Mobile phones & tablets thread

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19th October 2012, 07:27
Big Ben

Is she holding it right?
19th October 2012, 08:58
CaptainRaiden

I don't know what your little Apple love story there has to do with, henners, but first off, you're comparing a three year old HTC phone to Apple's current offering. Things are different with the flagship competitor phones. I used iPhone 4S for a week and jumped back to Android in a heartbeat. But then again, different people have different choices. To each his own. À chacun son goût, Chacun son goût. :D

Second, if it was a retort to one sentence in one of my earlier posts in reply to Malbec, I was talking about their latest iterations, and Android 4.1 is universally rated higher and regarded better than iOS6, especially with the maps debacle, not just by me, but by almost all major tech reviewers.

But hey, if in your opinion, iOS is better, then good for you. You should stick to your choice and be happy with it, just as I am with mine. I was retorting to Malbec's claim of Android being a clone, saying how it's now an almost unrecognizable OS with far more features and versatility.

The rest of it, I find it to be the same old repetitive stuff and have no interest in debating as we'll be going in very familiar circles again anyway.
19th October 2012, 09:03
CaptainRaiden

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robinho

so has anyone else had the problem with either Iphone 4s or Ipad 2 losing ability to connect to Wifi since upgrading to IOS6? My wifes phone has failed and having done some digging it seems there are hundreds or reported cases cropping up worldwide, with the only definitive fix being downgrading back to IOS5, or having Apple replace the phone (it seems to indiscriminantly target phones, some older, some brand new, even some of the replacements offered by apple. Clearly there is a hardware compatability issue somewhere where some of the phones are not working with the new software, but from what i've read Apple don't have an answer on when they will (if they will) roll out an upgraded IOS6 to solve the problem or if they will just have to replace a bunch more 4s's. either way its a trip to the Apple store next week to see if we can argue for a replacement, having tried about half a dozen supposed fixes to get the WiFi button back

I've heard about this problem, as one of my friends who owns a 4S also was having this issue since upgrading to iOS6. Have you tried rebooting the phone, and then resetting the router/modem? Worth a shot IMO, as that works in many cases. If not, then a trip to the repair center it is.
19th October 2012, 10:13
Malbec

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaptainRaiden

Well, then what are you doing in the mobile phones and tablets thread? :p Isn't there a legal-tosh-get-touchy-about-Apple-patronize-and-throw-childish insults thread somewhere?

Just reflect on your behaviour here CR.

I tried to explain some of how patents work. I've had to work with drug patents in the past so I have experience in the area. As soon as what I was saying became inconvenient for your viewpoint your response has been to claim disinterest in legal systems then label me an Apple fanboi (that is how you spell it correct?).

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaptainRaiden

Where did I say it is okay for anybody to copy anything? Galaxy S2 nor Galaxy S3 is in any way, shape or form an iPhone clone. Android is in no way an iOS clone. It is a better OS with far more versatility and plenty more features. With their latest iterations, it seems to me that Google has innovated and gone ahead with Android, whereas iOS has stayed the same. How is that copying?

I might be old and cynical but thats not how I view the picture at all.

Both Apple/Android hardware and software are incredibly sophisticated. They are supposed to represent different solutions to very very similar problems. Given the complexity of the hardware and software it would be naive to believe that there are not significant similarities between the two in parts. Most are perfectly legitimate and either involve third party hard/software or proper patent payments to the relevant company. I'm sure however there are many similarities that are not legally clearcut, some may be accidental infringements, some may be deliberate attempts to copy. Its because of this complex picture that these lawsuits arise, connected to the fact that a successful case could knock competing products out of a market for a time.

Note that I'm not assigning blame to any individual company.

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaptainRaiden

Were they banned because of something as trivial as rounded corners though? Why was the Korean company bullied and banned in USA and not anywhere else? You seem to be conveniently ignoring this question in your replies Malbec. What is it, ADD?

Whether you like it or not, innovative products have always inspired design for decades now. Companies have been copying each other forever. There may have been plenty of lawsuits over the last two decades, but none of them with such drastic outcomes. Again, why were Apple successful only in the United States?

Nice personal insult at the end there.

So Samsung have not been banned anywhere else?

Samsung Galaxy Tab ban upheld in Germany, mein gott! | CNET UK

There you go, Galaxy Tab banned in Germany before the landmark case in California.

Oh here are some other cases.

Motorola Android devices banned in Germany for infringing Microsoft's FAT patent | The Verge
BBC News - PS3 imports banned in patent row

Note the second case.

The PS3 is Sony's biggest single individual earner. The EU is one of Sony's three biggest PS3 markets. LG managed to block PS3 imports into the whole of the EU by targetting the Netherlands which is where Sony Europe's import facilities are. Unlike Samsung which had bans on already obsolete products Sony had a ban on a very current product across a massive market.

So where does this leave your assertion that Apple is the first company to really start suing in the electronics industry? WAKE UP, its been going on forever!

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaptainRaiden

and then carry on with your pathetic flaming.

I have no idea what flaming is but sounds nasty.

Take it up with the mods if you don't like my posts.
19th October 2012, 10:16
Malbec

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaptainRaiden

I've heard about this problem, as one of my friends who owns a 4S also was having this issue since upgrading to iOS6. Have you tried rebooting the phone, and then resetting the router/modem? Worth a shot IMO, as that works in many cases. If not, then a trip to the repair center it is.

No thats not going to work.

There is a documented problem with iOS 6 where the phone will prefer to download over 3G if connection with wireless is lost even momentarily and will not revert to wireless download if the connection is restored. This has resulted in 3G downloading bills skyrocketing for some owners.

I do think Apple have cut a few corners to get the iPhone 5 and iOS 6 to market in good time for Xmas. Shame.
19th October 2012, 10:21
Malbec

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaptainRaiden

I don't know what your little Apple love story there has to do with, henners, but first off, you're comparing a three year old HTC phone to Apple's current offering. Things are different with the flagship competitor phones. I used iPhone 4S for a week and jumped back to Android in a heartbeat. But then again, different people have different choices. To each his own. À chacun son goût, Chacun son goût. :D

Second, if it was a retort to one sentence in one of my earlier posts in reply to Malbec, I was talking about their latest iterations, and Android 4.1 is universally rated higher and regarded better than iOS6, especially with the maps debacle, not just by me, but by almost all major tech reviewers.

But hey, if in your opinion, iOS is better, then good for you. You should stick to your choice and be happy with it, just as I am with mine. I was retorting to Malbec's claim of Android being a clone, saying how it's now an almost unrecognizable OS with far more features and versatility.

The rest of it, I find it to be the same old repetitive stuff and have no interest in debating as we'll be going in very familiar circles again anyway.

Oh dear CR, one has to either love or hate Apple right? More nuanced views don't have a place do they.

I don't care how others rate Android 4.1 vs iOS6. However having used both I rate the Android as being far better for me than the iPhone version. You really don't need to convince me of its superiority.

Hence why I'm probably opting for the Xperia T as my next phone. Thats not an iPhone BTW just to clarify further.

BTW I'm such an Apple fanboi as you put it that I'm thinking of the Nexus 7 to dip a toe in the tablet market. Thats by Apple isn't it? Though I have to say that Apple smartphone/tablet hybrid you posted a link to looks good too!

Nor did I claim Android was a clone, I haven't even mentioned any court cases involving Android per se, merely the Samsung vs Apple case which left out Android itself (hence why Google was not directly involved). I suggest you find the sentence where I did and quote it if you disagree.
19th October 2012, 10:44
CaptainRaiden

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malbec

So Samsung have not been banned anywhere else?

Samsung Galaxy Tab ban upheld in Germany, mein gott! | CNET UK

There you go, Galaxy Tab banned in Germany before the landmark case in California.

That link is from 2011. Is the ban in effect? No, a friend just bought a Galaxy tab in Frankfurt. Bans have been lifted in the UK and Germany since, I guess when their legal system realized how ridiculous the lawsuit was. Apple won the lawsuit in the USA, lost the lawsuit in China and the EU, two equally big markets. Apple lost again in other parts of Asia like Japan, and South Korea deemed both parties to be guilty of infringing patents. Nowhere was a victory as clear cut as in the USA, Apple's backyard, especially amidst allegations of mishandling evidence. Also, I highly doubt Samsung will ever win a case against Apple in USA.

Besides, the verdict in USA doesn't even matter, because nobody is paying anybody anything, no devices will truly be banned. Samsung will keep appealing the decision and the re-trial will go on forever.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malbec

I tried to explain some of how patents work. I've had to work with drug patents in the past so I have experience in the area. As soon as what I was saying became inconvenient for your viewpoint your response has been to claim disinterest in legal systems then label me an Apple fanboi (that is how you spell it correct?).

So where does this leave your assertion that Apple is the first company to really start suing in the electronics industry? WAKE UP, its been going on forever!

I never called you a fanboy, but you do get a tad bit emotional when defending Apple.

Where did I say the lawsuits haven't been going on forever? I am also quite aware of Microsoft's litigation history. But what you're defending here, Malbec, is clearly a broken patent system. I mean when a company can patent a specific rectangular shape (seriously??), aren't they really blocking innovation? Software from different companies have always been heavily similar to each other for as long as I can remember.

Suing your rivals for petty things like slide to unlock or rectangular edges is really desperate and pathetic IMO. I know Apple are full within their rights to do so if they please, but are you actually siding with Apple on this? Having said that, I too think Samsung and LG's lawsuits against Apple are pathetic as well, and serve really no purpose. Neither company benefits from this, because you know the verdict is gonna be appealed no matter who wins. This only enriches the law firms, and ultimately the end user has to pay more. My point is that petty squabbles like these should not exist in technology, no matter which company is wielding the hammer.

For example, I agree with a lot that's written here: https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2012/0...in-marketplace

Especially this part:

Quote:

Our patent system is intended to incentivize innovation, in theory at least. Lately it’s become little more than a tool to squelch competition, and it’s not just the Apples and the Samsungs of the world who find themselves fighting these battles. It’s also small and innovative companies, local governments, foreign companies trying to make it in America, hobbyists, and even individual developers. The problems are particularly acute in the world of software: it turns out that software patents are nearly five times more likely to be the subject of litigation as other patents. In fact, lawsuits surrounding software patents have more than tripled since 1999.
19th October 2012, 10:55
CaptainRaiden

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malbec

I don't care how others rate Android 4.1 vs iOS6. However having used both I rate the Android as being far better for me than the iPhone version. You really don't need to convince me of its superiority.

I am not.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malbec

Hence why I'm probably opting for the Xperia T as my next phone. Thats not an iPhone BTW just to clarify further.

WHAT?? It isn't?? I thought it was called the Apple iPhone Xperia T.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malbec

BTW I'm such an Apple fanboi as you put it that I'm thinking of the Nexus 7 to dip a toe in the tablet market. Thats by Apple isn't it?

The Apple Nexus 7 doesn't have expandable memory or USB ports, but I guess people don't need that these days, especially flaming Apple loverboys.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malbec

Though I have to say that Apple smartphone/tablet hybrid you posted a link to looks good too!

The Apple Padfone 2 costs $3000 just so you know.
19th October 2012, 11:07
CaptainRaiden

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malbec

Nor did I claim Android was a clone, I haven't even mentioned any court cases involving Android per se, merely the Samsung vs Apple case which left out Android itself (hence why Google was not directly involved). I suggest you find the sentence where I did and quote it if you disagree.

What you said earlier was:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malbec

I don't like many features of Apple's behaviour but I believe their competitors should beat them by making a better and different product, not a clone. That way I get a variety of products to choose from and not just Apple and Apple-lite.

Unless I am in a parallel universe and this is Blorgon Delta-6, I believe Apple's competitors include Google and Android as well, and one of Apple's major lawsuits are aimed towards Android, which BTW Google are now countersuing Apple for taking elements off too. Apple has a problem with Galaxy S3 too, which IMO doesn't look like any Apple device in existence.

If Apple could, they would sue every rectangular shaped phone with the candybar form factor. I'm sure the judges in California will find enough evidence and the radii to be the same to award another $1 billion. They targeted Samsung solely because they were its biggest competitor.
19th October 2012, 11:08
Malbec

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaptainRaiden

I never called you a fanboy, but you do get a tad bit emotional when defending Apple.

I'm not defending Apple. I get annoyed and frustrated at your one-sided simplistic view of the system and your ability to dismiss new information when you don't like it.

My other posts regarding Apple's bizarre Maps debacle and also my own willingness (or rather unwillingness) to invest my own cash into their iPhones and iPads should tell you where I stand on their mobile products.

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaptainRaiden

Where did I say the lawsuits haven't been going on forever? I am also quite aware of Microsoft's litigation history. But what you're defending here, Malbec, is clearly a broken patent system. I mean when a company can patent a specific rectangular shape (seriously??), aren't they really blocking innovation? Software from different companies have always been heavily similar to each other for as long as I can remember.

No you still just don't get it.

The Apple/Samsung US case covered many different bases but the bit you keep bringing up again (rectangles and corners) is not about patents, its about brand protection. iPhones have always had a particular look about them and Apple argued that Samsung were copying this look in the S2. When you put descriptions of a particular look on paper they do sound stupid.

I posted links to Starbucks vs some Chinese cafe. Starbuck's argument sounds equally stupid on paper. Our logo is round and green with a black picture in the middle and white lettering. That cafe chain in China uses a similar logo and are therefore copying us. Please stop them from doing so. How pathetic does that sound?

This isn't about stifling innovation. They weren't asking to ban Samsung from ever making smartphones, just ones that look different from iPhones. The S3 looks nothing like an iPhone so Samsung clearly got the message.

There were obviously many other parts to the court case but the above bit which I've repeated for the third time should give you an insight into why that decision was made.

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaptainRaiden

Suing your rivals for petty things like slide to unlock or rectangular edges is really desperate and pathetic IMO. I know Apple are full within their rights to do so if they please, but are you actually siding with Apple on this? Having said that, I too think Samsung and LG's lawsuits against Apple are pathetic as well, and serve really no purpose. Neither company benefits from this, because you know the verdict is gonna be appealed no matter who wins. This only enriches the law firms, and ultimately the end user has to pay more. My point is that petty squabbles like these should not exist in technology, no matter which company is wielding the hammer.

For example, I agree with a lot that's written here: https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2012/0...in-marketplace

Especially this part:

Agreed.

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