Your pretty much right about MSFT and RIM, however I do believe that Apple will survive, won't be a threat to MSFT though, as they did for many decades due to their fanatic followers.Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel
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Your pretty much right about MSFT and RIM, however I do believe that Apple will survive, won't be a threat to MSFT though, as they did for many decades due to their fanatic followers.Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel
Simplified or not, those are the facts as they currently stand. Things may change. And as I've said previously, I can't predict that - no one can. But unless and until Microsoft develops a mobile strategy that consumers are attracted to, they will likely continue to be where they are now. Whether it's based on WP8 or some new Nokia phones, it is not going to change overnight.Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel
As for this continuation of what the world would be like if Apple shut down vs. if Microsoft shut down... to be honest, I've never read that scenario as part of an analyst's report. I know of no one who values a corporation or stock shares based on anything like that.
Look guys, this became (from a U.S. perspective) a Chevy vs. Ford argument a long time ago. In the U.K. or Europe I'm not sure what car brands compete with one another. But again I'll say, people should buy whatever device or brand that best suits their needs. Plain & simple. These fanboy arguments are fun (for awhile) but when I buy a device, I buy that which best suits my needs. I'm not married to a brand. And when I buy (or short sell) a stock, it is based on the best fundamental and technical data that I have access to. If & when MSFT looks like a buy, I'll buy it. I have before. And if AAPL ever looks like a sell, I'll sell it. Though I have preferences, I don't (seem to) have the same emotional ties or disdain that some of you fellows seem to have.
If you like WP7 phones, buy one. If you like Androids, buy one. If you like iOS devices, buy one. Why does it bother some of you that not everybody else in the world likes (or hates) the same things you do? Sorry, but I just don't get that. Or maybe I do: Chevy vs. Ford (Mrs. A's classroom, circa 1974). So yeah, I get it. I'm just getting a bit long in the tooth to rehash it day after day. :dozey:
Still long AAPL. Still happy. Shorted MSFT at $28.25, covered at 24.70 (call it the clockwork trade). Should have bought RIMM at $23+/-, but got nervous about the market gyrations. Prediction for the day: AAPL will hit $425 before MSFT sees $28. That's a touch over 10% on both stocks. But unless the market is soaring, if MSFT does hit $28 again, I'll short it again. I see nothing in its fundamentals to validate a sustained price above $28. Given Google's latest move, I just don't see another (major) player in mobile OS's leaping forward. IMO, it will be, as I said, Android, iOS and Blackberry for the foreseeable future. But we shall see...
All 17000 of them with these patents they can better protect Android against Microsoft and Apple.Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel
One of the points I would like to make is that people like yourselves don't seem to care what companies like Apple do to the competition as long as your stock goes up.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jag_Warrior
You've also missed out that Nokia has announced that they're going to more or less get rid of Symbian on all but the most basic of smartphones and entirely in the USA. Therefore Nokia's marketshare will = WP7 marketshare and Nokia's markesthare at the moment is a lot.......
Nokia to retire Symbian in North America, going all-in on Windows Phone -- Engadget
Then consider that your Samsung's and HTC's might not be particularly happy with Google jumping into bed with Motorola as this will almost certainly mean special treatment for Motorola handsets......
Google's Moto Mobility deal may have had Microsoft roots, comes with $2.5 billion break-up fee -- Engadget
Mango is on the way which will more or less bring WP7 up to the same level as the other mobile OS's are at.
Don't know how big Nokia will be when they finally get their Windows phones out with CEO like Elop ...Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel
Communities Dominate Brands: Coining Term: "Elop Effect" when you combine Osborne Effect and Ratner Effect
All very true, why they haven't had product out yet I simply can't fathom. Saying all of your current products are obselete and then not announcing new product immediately is dumb.Quote:
Originally Posted by DonJippo
The thing is Apple have annexed entire swathes of the market. I know a lot of non-technological people for whom smartphone = iPhone, for them getting another brand wasn't on the menu. Likewise before that for many people portable MP3 player = iPod. Big brands like Sony have tried and barely left a mark on the same market despite producing similar or better products.Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel
Like someone else said with smartphones its likely that you'll end up locked into whichever brand you get first. I've got an android phone and I stand to lose a lot of stuff if I switch to any other format. The same is true for any other mobile OS.
Apple is using their iPod and iPhone to introduce new users to their real moneymakers, the desk and laptops. Its a strategy that is working.
Geeks like you may well say that X or Y is better but the functionality and cross compatibility of Apple products makes it an attractive brand even though other individual competitors may outperform them.
To be honest Apple probably makes FAR more from selling iPhones and iPads than Mac's. IIRC the revenue from iPod's and iPhone's combined is roughly double that which they get from Mac'sQuote:
Originally Posted by Malbec
Did Apple alter photos of the Samsung Galaxy Tab 10.1 in its injunction filing? -- Engadget
Yet more dodgyness from Apple......
Given that you are a huge Microsoft fan, are you sure you want to open that can of worms? More than any company since probably Standard Oil, Microsoft is featured in so many anti-trust and anti-competitive case law studies at major law schools around the country. Have you read Paul Allen's book, where he details how Bill Gates conspired with Steve Ballmer to marginalize (steal) his interest in MSFT... WHILE HE WAS FIGHTING FOR HIS LIFE BATTLING CANCER???!!! Apple would have to work overtime and hire someone to study Microsoft's dusty, old Book of Dirty Tricks and Back Stabbing just to match what they did to Netscape and a great many others. How are you able to criticize Apple and yet ignore the laundry list of things that Microsoft has done over the years??? Chevy vs. Ford? Yeah, Chevy vs. Ford. :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Daniel
But in answer to your question, that's essentially correct. I owned Microsoft at various times, while the charges of their anti-competitive practices were making the news. The sole purpose of a (for profit) corporation is to enhance shareholder wealth. That's it. So any (for profit) corporation which isn't doing that is failing in its mission.
If you want to be at all successful with trading or investing, you should stick with a methodology which is based on quantitative measures and avoid making decisions based on qualitatives as much as possible. P/E ratios, book value, whether or not a company beats avg. analysts' estimates, etc., matter to me on the fundamental side and RSI, stochastics, etc., matter to me on the technical side. Unless the company is facing criminal charges over something it's done, I have no way of quantifying whether a company is nice or mean, good or bad. A company that deals in stolen Holocaust gold and is run by a Colombian cocaine kingpin, who gouges out the eyes of baby seals in his spare time, no, I wouldn't buy their shares, even if earnings were growing 25% year over year.
But lawsuits are how modern companies settle disputes. In the Roman collegia days, one company would send its ex-Legionaries over to plunge daggers into the ex-Legionaries of the other company and the best knives would win. Thankfully, we've come a long way since then. Or at least the modern way is less bloody.
Not at all. That's been widely known and reported for quite some time. And the market has greeted that news with a giant yawn. Nokia has been plagued with severe execution problems for several years. And until the market sees them execute, nothing is a given. Think about it. If people are not buying WP7 and people are not buying Nokia smartphones... how would you add two failures and get a success? I think adding in Nokia will help the WP7 platform, but only if they get it right. An increasing amount of Nokia's business is in cheaper, low margin "dumb phones" in developing countries. That will do nothing for Microsoft or Nokia.Quote:
You've also missed out that Nokia has announced that they're going to more or less get rid of Symbian on all but the most basic of smartphones and entirely in the USA. Therefore Nokia's marketshare will = WP7 marketshare and Nokia's markesthare at the moment is a lot.......
I'm not predicting failure. I'm simply saying that it's not an obvious win.
This is a distinct possibility. But a J.P. Morgan analyst believes that Google may shut down device production at Motorola Mobility and just milk the patents, so as not to offend Samsung, HTC and the others. Also note that Nokia is up on speculation that Google's rich offer for Motorola makes them a decent takeover candidate now. If someone else (even private equity) makes a play for Nokia, I wonder if Microsoft would launch a rival bid?Quote:
Then consider that your Samsung's and HTC's might not be particularly happy with Google jumping into bed with Motorola as this will almost certainly mean special treatment for Motorola handsets......
Lots of possibilities. I have no idea how it might play out. But it is fun to watch.
I honestly haven't heard or read anything really bad about the current version of WP7. It seems that the overall strategy, including the marketing (a Microsoft sore spot in many areas), is more the reason for their lack of success. Will Mango make a difference? I don't know. But it seems (from reviews) that WP7 is a better mobile OS than 6.5, yet WP7 has led to a loss of market share vs. 6.5. If mango is properly featured, then it might help. But if they sit on their hands too long, Apple, Google, HP and RIM will have come up with their own shiny new toys to catch people's attention.Quote:
Mango is on the way which will more or less bring WP7 up to the same level as the other mobile OS's are at.
Tbh Microsoft has been a lot better of recent with this.Quote:
Originally Posted by henners88
Editorial: Google, Microsoft and the incredible shifting mobile landscape -- Engadget
Not sure what this graph actually indicates tbh. One moment you're hearing WP7 has nearly no share now it has 9% (combined with WM! of course)? Tbh there's something very weird about the statistics that we seem to see.....
http://www.blogcdn.com/www.engadget....arketshare.jpg
Interesting to see the suggestions of Microsoft taking over RIM or HTC, though I'm sure the regulators would have puppies if they tried to do that. If they did buy RIM and had BBM integrated with WP7....... *strokes chin* Interesting times.
Well at least there would be a market for it with rioters :D
Of all those possibilities I could see MS buying HTC and rebranding them as Microsoft phones. But where does that leave Nokia?
Well a small piece of a big pie is better than a big piece of a pie that's constantly getting smaller.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark
If HTC were bought by Microsoft though that would negate one of their biggest strengths, their ability to flit between OS's depending on which one is currently strongest.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark
As for Motorola, I've been to a couple of management courses now where their mobile phone section has been used as a specific example of the vicious cycle of failure. I wouldn't have thought their mobile phone design and manufacturing is as valuable as their patents. It wouldn't surprise me if google shut down manufacturing especially as entering into the hardware market entails a significant change in direction and increased risk for them.
It's all about the patents really.Quote:
Originally Posted by Malbec
It gets more and more ridiculous every day.......
DailyTech - Kodak's Patents Maybe be Worth Five Times the Company's Market Cap.
Ridiculous? Not really, knowledge and the rights to it have always been worth a lot more then anything else, it just that nowadays there is a lot of noise about smartphone technology patents due to Apple's stupid court addiction.Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel
Well HP's killing off WebOS
Editorial: Engadget on the death of HP's webOS devices -- Engadget
Love this quote from the comments
Quote:
Launch Pre 3 in the UK on August 17.
Announce that you're pulling out of the smartphone business on August 18.
Problem officer?
I know, but these days you can patent anything and then sue for it even if the idea is just ridiculously basic.Quote:
Originally Posted by ioan
Genuine inventions and innovations should be protected, but not ridculous stuff like the look of a product.
This made me giggle anyhoo.
https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net..._6357682_n.jpg
Some trash talking from Elop
DailyTech - Nokia Chief Warns Android Phonemakers Should "Watch Out"
This can either go two ways, Google starts releasing its own phones through Motorola and pisses Samsung and HTC off, or it just uses the patents to defend itself and all is well. Personally I don't see Google making their own phones, but if Samsung and HTC would be stupid to not be just a little worried right now.
And that's a big problem indeed, but I think isn't the biggest problem of the rotten society we are living in.Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel
I might order myself one of these for a giggle:
'HiPhone 5', fake of Apple
If you don't all run out and get Windows Phones after seeing this you suck!
[youtube]EIz4C93i-U8[/youtube]
DOING DOING DOING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :rotflmao:
David against Goliath. Or is it karma?Quote:
Originally Posted by henners88
Hardly a case of David against Goliath given the size of HTC.Quote:
Originally Posted by ioan
It sounds as if Google did indeed raid Motorola for its patents, which it has passed onto HTC. If so this means they are working together against Apple and that the likes of HTC and Samsung have nothing to fear from Google's Motorola purchase.
This article btw demonstrates the incestuous relationship between a lot of these companies.
Apple and Samsung's symbiotic relationship: Slicing an Apple | The Economist
For starting the patent wars against it's competition.Quote:
Originally Posted by henners88
Location: Tustin, CA, Ameri-cuh!
Time: 1034 PDT
Date: 10SEP11
Weather: 63*F and rainy
Daniel is driving down the street in his Fiat 500 like a BOSS. Suddenly, he stops at a red light and spots a Starbucks on a street corner! Daniel notices that the people inside are wearing flannel shorts even though the weather outside is quite cold and rainy. Daniel chuckles at the notion that anyone would wear such ridiculous clothing at the expense of looking cool, which annoys him. All of them are wearing collared shirts from top designer brands. Daniel imagines that they are conversing about the brutal working conditions of sweatshop laborers in third-world countries, and how they state that they would never buy products from companies that would propagate such deviousness. The irony strikes Daniel with a bit of anger. Finally, what drove Daniel over the edge, is that the people inside this trendy overpriced crappy-coffee establishment are on their MacBooks, iPhones and iPads; they're probably discussing how they're not slaves to a multinational corporation. A cold sweat runs down the back of Daniel's neck. He doesn't feel anything, nothing at all, except rage.
The light turns green. Daniel casually shifts his car into first gear. He slams his foot on the accelerator and aims directly for the green glass-stained windows of this hell hub. His car immediately consumes three patrons as Daniel's little Fiat breaks through the glass. Daniel laughs and yells, "Take that hipsters!" Daniel is just getting started.
A Windows powered laptop is sitting on the passenger side seat. Daniel picks it up and storms out of his car. He begins to beat the customers inside with his Windows machine, but none of these "hipsters" are capable of fighting back after years of believing that their Mac apparatuses can handle every conceivable task. The blood begins to accumulate on the floor. Daniel feels a surge of adrenaline pulsate through his body as he sees a wounded hipster try and escape from underneath his beloved 500. Daniel asks, "Any last words?" The wounded man pleads, "Please...I...I have a wife, kids, and loving fam..." Daniel bashes his head with his Windows powered laptop. The man dies and Daniel lets out a roar of laughter.
Finally, the carnage is laid out all over the Starbucks lobby and Daniel decides to spare the workers. Daniel hops back into his car, puts the car in reverse, and decides to go home.
Awesome :D
Well I am about to get my Streak replaced shortly and will rejoin the masses with a smartphone :D
I'd never really looked at tablets previously, but after missing a bus home earlier in the week I found myself in Curries and was having a look at the tablets in there. I was really going to try and get a look at the Galaxy Tab but no shops seem to have them in. But anyway I picked up an iPad 2 and after having a wee play with it I thought it was actually pretty good, and if I had money and had gone in to buy one, I would probably have walked out with it! Sorry Daniel!! :) Will have to see how the prices of the Samsung go over the next couple of months and maybe splash out on one for my christmas..............
I can believe that Henners. :) A friend of mine had a 2 year old 3GS that had a battery that was overheating and used 15% of it's power to send one text message so she rang me up two weeks ago asking when the new iPhone (if indeed there is one) is coming out and how much hers would be to get fixed as it was so old. I told her to take it to the Apple shop and see what they say. She walked out with a brand new 3GS for £55. Not a bad exchange for her 2 year old phone I thought. If indeed a new one comes out she would most likely be able to get more than £55 back from a mobile phone purchase website like Mazuma.T
A friend of mine also managed to get Apple customer service to replace his 3 year old MacBook for a MacBook Pro for free by reading from a script he'd found on an internet forum while doing some research on the cracked case his MacBook was suffering from. Apple took his creditcard details and said they would charge him for the MacBook Pro if he didn't send his MacBook with the cracked case back to them. Obviously he FedExed later that day. It was worth the extra postage for getting the MacBook Pro for free.
If you look at the profit margin on an iPhone then it makes sense for them to give you a new one and keep you sweet and repair the old one which they'll still sell on for a handsome profit :)Quote:
Originally Posted by henners88
Great service, and as Daniel points out obviously part of the business model, but it seems to vary so much. I know of people who've taken 6 or 7 month old handsets in only to be batted away with the old "water damage" excuse even though they haven't checked the internal sensors and it's well known that the external ones are triggered by such things as having the phone in your pocket, breathing on it when using the microphone, or living in dodgy climates such as most of northern Europe.
It should also be pointed out that other manufacturers do the same thing sometimes as well :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave B
Apple are well known for good service like this. After all most of what you are paying for is the operating system and the development of the phone. The hardware itself isn't that significant.
They also recognise it's critical to keep you as a customer as if you have a bad experience it means you'll change brands so they can't sell you new models and you wont buy apps etc.
It's good to know that when I inevitably water damage this phone, which I have with most of my phones! That I can replace it without having to pay the original purchase price again.
Like I said though, a lot of companies are going away from this. A work colleague smashed the phone on his HTC Desire and rather than getting it repaired and sent back to him, he simply paid a fee and he got a brand new phone.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark
As I say theres more to it than just the phone these days. It's not like they just sell you a phone and that's the last they hear of you any more.
Dunno. Back when Microsoft launched the NoDo update for WP7 which bricked a few phones, they were giving out new handsets as replacements when I've known other manufacturers to sent out brick updates and force refurbs on people. That Apple are more consistent is a good thing it has to be said.Quote:
Originally Posted by henners88
Officially Apple only do supply refurbs I think but in practice it's often new phones.
I had problems with my Nokia's and got refurbs in return which were often more broken than the previous ones.
Tbh a lot of Nokia's have just been broken and you inexplicably chose phones like the N97 for some reason :pQuote:
Originally Posted by Mark
Whata mistaka to maka