Matt Neal's comments in MN

there has been a few incidents in my 13 years track marshaling that have been reported and no action taken or reports getting lost and when i think about those meetings especially one were i was seconds from being killed by a now well known driver who after three laps under waved yellows at our corner he still came of and as a result i have a dislodged knee cap and that meeting again was a toca meeting were they wouldn,t give me a red flag as i had 2 cars in dangerous places it sucks sometimes. He was reported but no action was taken and 3 years on after repeated letters to him and his p.r still no apollogy to me or the other driver he nearly killed. but they still give us greef if they come off but if we all stood down one day they would all be in the **** no racing and no club would be able to afford to pay 100 - 500 marshals per weekend at minimum it would cost £50 per marshall per day some meetings are 3 dayers plus. maybe all circuits should get snatch licences and have recovery land rovers with fire equipment and a rear mounted lift system like they have on recovery trucks so we can at least lift the front or rear of the car up.

I was also in orange at Rockingham on turn 3. The 1st thing I think about the article is that TD do not know the difference between marshals, the ones in orange and the recovery/safety crews who at Rockingham were wearing white and black. And as already said both crews ultimately take instructions from race control.

After the comments that have been made I am seriously thinking of removing myself from the rest of the BTCC events I have volunteered for this season and not volunteering again for BTCC events.

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Originally Posted by BeeJ_UK

I was also in orange at Rockingham on turn 3. The 1st thing I think about the article is that TD do not know the difference between marshals, the ones in orange and the recovery/safety crews who at Rockingham were wearing white and black. And as already said both crews ultimately take instructions from race control.

After the comments that have been made I am seriously thinking of removing myself from the rest of the BTCC events I have volunteered for this season and not volunteering again for BTCC events.

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Well said BeeJ why should you volunteer and take abuse off idiots like the Neals or any other driver that should happen to land in front of you on your post you risk your lifes doing what you do just for the love of Motorsport....

I was just wondering if there were any groups left in BTCC that the Neal's haven't p'd off over the past few seasons? They've done the other teams/drivers, most of the fans, now they've turned on the marshals.

Who's left? Perhaps they'll come out with some arrogant remarks about the commentators at Thruxton?

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Originally Posted by MG2004

I was just wondering if there were any groups left in BTCC that the Neal's haven't p'd off over the past few seasons? They've done the other teams/drivers, most of the fans, now they've turned on the marshals.

Who's left? Perhaps they'll come out with some arrogant remarks about the commentators at Thruxton?

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There's the medical staff, car park attendants, Alan Gow...

give them time... if something goes pear shaped at Thruxton it will be the bloke that fried his brekkie's fault

Beej dont leave the BTCC because of the squeal family there is still a lot of good guys out there, dont forget we have a new "peoples champion" with Mat Jackson

If you click this link - http://mattneal.co.uk/phpbb/viewtopic.php?t=465 - he has put his side of the story.
I don't know who the journo in question was who has upset him - I haven't seen the post-Rock MN. Any ideas people?
As for me, I'm staying well out of this debate! I think enough has already been said...

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Originally Posted by Winchester

If you click this link - http://mattneal.co.uk/phpbb/viewtopic.php?t=465 - he has put his side of the story.
I don't know who the journo in question was who has upset him - I haven't seen the post-Rock MN. Any ideas people?
As for me, I'm staying well out of this debate! I think enough has already been said...

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The piece in the news section and the Rock' report were all by Matt James.

Should make for a rather pacey post Thruxton TTT :D

Just read Matts version of events at Rockingham via btcc.net forum..


http://mattneal.co.uk/phpbb/viewtopic.php?t=465

It's good to see both sides of the story. I do think he was over-egging it with the bit about going off to see sick kids because Seat didn't have time. Perhaps he should wear a halo.

Got to agree with that.. Maybe trying for the sympathy vote....

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Originally Posted by BeansBeansBeans

It's good to see both sides of the story. I do think he was over-egging it with the bit about going off to see sick kids because Seat didn't have time. Perhaps he should wear a halo.

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I agree. Plus, I suspect that that description is only one side of that particular story.

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Originally Posted by BeeJ_UK

I was also in orange at Rockingham on turn 3. The 1st thing I think about the article is that TD do not know the difference between marshals, the ones in orange and the recovery/safety crews who at Rockingham were wearing white and black.

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Sigh, this old thing again. I don't know where the suggestion that the Rockingham Safety Crew are not marshals came from but this is the third forum I have read it on. The Safety Team, like any rescue crew, are experienced and qualified marshals. Just because somebody doesn't wear orange doesn't mean they are not a marshal.

The recovery crews may not be marshals but, as far as I am aware, are brought in from professional vehicle recovery companies so probably have much more experience in recovering cars without damage than many marshals.

Also, forgive me if I am wrong here, but you seem to be implying that it is OK to have a go at the recovery guys and safety crew but not to have a go at "standard" marshals?

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Originally Posted by BeeJ_UK

And as already said both crews ultimately take instructions from race control.

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This is a very good point. Add in the pressure of a television schedule and it's hardly surprising that tensions have been raised.

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Originally Posted by Whitestar7

As a member of the orange brigade. You will find that marshals do everthing from
sprints to F1 with some doing up to 60+ days racing a year. Not just the 20 days that makes up BTCC. As for ELITE . We are professional ! (albeit unpaid) volunteers. I have 20 years of marshalling experience and I have 15 years of race rescue work. I have no idea where you would find anyone more qualified than us, the marshals who already cover BTCC events.

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Have you ever thought that maybe I was talking about people like you as the elite, not just anyone. Actually, in my opinion, I think the problem is not the actual marshalls, but sometimes the drivers of the recovery trucks. Maybe that is what should be brought to each circuit intead?

Just read the whole thread (I replied above before getting to the end) and I still stand by my above comment. It's more the "Joe's Garage" type bloke I think where the ego kicks in far more than a marshall.

I ddind't even know what a "live snatch" was either, let alone know that only two circuits had the required permit for it.

I have always thought that the speed of the "catch-up" cars under a safety car lap is out of order. Maybe it should be monitored with speed traps and if you are found to be travelling above a certain speed, you are penalized as soon as the safety car has pulled off. That way it would put you out of the race anyway. either that or disqualify that driver from the result.

Hold on you keep forgetting the BOBS which i'm very proud to be there are a few of us that travel outside of the Silverstone Home of British Motorsport to other circuits. I still think that there should be a few quick response units of trained marshals or full time circuit staff who discuss at every meeting how teams would like there cars towed or lifted as from experiance its easier to pull a car forwards out of the gravel than pull it backwards but this is nit always easy as sometimes to achieve this you have to go track side and a lot of drivers under yellows don't slow down so we have to tow them backwards causing more damage or simply take away gravel traps and have run of areas like Silverstone but then you would lose a lot of veiwing points because you would be so far away from the track

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Originally Posted by unsung hero

Hold on you keep forgetting the BOBS which i'm very proud to be there are a few of us that travel outside of the Silverstone Home of British Motorsport to other circuits. I still think that there should be a few quick response units of trained marshals or full time circuit staff who discuss at every meeting how teams would like there cars towed or lifted as from experiance its easier to pull a car forwards out of the gravel than pull it backwards but this is nit always easy as sometimes to achieve this you have to go track side and a lot of drivers under yellows don't slow down so we have to tow them backwards causing more damage or simply take away gravel traps and have run of areas like Silverstone but then you would lose a lot of veiwing points because you would be so far away from the track

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apologies for my ignorance, but who are the BOBS?

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Originally Posted by taffy

Just read Matts version of events at Rockingham via btcc.net forum..


http://mattneal.co.uk/phpbb/viewtopic.php?t=465

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The dig at Seat is probably the worst thing about this whole stupid incident. A blow too low :mad:

Are black orange baxxxxsteds from silverstone we wear the black and orange overalls insead of all orange

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Originally Posted by PapaJuliet

Sigh, this old thing again. I don't know where the suggestion that the Rockingham Safety Crew are not marshals came from but this is the third forum I have read it on. The Safety Team, like any rescue crew, are experienced and qualified marshals. Just because somebody doesn't wear orange doesn't mean they are not a marshal.

The recovery crews may not be marshals but, as far as I am aware, are brought in from professional vehicle recovery companies so probably have much more experience in recovering cars without damage than many marshals.

Also, forgive me if I am wrong here, but you seem to be implying that it is OK to have a go at the recovery guys and safety crew but not to have a go at "standard" marshals?

This is a very good point. Add in the pressure of a television schedule and it's hardly surprising that tensions have been raised.

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Please tell me where I said that it is OK to have a go at recovery but not at marshals, all I said was have a go at the right people. In the days of dwindleing marshal numbers it does not do recruitment any good at all having the motor sport press publish articles saying marshals can not do their job properly. In my view the Saftey team did the only thing they could do in the situation, do do a full lift in that position would most likely needed a red flag. I only mentioned the difference to highlight how pants the article was as TD could not tell the difference. I am sorry if I caused offence to the Safety Team that was not my intention as they do a very good job.

they can be done under saftey car brands do it so do silverstone

this maybe going a tad of the topic of this thread but has anyone else noticed that Neal's attitude has changed alot this year, and also in the last couple of years as well. In 2004 I was so happpy he was champion but last year he did a Rykard Rydell and played mr innocent to all the incidents that he was involved in even though he he usually gives it out as well as he is given. He also seemed so grumpy after rockingham as well.

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Originally Posted by BeeJ_UK

Please tell me where I said that it is OK to have a go at recovery but not at marshals, all I said was have a go at the right people.

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You didn't say it but by pointing out the distinction you appeared to be implying it and it seemed to me to be an irrelevant point. But as I said, I'm sorry for misinterpreting you.

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Originally Posted by BeeJ_UK

In the days of dwindleing marshal numbers it does not do recruitment any good at all having the motor sport press publish articles saying marshals can not do their job properly.

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I TOTALLY agree. This whole saga has rather annoyed me, not only the original posted comments but the apparent demarkation between "us" (marshals) and "them" (recovery) and buck-passing by people who should have known better (not meaning you this time, comments on another forum) so maybe I read too much into your post.

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Originally Posted by BeeJ_UK

In my view the Saftey team did the only thing they could do in the situation, do do a full lift in that position would most likely needed a red flag. I only mentioned the difference to highlight how pants the article was as TD could not tell the difference. I am sorry if I caused offence to the Safety Team that was not my intention as they do a very good job.

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Thank you. I hope we see you back at Rockingham some time.

Having just read the Matt Neal forum item that was linked here, I note he didn't once say the original journalist who broke the story lied. Funny that, he just said it was 'misleading' and added other things he'd said - never once mentioning it was untrue in any way.

And the bit about SEAT was a sad attempt at sympathy - it had nothing at all to do with marshals :mark: I'm sure the hour spent with children makes little difference to the marshal situation ;)