Forget about these numbers, they have nothing to do with reality. It's a lot more.Quote:
Originally Posted by TypeR
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Forget about these numbers, they have nothing to do with reality. It's a lot more.Quote:
Originally Posted by TypeR
So according to this, they would indeed change to a spec chassis. Terrible.Quote:
Originally Posted by Eli
So a manufacturer developing a new car for 2025 will need to do another for 2027?
This is all looking more and more like another FIA-shaped fiasco of complication.....
Why do you say fiasco?Quote:
Originally Posted by rallyfiend
Does anybody else see that all the evidence points to there being no manufacturers lined up?
It's an FIA chassis, an FIA safety cell, the FIA developing hydrogen, the FIA developing driver talent, the FIA sourcing transmissions, opening the main class up to tuners, gone are the service park structures - because nobody's got one anymore...
WRC main class as a manufacturer sport is in its dying days.
Well, it all sounds like rushed talk as a response to often repeated tropes. This FIA administration seems famous for wanting to seem like the key authority, rather than actually being that authority. Just look at Mohammed and his F1 situation. He's been humiliated a few times.Quote:
Originally Posted by WRCStan
I mean, this Working Group was only set up in mid-December. How considered do you think all of this could honestly be?
I think the working group only gained the power to act at the end of last year. Like you say, politics etc, and scrapping hybrid is a part of that and to address an immediate concern. They probably were thinking things through for a while before, combined with any new information since. Long term, nothing is bringing in manufacturers. I don't know what else they can or should do that isn't totally radical.Quote:
Originally Posted by rallyfiend
Open up for non-manufacturers to build and run a Rally1 car is the only solution to get new teams in.
Sent fra min SM-S901B via Tapatalk
Lets see if it costs current teams.....Quote:
Originally Posted by WRCStan
Million dollar rallycars were going nowhere, very fast. Something needed to be done, quickly. Personally, making Rally 2 the top category with no spec changes would have been fine. I understand why FIA felt the need to protect some of the Rally 1 investment and keep a semblance of happiness with the 3 current teams. The compromise we got is fine for now. Further evidence is needed before drawing full conclusions.
For 2027, the 3 manufacturers would need new bigger chasses, new engines albeit they've got one, new gearboxes... but still new cars. There's no connect.Quote:
Originally Posted by macebig
There's a reason FIA didn't choose Rally2 or the +WRC Kit for top category, even if it may turn out to be just that.
Making Rally2 the top category with no changes would probably kill the regional customer Rally2 racing - the most vital part of rallying right now.Quote:
Originally Posted by macebig
Why do you think that it would kill regional customer Rally2? Genuinely interested to know.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenneth
One thing is a manufacturer developing a car to costumers, looking at the costs because they have to sell it; the other completely differente is to developing a car ti ne a WRC winner, they cost limit to investe is much larger.Quote:
Originally Posted by doubled1978
You could talk about cost limit ceiling, it works to buy a car, but not to buy parts or services.
I'd add that even the speed of the works development is unsustainable for the customers. The privateers need stability and for them fewer uppgrades coming through the season is better.Quote:
Originally Posted by JAM
Also the upgrades are not just to buy something and install it. Most of the upgrades also require testing, building of new setups etc. It's not just a cost of the new part but a lot more.
I've just reread the proposed changes and must say I'm confused by the top speed reduction plan to limit costs.
Aren't all top category (or second tier) cars in recent history primarily top speed limited by very short gearing? In what way other than mandating shorter ratios or a electronic limiter could they reduce the top speed and how would that save costs?
Only logical reason behind that i see reducing costs is maybe that engines are less on the limit and therefore there is less wear maybe?Quote:
Originally Posted by becher
I was wondering, from 2026 the cars will use the same engine (albeit with a larger restrictor) as the rally2 cars?
The more I read and think about all these new proposals the more it seems like a complete dog's breakfast. The new points system was confusing, but the rules for the cars and classes for the the next few years actually make it look simple and logical !
I predict a total mess and a chaotic WRC until someone has the balls to decide on a proper set of straight-forward regulations and cars that actually make sense for both fans and manufacturers.
And you can add human resources too. How many people could be necessary to run full trothle a car that is developed to a works team? 3 mechanics anda a engineer are enough? I doubt.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mirek
You mean in the sense that cars won't be buzzing the limiter on long straights but rather trundle along at lower revs in top gear thanks to a limiter?Quote:
Originally Posted by Rallyest
Toyota's J-M Latvala on problems with the Rally1 cars... mainly cost and the gap to the Rally2s...
https://www.pistonheads.com/news/mot...plicated/48266
autosport/motorsport.com podcast gravel notes on the new rules. interview with david richards.
https://open.spotify.com/episode/1LO...iejfrPDZoLw%0A
Fan survey results:
https://www.rallyfish.co.uk/news/wrc...Gi3LincnGpVpEY
https://www.autosport.com/wrc/news/t...sive/10584887/
Latvala thinks €400,000 is a bit optimistic, something like €500,000 is more realistic in his opinion. So basically back to the DS3 & Fiesta RS costs back in 2011.
500 thousand Euro today equals only 375 thousand from 2011. There is an inflation.Quote:
Originally Posted by Eli
So that makes it even harder to achieve.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mirek
More from Latvala, this time on the Rally2 WRC Kit...
"For the private teams, it could be a great idea. But, for the manufacturer who wants to build the car to win the World Rally Championship, do they want to see the car run out of the garage beating your product in which you’ve invested a lot of money? It raises questions,”
“I know we are struggling with not so many cars in the main class and giving the opportunity to fine-tune the Rally2 car… I can see the positive – we have more cars, potentially, in the main class. But slowing down the Rally1 and boosting the Rally2? We need to find the balance.”
https://rallyjournal.com/jari-matti-...ajor-question/
and more from Pernilla Solberg
https://www.autosport.com/wrc/news/t...-wrc/10586980/
Neuvilles suggestions:
https://dirtfish.com/rally/wrc/neuvi...6CG4BtXUh_L7fI
Neuville doesn't see the point in Rally2+ whereas Lindholm thinks every current Rally2 driver will upgrade if the price difference is nominal:
https://rallyjournal.com/finnish-ral...ill-fade-away/
Averaging those responses there'll be no new manufacturers and costs increasing for who's left.
Respect to Neuville for sharing his opinion. Clearly he cares, thinks about these things and is a fan too.
Yeesss.. and according to IG posts, he has changed his Panamera Turbo to BMW iX EV :DQuote:
Originally Posted by WRCStan
I have to Google BMW models; that is one fugly awful looking car.Quote:
Originally Posted by TypeR
'the look of the new cars'. cant see much change here tbh
https://www.instagram.com/reel/C4vMq...U1bTAyaGgyOGc5
The Rally1 looks very much like the new Lancia Ypsilon…just saying.Quote:
Originally Posted by saco0o
well. if you like Rally4. maybe?Quote:
Originally Posted by Eli
https://www.motorsport.com/wrc/news/...turn/10589178/
Kalle doesn’t understand
https://www.motorsport.com/wrc/news/...ense/10592424/