont deny that i'd like to see the '1 hour' (or one lap, whatever) stint at le mans 24h on full autonomous, cuz it seems a place for something like that. or no, whatever, i barely watch that, what am i talking about haha
Wtf are you talking about lol.
hahaha totally off topic, but there was this weird thing last year in the world of chess where a teen beat one of the best players in the competition, but then this older player started saying stuff like that in order to justify his lost and to try to appeal against the teenager, saying he was probably cheating somehow. your regular chess-world stuff hahaQuote:
Originally Posted by Kenneth
It's a very long race in France.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenneth
Yeah that's the only part I get.Quote:
Originally Posted by WRCStan
Btw Andretti said "our goal is to be in every single major sporting racing event in the world" at the opening of their new F1 facility, so I guess they will also aim at WRC with new, open to non-manufacturer teams rules. They are already in Extreme E. Would be kinda funny to see Cadillac go to WRC with them.
I'd be surprised if Andretti knew the WRC existed, let alone consider it a "major sporting racing event".Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenneth
I'm sure if they would be interested in WRC, they could enter way easier than in F1. Subaru USA Andretti version with Semenuk onboard.Quote:
Originally Posted by Doon
They could because WRC will take anyone, F1 can be selective. But why bother? The WRC has little exposure in North America, there's not even an event there. If it's a minority sport in Europe, it's basically non-existent in the USA/Canada. Globally, F1 is a major sport with household names, huge revenue and plenty of sponsorship opportunities. The WRC is none of those.Quote:
Originally Posted by deephouse
You can say that about every single motorsport except F1. Yet Andretti competes in Extreme E, Formula E or Australian Supercars...
i think Michael said that while trying to get an indycar sponsorship, the guy saw a picture of the electric FE car in the Andretti's office and got stoked saying stuff like "oh, does such thing even exist? i want to sponsor that, not indycar". its their current sponsor in FE (they are current champ btw). something similar happened with the extreme-e. the sponsor simply got interested because "oh, its electric? we could use that". so in those cases there was the green washing interest from these partners. in australia they are a partner-sponsor. its not an aaaaactual andretti squad.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenneth
what wrc could bring to them? idk. they are in imsa too? that would make sense but more because its an american series. i heard they want to get in nascar too. those stuff have some values for them. i dont see wrc adding value to anyone right now, which is sad as f*
When and big IF they bring the round in US, it could add some value to them and maybe some interest. But I think they would enter with already made machines and most likely that would be ford.Quote:
Originally Posted by saco0o
https://www.autosport.com/wrc/news/f...ules/10602000/
They say they’re not at war but then go on to say:
“We are fully understanding of the position of where the manufacturers are. They just want to do nothing, nothing at all.”
When asked if the plan is to work on a compromise on regulations with the manufacturers, he added: “I think that is where we are at the moment. That is where the discussion is. We have all the options on the table. We know what the target is and what the aim is.”
Wheatley also clarified the three reasons why the FIA has taken such an intervention to propose changes for 2025 and 2026 instead of focusing on just 2027.
He added: “There were three key elements, the first was Pirelli not committing [to a new tyre deal]. The second, the drivers not wanting to do the championship and the third was, and we always have this discussion about Ford whether they are win or out, but there was an additional layer and that was about Hyundai continuing [in the WRC]. That has been a fundamental change in the discussion going forward.”
The WRC Commission is set to meet again on April 25.”
The Manufacturers have all the power, without them the WRC is dead. They clearly wont or cant accept the proposed changes either financially or in the timeframe.
I see the only solution to getting more cars at the top level being more deals like has been done for Sesks, with WRC Promoter giving some financial support.