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That is nearly impossible. I have seen the solution that such rail guard endings are isolated by using hayballs. Only on the most dangerous places (e.g. outside the corners). It is the cheapest solution and absorbs and bounches the car away very effectively. But does add some cost to the rally organization indeed.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rallyper
Sad news...Quote:
Originally Posted by Mirek
I wouldn't say the kinetic energy of the car is relevant. The force you need to overturn is that required to buckle or better divert the railguard. I would think it's possible to accommodate reasonable protection for limited areas like wheel arches without adding hundreds of kg.
I donīt think your comment is relevant. Trees you can be seen and judge where they are more easy. Those fences can turn up where you donīt wait to see them. They can also be hided in grass and be missjudged by the driver not being at the place you put your car. I think these two accidents tells the seroius matter it is with those guards or fences...Quote:
Originally Posted by N.O.T
But still as you say rallying is a dangerous sport.
Try to think about it more. How would You like to do that in reality? I saw an X5 BMW penetrated all along it's length through V8 cylinder block. You would need something like a snow-plough to make the car safe against such penetration. Here the problem unfortunately is in the type of rails, very little can be done with cars. Maybe they will add some anti-penetration kevlar layers on the motor wall in the future but the real income will be more or less only psychological I'm afraid.Quote:
Originally Posted by bretddog
to ban a stage because of a dangerous componet i think it is not right....because there is not a single safe stage in the world if you go by this logic.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rallyper
Maybe a solution would be the organisers to spot those unecessary hazards and fix them before the stage is run...
but then again at such speeds there are very few things that are not dangerous...so the solution is to make the cars as safe as possible and then count on luck... we had 2 serious accidents in a 3 year span with those guard rails... now count how many accidents with serious injuries we had due to Concrete walls, trees in that time ects and you can see my point.
A tragedy like this, especially when a person at the peak of his youth is involved, cannot be expreesed by any words invented by men so far...
RIP Gareth. I wonder if Craig will withdraw from motorsport as a result.
Itīs still a huge hazard having iron bars alongside the road pointing in the direction against running cars in height just where drivers are placed. I didnīt say or mean ban the whole stages, just places or parts of stages that having such fences. Myabe the amount of possible stages will decrease but in order to put safety first it would be a good way to handle safety in especially tarmac rallies.Quote:
Originally Posted by N.O.T
R.I.P Gareth...
I think there's no obvious solution like this
Rally is one of the most dangerous class of motorsport and, these things are happened some times..
why you consider a guard rail more dangerous than those trees in rallies on the outside of 6th gear bends ??Quote:
Originally Posted by Rallyper
If you put safety first you cannot have any kind of motorsport.
Those rails are there to make road safer, but as i know there aint a thing that cant kill u if u are just unlucky. But yes those old guard rails look dangerus when the ends are not burried.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rallyper
But Iīm not measuring different hazards. Only saying my opinion on those guard rails. I think rallying is not "one of the most dangerous motorsports". Rallying is relativily unharmful compared to many other motorsports.Quote:
Originally Posted by N.O.T
rallying not dangerous compared to other motorsports ??Quote:
Originally Posted by Rallyper
Only Bike road racing is more dangerous...
You risk your life everyday whether be walking to work, or driving to the shop. You risk it during your work and in the shower. Things like this happen and you can't stop it. Safety first yes, but you can't make everything safe. If you were in a Bubble, well it could get poked by something sharp! I send my regards to Craig and Gareth's family and friends. I don't think Craig should stop. I know it would be difficult to go on... but I think he should. But then again I'm not in the situation to know physiologically how someone is like Markko Martin was and now in this case Craig.
Sorry, donīt agree at all. Speaking of drivers. For the public maybe more dangerous... But still... Donīt know which rallies you attend, but please look at all crashvideos for example from Finland.. Many trees there are.Quote:
Originally Posted by N.O.T
So, log off all the trees next to the roads, then get rid of the stumps. Easy and Safe.
You can't make ANY sport SAFE!
F1 is very good at the moment about safety.
But never stop making it safer.Quote:
Originally Posted by GigiGalliNo1
Yes, true Rallyper
Correction, you can't make life safe.Quote:
Originally Posted by GigiGalliNo1
Stupid EU discuss about how yellow the bananas or how green the cucumber have to be, but doesn't seem to be interested in safe roads. Well done!
i think it would be wiser to spend more money and time making drivers safer rather than roads...Quote:
Originally Posted by rallye-vid
For example here in Greece more than 70% of the drivers got their licence through bribing the examiners... but here we talk about motorsports.
Rallying is a very dangerous motorsport... We have to accept that each year some people are going to get killed, some seriously injured and we are going to have twice the close calls... People who after a serious crash just wish that it is going to be the last one are plain retards and should follow Curling from now on.
Of course that doesn't mean that we must leave things to luck, but also we must consider that when you put safety first in something that is life threatening by its nature the only thing you do is just take away the excitement of it.
You have to accept some things and move on... if you try and eliminate dangers one by one you will finally eliminate the sport itself... First the guard rails, then the trees, then the tarmac roads due to high speeds ects ects...
It is really sad that this kind of discussion started because some who did what he loved and gave excitement to millions of people is no longer between us, but i think all the people involved from the driver to the mechanic of the team were aware that it was a possibility, and i am also sure that if the sport wasn't that dangerous it would not offer the same levels of excitement, at least to some.
I saw curling on TV once, but it was boring, so I switched it off.Quote:
Originally Posted by N.O.T
More money there of course, I know RBR have a machine that tests g-forces on impacts etc, I only wish there was more money avaliable from ford and citroen so the same tests could be done, if it only saves one life ever it will be worth it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Barreis
This is hardly news and rumors....
Yes you're right Bigdiggerman, many post here belongs more to DISCUSSIONS and PUB-TALK.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigdiggerman
http://www.motorsportforums.com/wrc/...-pub-talk.html
In addition to Finland, Juha Salo drives Proton in GB as well. Moreover, he will start in rally San Marino with Fiesta S2000. It is the price drive that didn't worked out in Sardegna a year ago.
VW READY FOR 2013.......MIKKELSEN IN 3RD CAR VW pronta per la stagione WRC 2013. Al Rally di Germania l
No. Nothing official in that article. German meaning is that there will be a third VW Polo R WRC in selected WRC rounds and Andreas Mikkelsen MAY have the best chances...Quote:
Originally Posted by Red bull
Helsingin Sanomat (the paper version?) claims that the Latvala to VW -deal is done and that it is two years long with an option for a third year. No confirmation from anyone of course, but hopefully weīll finally know more around Rallye Deutschland in August.
HS: Latvala vaihtaa Volkswagenille | Yle Urheilu | yle.fi
FIA puts the official timekeeping and mapping on offer for 3year contract. whats the purpose of this, since they suppose to be happy with Stage One technologies and what the do at the moment... they just recently had two features of them in wrc.com on how they work... makes me think if this is about sponsorship and money coming into the sport. FIA World Rally Championship
Bloody rediculoous what the **** are the FIA playing at now!? the teams are happy with the current system so leave it be and spend time sorting out the real problems!Quote:
Originally Posted by makinen_fan
I'm glad everyone is starting to see exactly the kind of people the FIA are. They'll tell you that they're trying to improve the situation when they're making it 10x worse.Quote:
Originally Posted by Allyc85
I can see it getting to the end of this season and either there will be zero TV coverage/promotion etc or the WRC will cease to even exist.
Quite a brave move for both if it's true. VW must be banking on Latvala improving his reliability a lot otherwise there is no point, and for Latvala - well VW bosses might not be as patient as Malcolm.Quote:
Originally Posted by Miika
Maybe thats the plan. Let it die, and then start up again, exactly how Jean Todt wants.....Quote:
Originally Posted by rallyfan2000
I would imagine that VW will make a car that is fast enough not to need overdriving to keep up with the Citroen. And I expect VW management to make the correct management / strategy / weather info decisions :-)Quote:
Originally Posted by RS
In Sardinia, circulating rumor that Thierry Neuville, most likely I will be away even to the Italian race of the WRC.
If there will Neuville, the Citroen WRC will be 5 to start the race, though perhaps there could be Van Merksteijn.
even though, having Ogier as team mate I believe will be enough of a pressure to force him into mistakes. Ogier is not Hirvonen that JML could easily beat and boost his confidenceQuote:
Originally Posted by MJW
Latvala will be no.2, and when he makes a mistake, he won't have a boss babbling on at every opportunity how he will win the next 4-5 rallies in a row.Quote:
Originally Posted by makinen_fan