Openwheel drivers to NASCAR

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15th February 2008, 04:48
RaceFanStan

AJ Allmendinger, Patrick Carpentier & Jacques Villeneuve are having a meeting Sunday ...
they are going to have a bbq in Orlando & watch the Daytona 500 together ...
because all 3 of them failed to qualify for the Daytona 500 they are very distraught ... http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g2...ink/orn/jo.gif
so they are meeting to critique the Daytona 500 & the drivers that made the race ... http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g2...link/orn/w.gif
rumor has it they plan to talk trash about Montoya, Hornish & Franchitti ... (among others) http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g2...ink/orn/00.gif
15th February 2008, 16:02
Sparky1329

Quote:

Originally Posted by RaceFanStan

AJ Allmendinger, Patrick Carpentier & Jacques Villeneuve are having a meeting Sunday ...
they are going to have a bbq in Orlando & watch the Daytona 500 together ...
because all 3 of them failed to qualify for the Daytona 500 they are very distraught ... http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g2...ink/orn/jo.gif
so they are meeting to critique the Daytona 500 & the drivers that made the race ... http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g2...link/orn/w.gif
rumor has it they plan to talk trash about Montoya, Hornish & Franchitti ... (among others) http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g2...ink/orn/00.gif

:D
15th February 2008, 16:14
Fangio

Quote:

Originally Posted by RaceFanStan

AJ Allmendinger, Patrick Carpentier & Jacques Villeneuve are having a meeting Sunday ...
they are going to have a bbq in Orlando & watch the Daytona 500 together ...
because all 3 of them failed to qualify for the Daytona 500 they are very distraught ... http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g2...ink/orn/jo.gif
so they are meeting to critique the Daytona 500 & the drivers that made the race ... http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g2...link/orn/w.gif
rumor has it they plan to talk trash about Montoya, Hornish & Franchitti ... (among others) http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g2...ink/orn/00.gif

LOL, you mean they are going to trash talk the drivers that where guaranteed a starting spot no matter how much they sucked?....hornish(cough)

:D
15th February 2008, 16:32
JasonD

Quote:

Originally Posted by RaceFanStan

AJ Allmendinger, Patrick Carpentier & Jacques Villeneuve are having a meeting Sunday ...

Would that be at a hotel or AJ's weekend timeshare he was looking at. With AJ spending so much time AWAY from the track it might be cheaper and more comfortable getting the timeshare.
16th February 2008, 16:41
RaceFanStan

what they are saying in other forums ...

from IndyCar Forum > Ex-Open Wheelers' qualifying pathetic at Daytona 500 :

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChicagocrewIRL

Tony Stewart - - - Qualified 6th - - - former IndyCar Champion
Juan Pablo Montoya - - - Qualified 15th - - - Indy 500 Champion, CART Champion Formula 1 World Champion
Sam Hornish Jr. - - - Qualified 19th - - - Indy 500 Champion, 3 Time IndyCar Champion
John Andretti - - - Qualified 22nd - - - CART and Indy 500 driver
Robby Gordon - - - Qualified 26th - - - CART, IRL and Indy 500 driver
J.J. Yeley - - - Qualified 37th - - - IRL and Indy 500 driver
Dario Franchitti - - - Qualified 40th - - IRL Champion, Indy 500 Champion
A.J. Allmendinger - - - DNQ - - - CCWS driver, Atlantics Champion, CCWS Rookie of the Year
Patrick Carpentier - - - DNQ - - - CART driver, IRL and Indy 500 driver
Jacques Villeneuve - - - DNQ - - - Indy 500 Champion, CART Champion, Formula 1 World Champion, CART Rookie of the Year

pretty sad showing for the open wheel guys going from "fighter jets" to "B-52 bombers"

I had to chuckle when I read that. http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g2...ink/orn/00.gif
7th March 2008, 20:05
Robert Ryan

Patrick Carpentier suprises in qualifying. 12th in Cup and I think 7th or 8th in Nationwide. He has been impressive considering his total lack of experience and poor equipment.
7th March 2008, 20:54
JasonD

And hes aparently got a major, major, major sponsor lined up.
10th March 2008, 04:09
woody2goody

Here is my opinion on the current situation between NASCAR, and open-wheel motor racing, especially F1. Please read and post your opinions :)

NASCAR in general seems to have a snobbish attitude towards any open-wheel driver who comes into 'their' sport. Juan Montoya, Jacques Villeneuve, Dario Franchitti, Sam Hornish and Patrick Carpentier have endured endless bitching, sniping and questions about their driving ability, just because they come from F1 and the IRL. Between them, they have 4 Indy 500 wins, 18 Grand Prix wins, 1 Formula One World Championship, 4 IRL championships, 2 CART championships and 2 NASCAR victories. If this doesn't convince the NASCAR faithful I don't know what will. I think because 4 of them are foreigners a lot of old-school fans are just not giving them a chance. They are prepared to give a young American kid coming from midgets through modified, through trucks and N-wide years and years of patience waiting for them to improve. But when an open-wheel driver takes one of 'their' places, there is uproar.

Last season, when Sam Hornish was struggling to qualify for races, many NASCAR fans said that he just wasn't good enough. But they probably didn't notice that half the time he was only 0.3-0.7 off pole, and it was really the top 35 rule that was keeping him out of the show. Now granted, these drivers have had a tendency to bang the walls and find themselves in the barriers occasionally, but this is part of their learning process.

Jaqcues Villeneuve has been unlucky in NASCAR. Unlucky with the criticism he has recieved, despite his honest gesture at Talladega to start at the back. Bill Davis Racing didn't give him enough time; I don't care if he had sponsorship issues, he would have qualified for most of the races this year, just because of his natural talent, and his ability to pull out a terrifically fast lap in quali. Johnny Benson will not get into as many races as Jacques would have. I hope he comes back to prove everyone wrong.

Montoya has had bad luck, a few accidents, a few bad performances, and a few good performances, including two wins (in seperate series), and yet many are still not convinced. His team isn't a front runner, and yet he does a very good job. Surely a CART championship, an Indy 500 win, 95 grands prix, 7 wins and now two NASCAR wins would be enough to convince the fans. Obviously not. I hope he makes the Chase for the Cup just to annoy a lot of them.

The difference with many F1 fans is, that they tend to appreciate others' achievements more. Sebastien Bourdais has won 4 Champ Car championships in a row. He comes to Toro Rosso and some people have their doubts, however they are willing to give him a chance to prove himself. The problem in NASCAR, is if a guy doesn't do well to begin with from open-wheel, he automatically isn't good enough. I guarantee, if Michael Schumacher was in a Hendrick Chevy, he wouldn't probably get into the top 10 for a few races. Would that mean he's not good enough? No. Just as if Bourdais gets beaten by Vettel next week, it doesn't mean that he isn't good enough.

There are many F1 fans who dismiss NASCAR as easy, and uninteresting because of the circuits they race on. I bet nearly anyone could run one fast lap at Daytona. Whereas hardly anyone could do a flying lap of monaco without ending up in the wall, or indeed the harbour. NASCAR has basic tracks, but the races are all about feeling the car, and planning according to how it feels, and taking the appropriate lines etc. This is in contrast with F1, where it is more reactionary, and the circuits offer far more of a challenge in themselves. F1 is technology and development, NASCAR is parity and exciting racing. NASCAR has longer races, and possibly more concentration is needed, because of the longer time period.

I think the sports are equal in many ways, except F1 enjoys a greater global audience. F1 drivers CAN cut it in NASCAR, and NASCAR drivers, I'm sure, can cut it in F1, although it would help if they had open-wheel experience first. Jeff Gordon proved he could do well when he tested the Williams with JPM in 2003 I think.
10th March 2008, 12:27
Lee Roy

Quote:

Originally Posted by woody2goody

Here is my opinion on the current situation between NASCAR, and open-wheel motor racing, especially F1. Please read and post your opinions :)

Quote:

Originally Posted by woody2goody

NASCAR in general seems to have a snobbish attitude towards any open-wheel driver who comes into 'their' sport. Juan Montoya, Jacques Villeneuve, Dario Franchitti, Sam Hornish and Patrick Carpentier have endured endless bitching, sniping and questions about their driving ability, just because they come from F1 and the IRL. Between them, they have 4 Indy 500 wins, 18 Grand Prix wins, 1 Formula One World Championship, 4 IRL championships, 2 CART championships and 2 NASCAR victories. If this doesn't convince the NASCAR faithful I don't know what will. I think because 4 of them are foreigners a lot of old-school fans are just not giving them a chance. They are prepared to give a young American kid coming from midgets through modified, through trucks and N-wide years and years of patience waiting for them to improve. But when an open-wheel driver takes one of 'their' places, there is uproar.

Not sure where you're getting this "snobby" nonsense from. I've noticed that the open-wheel drivers have been very welcome. I think you're the one with the "snobby" issue. I think you've been reading the open-wheel/nascar-hate websites and nothing else.

Quote:

Originally Posted by woody2goody

Last season, when Sam Hornish was struggling to qualify for races, many NASCAR fans said that he just wasn't good enough. But they probably didn't notice that half the time he was only 0.3-0.7 off pole, and it was really the top 35 rule that was keeping him out of the show. Now granted, these drivers have had a tendency to bang the walls and find themselves in the barriers occasionally, but this is part of their learning process.

You mentioned Sam Hornish. He and Franchitti were given cars with spots in the top 35 in points for the first 5 races(that they didn't earn by the way), and in three races they have both dropped out of the top 35 for this year.

To put it simply, they were given an 5 race head start and haven't been able to keep up.

Quote:

Originally Posted by woody2goody

Jaqcues Villeneuve has been unlucky in NASCAR. Unlucky with the criticism he has recieved, despite his honest gesture at Talladega to start at the back. Bill Davis Racing didn't give him enough time; I don't care if he had sponsorship issues, he would have qualified for most of the races this year, just because of his natural talent, and his ability to pull out a terrifically fast lap in quali. Johnny Benson will not get into as many races as Jacques would have. I hope he comes back to prove everyone wrong.

Jacques Villeneuve (and I'm a huge fan of his, atteneded many F1 races to see him race) was a victim of his long time association with Craig Pollock. Nothing new.

Quote:

Originally Posted by woody2goody

Montoya has had bad luck, a few accidents, a few bad performances, and a few good performances, including two wins (in seperate series), and yet many are still not convinced. His team isn't a front runner, and yet he does a very good job. Surely a CART championship, an Indy 500 win, 95 grands prix, 7 wins and now two NASCAR wins would be enough to convince the fans. Obviously not. I hope he makes the Chase for the Cup just to annoy a lot of them.

I don't know anyone who doesn't like Montoya. He's doing very well.

Quote:

Originally Posted by woody2goody

The difference with many F1 fans is, that they tend to appreciate others' achievements more. Sebastien Bourdais has won 4 Champ Car championships in a row. He comes to Toro Rosso and some people have their doubts, however they are willing to give him a chance to prove himself. The problem in NASCAR, is if a guy doesn't do well to begin with from open-wheel, he automatically isn't good enough. I guarantee, if Michael Schumacher was in a Hendrick Chevy, he wouldn't probably get into the top 10 for a few races. Would that mean he's not good enough? No. Just as if Bourdais gets beaten by Vettel next week, it doesn't mean that he isn't good enough.

Lord have mercy, where are you coming up with that non-sense. A lot of people get opportunities in NASCAR, whereas Formula One is one of the most "closed-shop" organizations on the face of the earth. If you want to show up and race at NASCAR, you are welcome to try (if you meet some minimum experience standards and have a legal car).

Can you do the same in Formula One? No effin' way!!!! If you're not part of the Concorde Agreement, don't bother.

Quote:

Originally Posted by woody2goody

There are many F1 fans who dismiss NASCAR as easy, and uninteresting because of the circuits they race on. I bet nearly anyone could run one fast lap at Daytona. Whereas hardly anyone could do a flying lap of monaco without ending up in the wall, or indeed the harbour. NASCAR has basic tracks, but the races are all about feeling the car, and planning according to how it feels, and taking the appropriate lines etc. This is in contrast with F1, where it is more reactionary, and the circuits offer far more of a challenge in themselves. F1 is technology and development, NASCAR is parity and exciting racing. NASCAR has longer races, and possibly more concentration is needed, because of the longer time period.

Your prejudice against NASCAR is showing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by woody2goody

I think the sports are equal in many ways, except F1 enjoys a greater global audience. F1 drivers CAN cut it in NASCAR, and NASCAR drivers, I'm sure, can cut it in F1, although it would help if they had open-wheel experience first. Jeff Gordon proved he could do well when he tested the Williams with JPM in 2003 I think.

Sorry, I know enough about Formula One to know just how full of holes your arguments are.
10th March 2008, 12:59
BenRoethig

The problem is that all those open wheel and road racing achievements don't translate very well. They have to basically forget every they ever learned driving other kinds of cars and learn how to drive a stock car. If they come in with the "oval racing sucks, NASCAB is going to be so easy" mentality prevalent within the road racing circles they will and have failed miserably. If they go straight into cup without learning how to drive a stock car they will fail miserably. If they put aside their ego and their past success, begin at a lower level and take the time to learn how to drive a stock car, they have a chance.

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