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Parents who "don't have time for their kids" have their priorities mixed up :mark:
Also, further to SFreak's comment, yes, a couple of Mars bars costs about $2.00. A bag of apples costs about the same :mark:
Millencolin, good for you :) (...um, let us know how the RB 'n Banana concection turns out :erm: )
Since I contract to Nestle, I'll have to say that it's still about choice.Quote:
Originally Posted by SEATFreak
The store I primarily work in is very large, a "super" supermarket if you will. As Halloween is coming soon, there is a lot of candy out. I would say Nestle probably has upwards of 2 or 3 THOUSAND pounds out on display in the store.
But the same company, at the same store, probably has close to 12 or 13 thousand pounds of water on display in the store, and it actually sells much better on a regular basis.
If people don't want to discipline themselves or their kids, they can blame me if it makes them feel better. But if they really want a reason for it happening they should look somewhere else. ;)
There is nothing wrong with the occasionnal packet of crisps, or chocolate bar, as long as people exercise!
Obesity ain't a disease thats just an excuse, yes some are more genetically vulnerable towards it, but at the end of the day - if you exercise you will not be obese. And if you sit on your ass all day eating three full english breakfasts taking in benefits because you are too "ill" to work then you don't deserve any sympathy.
Theirs that "C" word again.Quote:
Originally Posted by airshifter
I AM sorry but I have a massive hangup about people saying things like "I am fat through choice" or "If I indeed want to be fat I can be because it is my choice".
I saw a debate show this morning and a woman basicaly said the same thing.
It ain't about taking away your choice to eat stuff like pastries and burgers.
I think it is about making you aware of the consequences of your choice years later.
Very well put.Quote:
Originally Posted by SEATFreak
:D
Is that so?? I haven't said that everyone who is overweight is that way due to some kind of phychological illness, but there are a significant number who are. Would you say the same thing about anorexia, because it is the exact same psychological factors that cause some people to eat to excess and become obese as those that cause others to not eat at all, or to eat nothing for a prolongued period, then binge eat followed by self induced vomiting. Nobody views the obese version in the same way because it is less socially acceptable to be fat than it is to be a size 0.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bezza
As far as people who are fat and happy, Seat freak mentioned about making people aware of the consequences of their choices. Well believe me, most overweight people are. Lets face it, there is basically no escape from people telling you that you are going to drop dead of a heart attack before you're 40 in todays society, so saying that fat bashing is all for peoples own good is frankly bolony.
As I have already said, I am fat, I am happy and everything in my life is great. That I choose not to change myself or my life in any way is no one elses business! Just because you are thin, don't presume your life is better/happier than mine or that you are a better person than me. I have made my own choices about my life in the same way that everyone else has made their own decisions. I respect theirs, why can't they respect mine? Or does carrying extra weight not make me worthy of respect in their view? If that's the case, then I pity their limited understanding and blinkered view of the world.
We live in a wonderful multi cultural, multi sexual society where a person has the freedom to be who they are and who they want to be without fear of ridicule or prejudice...shame this is not yet true if you are overweight.
But it is undoubtedly a good thing to remind people that being overweight is not ideal. What you then do about it is up to you — I wish I found it easier to take the necessary steps to lose weight, but I am well aware that I ought to. I'm certainly not saying that we should be unpleasant or prejudiced on this issue, but recent statistics prove that it is a growing problem for society. Therefore, it is right to highlight it.
BDunnell,
I somewhat agree, but also see a great deal of validity in Perdita_X's view. She is aware of the possible consequences and has made a choice. As an adult, that should be a right we have within reason.
I don't see people posting about corporations creating job stress which should be stopped by lowering wages and expecting less from workers, but stress is a big contributing factor in many health issues, just like overeating or smoking is.
Every day or our adult lives we choose to accept differing risks in a variety of things. Each of those risks has potential consequences, and we must weigh then in our decision.
Personally I'd rather have the choice than to live in a soceity that becomes so sterile and void of risk that it's lifeless.
Of course, but obesity is an increasing problem (not least for health services) and it's worth making people aware of it as far as possible, which isn't that difficult. I don't see doing so as being equivalent to removing freedoms in other areas — they just aren't comparable in my eyes. It is for the best if we are all as healthy as possible. I don't think that's too controversial a viewpoint.Quote:
Originally Posted by airshifter
This does get an increasing amount of prominence, and quite correctly.Quote:
Originally Posted by airshifter
Again, I agree, but taking action to attempt to bring about lower levels of obesity is, simply, a good thing. If people choose not to heed it, that's up to them; nobody is forcing them into it. However, some things are just good for people and some aren't.Quote:
Originally Posted by airshifter
This is the main aspect that makes me differ in opinion. I do agree that in the public health system, obesity or any other specific medical problem creates a greater strain on the system. But really, anyone other than a perfectly healthy person creates a strain above that healthy person, and any system funded by all is created to share risk and financial strain.Quote:
Originally Posted by BDunnell
An overweight person with private insurance will pay more for that insurance, just as a smoker would. Likewise a person with a record of speeding tickets and accidents will pay more for insurance on a vehicle.
There are burdens on the public systems that are far greater than people than people overeating in my opinion. Just as with most public systems, that is why I feel that individuals should be more responsible for themselves.
Fair point, but no-one is suggesting an outright ban on unhealthy foods. That would be going too far.Quote:
Originally Posted by airshifter
There are, but it is possible for governments to deal with more than one problem at once.Quote:
Originally Posted by airshifter
I think the talk in relation to obesity is actually aimed at making people be more responsible for themselves, and, in particular, responsible towards themselves. The latter is also important.Quote:
Originally Posted by airshifter
That's classic "USA view". It happens that in most other countries there is free health for everybody, courtesy of the taxpayers. In that situation, ways of life that will make it harder for the system to cope should be addressed.Quote:
Originally Posted by airshifter
Of course, and precisely because of that there is a lot of campaigning against tobacco, alcohol, drugs, etc. Why not campaigning against obesity.Quote:
Originally Posted by airshifter
By the way, just in case, I'm obese myself. But I fight against it, and I don't really feel it "my right" to be like that. It's a bad example for my daughters and a risk to my health, the same that tobacco, drugs, or alcohol would. The good news is that I've lost 5kg on the last two months :)
Tinchote,
I understand that in countries with public provided healthcare it's a different burden, but unless everything unhealthy is stopped, the burden exists in some other form does it not?
I guess it's just a matter of viewpoint. Though I'm not overweight, I smoke. I feel it's my right to do so as long as it doesn't infringe on the rights of others. I pay more for my insurance, and accept that as a penalty for my choice.
I don't overeat, and I'm not overweight. I'm probably in better physical shape than a lot of people half my age.
I hardly ever drink alcohol at all, and never drive when I've had something to drink.
I've worked my entire life and paid taxes to support all kinds of things.
I feel that it's my right to take a risk to my health if it's something I enjoy. And I also feel that if people start picking and choosing what rights we no longer have, it will just be a matter of time before we all have none.
I'm cutting back on my smoking too Tin, must for the same reasons. My primary motivation is my daughter, who I've stressed the importance of not starting such a bad habit to.
Fair points :)Quote:
Originally Posted by airshifter
I guess that we agree that one of the governments' responsibility is to care for the well-being of its citizens. And so, it is reasonable to fight (with advertising, treatment, etc.) things that most likely reduce the quality of life of people.
And the study cited in the article at the top of this thread is a reference to precisely that. At least, that's how I understood it. No-one in the article says it's not someone's fault, but rather that it's very difficult for people to individually do anything about it.Quote:
Originally Posted by BDunnell
The forces at work, the bad habits, the self-esteem problems, you have to be really very strong to overcome the downers and not just give up. And as PerditaX demonstrates, it's more about finding the weight you're happy with as yourself than trying to adhere to an external standard.
I have no problem with adults like Perdita_X choosing a certain lifestyle, knowing that it may be detrimental to their health. I just hope that parents with a similar lifestyle are making appropriate choices for their children :mark:
You won't get shot down in flames with me Dave, I'm a lard @rse and wilfully scarf chocolate! I do eat salads and fruit - they are not banned in my life!