The year I intend to go at least one of the days, Alonso won't be there. Bummer!
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The year I intend to go at least one of the days, Alonso won't be there. Bummer!
There are so many theories on what happened that it is pretty hard to sort them all out .
Vettel said "strange" , and Button said "strange" , and just about every other living F1 driver has given an opinion .
Retrograde amnesia , but absolutely nothing wrong , physically or neurologically is the word from the docs , so to sit out is normal , for a little longer apparently .
But , "strange" comments have lead some to question whether the amnesia was a result of the crash , or a cause , as Fernando cannot remember the moments before the impact at all .
What I'm lead to wonder is whether the regular G forces experienced in an F1 car could result in what might be described as tiny concussions .
And , could these accumulate and result in a more fragile overall condition , in regards to further concussion ?
The F1 cockpit is a violent place , where braking , or even just lifting crunches you into your belts .
It's a place where the speed of a corner multiplies the weight of the head , often to the point where the driver can no long hold it up , himself , even with necks that make the head look small , even with the helmet on .
The brain is inside there .
I guess what I'm wondering , is if a driver can get a bit "punch drunk" from regular racing circumstances , without any serious meetings with walls or other hard objects .
I remember a few years ago , when drivers were testing in the States at Texas motor speedway , and were blacking out , doing 4Gs for a sustained period .
They called NASA and were informed that jet pilots were wearing G suits for working anything over 2.5Gs .
F1 , albeit for less duration , gets over that in braking , about a zillion times every race .
Does it add up ?
They were majorly at risk, and in this instance Fred's Dr's are only too cautious if he didn't bump his head again in Australia.Quote:
Originally Posted by steveaki13
An interesting bit from ESPN:
Quote:
the fact it was Alonso in Spain may have heightened the level of caution and intrigue - a McLaren spokesperson initially told the media they would not name the hospital because "half of Spain would be outside". But the prevailing reason for the caution afforded to the Spaniard is much easier to understand.
The McLaren statement, which made it clear Alonso is otherwise perfectly healthy, said doctors want to eliminate the risk of a condition known as Second Impact Syndrome (SIS). In the press conference he gave in Barcelona, Ron Dennis frequently mentioned rugby union when talking about Alonso's road to recovery. Last January SIS claimed the life of rugby player Ben Robinson, a 14-year-old from Northern Ireland who collapsed and died after being repeatedly sent back onto the field after being treated for three separate blows to the head.
SIS can occur when a first concussion has not fully healed and another is sustained, leading to the brain swelling rapidly and catastrophically. There is no defined period of how long SIS can be a cause for concern but it is usually held an athlete should not return until the symptoms of the initial injury are completely gone. Crucially, neither impact has to be considered severe for SIS to occur. BrainandSpinalCord.org states: "Second impact injury can result within a matter of days or weeks, or it can occur in the same game or competition if the athlete isn't removed and treated after the first concussion. Neither impact has to be severe for second impact syndrome to occur. Symptoms usually occur immediately following the second impact and progress rapidly."
Read more at http://en.espnf1.com/f1/motorsport/s...ZJKZBLFjlmz.99Quote:
And this "risk" point is crucial when dealing with any head injury. Alonso's crash did not lead to serious injury but he was unconscious after his crash and his lengthy stay in hospital reflected that. He is perfectly healthy in every sense of the word but a risk - a minute risk, but a risk all the same - remains and he will miss the first race of the year. It will frustrate his fans, McLaren and the Spaniard himself, but his well-being is and always should be the most important part of this story.
Yes. Get well Fernando.Quote:
Originally Posted by N. Jones
We do not know that Alonso was concussed.
It has been reported that Alonso had some symptoms of a concussion, but those symptoms left room for doubt.
Martin Brundle also thinks the situation is "very strange".
A person using logic and critical thinking could wonder "whether Alonso crashed and was then injured, or if he suffered a medical issue prior to hitting the wall."
If the medicos were convinced Fred had suffered a concussion and were giving advice regarding exposure to a second concussion the announcement Fred would miss the season opening first race could have been made many days sooner.
http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/br...a-very-strange
"There is no concussion, anything. He had the symptoms at one stage but nothing that shows," said Dennis at the time.
"Something is amiss," former McLaren driver and now leading British commentator Brundle told the Telegraph.
"Something doesn't add up.
"It's a very strange situation. There's a lot of smoke and mirrors around."
According to Brundle, the question to answer is whether Alonso crashed and was then injured, or if he suffered a medical issue prior to hitting the wall.
"Is it cause or is it effect? We don't know," he said.
"Everybody is a little bit coy about it so something isn't quite right."
I have actually been off motorsport for a month due to knocking myself out in a hang gliding accident. My doctor basically explained about this Second Impact Syndrome and what damage I could do if I was involved in a big impact or hard landing in a rally.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tazio
I will have a checkup tomorrow to see if I am allowed to compete again.
Ray
yeah that mclaren was so fast it just shocked the sh!t out of alonso :)
In the US, the National Football League just paid off a class action lawsuit over concussions that was somewhere in the $200 million range. I don[t follow football and don't really know the details, but I do know there was a huge stink over it and the NFL really got slammed. Maybe the FIA is trying not to get caught up in anything like that.Quote:
Originally Posted by steveaki13
http://www.bbc.com/sport/0/formula1/31732315
"However, if the FIA's investigation into the accident throws up any issues of concern, they have the right to ask further questions, including to demand the driver's full medical records"
Could a medical issue have caused the crash?
Apart from one exception, Hartstein says the chances are "extremely slim" of the crash being caused by Alonso suffering some form of cerebral or physiological abnormality.
Of the possibilities that could cause a driver to act in such a way in the car, he says: "Hypoglycemia? He's never had it in his life before, so why would it happen on his second flying lap?
"Epilepsy? The fact he was braking is inconsistent with that.
"Some kind of loss of vision that meant he could not see but could still use his limbs? A bit of a stretch; really hard to imagine."
That, Hartstein says, leaves arrhythmia - an irregular heart rate - which can be tested for. And something called corotid sinus hypersensitivity.
This is where pressure on a certain point of the corotid artery - the main one in the neck supplying the brain - causes an extreme drop in heart rate and therefore blood pressure, and can cause someone to pass out.
This, Hartstein says, is "surprisingly common", and certainly could not be ruled out for someone going through a high-G corner wearing an F1 driver's head and neck support.
Hmm, if this is true the other team seem puzzled too
http://www.worldcarfans.com/11503058...crash---report
Sourced from Sport Bild, which I know nothing about... is it a reputable organ, or a gossip rag? Threats of a boycott if more transparent information is not forthcoming do sound a little overblown.Quote:
Originally Posted by COD
I'm not german, so can not comment on their reliability, but at least they are quite big http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sport_BildQuote:
Originally Posted by AndyL
Because everyone keeps saying the accident was very strange, no wonder if the teams are worried. If something does cause a driver to loose conciousnes while driving, think what could happen at 300km/h
the thing is they are talking about KERS witch each team has their ownQuote:
Originally Posted by COD
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kinetic...ecovery_system
"Two minor incidents were reported during testing of various KERS systems in 2008. The first occurred when the Red Bull Racing team tested their KERS battery for the first time in July: it malfunctioned and caused a fire scare that led to the team's factory being evacuated.[5] The second was less than a week later when a BMW Sauber mechanic was given an electric shock when he touched Christian Klien's KERS-equipped car during a test at the Jerez circuit.[6]"
True bur Fred DIDN'T take a nap, he was braking and changing gears all the way to the wall ergo he was fully awake and in control of himself. All that happened is that he went too fast got out wide and lost traction, corrected, but unfortunately his car gripped up suddenly, and he hit the wall.Quote:
Originally Posted by COD
Basically a combination of speed, and gusty winds caused Fred to make an error. Because mistakes from him are so rare, we all seem to be looking for the sniper on the grassy knoll.
Fred thought it was 1995 after he bumped his head. I wonder what he said when he checked his bank account? :p: :angel:
In other news, reports have emerged that Harrison Ford's participation in the upcoming Australian GP is in doubt following his accident.
Was he still shocked that Everton won the FA Cup final?
http://www.theguardian.com/sport/201...-australian-gp
"McLaren have confirmed Fernando Alonso suffered temporary memory loss in a testing crash last month but played down media reports that the double world champion forgot he was a Formula One driver.
Spain’s El Pais newspaper had reported on Thursday that the driver told doctors testing his recall when he regained consciousness: “My name is Fernando, I race karts. I want to be a Formula One driver.”
"
It will be interesting to hear what else gets revealed about this incident. David Coulthard doesn't seem happy with the official story so far.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/31759693
And Jenson has apparently seen something strange in the telemetry figures from Fernando's car.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/31732315
So, I'm waiting to see what Eddie Jordan has to say. If there is anything suspect going on then he's sure to know about it, and he's bound to at least allude to it, if not say outright.
That aside, let's hope that Fernando is back in the car in time for Malaysia.
I'm seriously saddened by the fact that Honda is probably not going to make a major impact this year, cause i desperately want ALO to win another title. That would be news that i could read over and over until i were blue in the face.
Quite frankly, i'm tired of reading yet another article that simply cannot shed any more light onto what we already know. All joking aside, i seriously think someone remotely caused the car to go into a spin. Someone who really wants to see ALO hurt badly. Kevin?
it really makes you wonder how serious his condition is
Alan Jones (there was talk yesterday he may never return to f1)
Mark Webber (Alonso could miss upto to 4 races)
http://tenplay.com.au/sport/rpm/the-team
Hey Bag
JV is slamming Fred
Whats up with that
I think he's fine. Ron gave out some duff information when he said he wasn't concussed. That was later corrected. He hit his head twice, on either side of the cockpit, which is how he suffered the concussion. Standard advice is to refrain from activity that is likely to result in another concussion for 1 month. Melbourne falls within the month, Malaysia after a month. The rumour mill is in absolute overdrive, but there is nothing to suggest that it was more than an unlucky accident, but because it's rare for someone as experienced as Alonso to drop it in just testing, and also rare for such an accident to result in a relatively serious concussion. Maybe there was a problem with the car, but the outcome is the same, concussion, back in a month. I wouldn't listen to Alan Jones, I get the impression he doesn't know which way up he is most of the time. DC is relying on Ron's statement about no concussion. No one seems to have actually spoken to Fernando.
Don't know , cowboy , but we can assume JV might have a few insides on how Zo really was when wearing red .Quote:
Originally Posted by Roamy
Remember , he was one paranoid l'il buckaroo when he ran that Mac the last time . He can be a little disruptive when provoked with lesser results .
He's not known as a developer , but rather a guy who can drive the hell out of anything you give him .
It was designed for him , so Kimi couldn't drive the thing , and it was frustrating for everyone .
But , now he'll have Button setting things up , so he should be happier , as the car should keep improving .
And it had better keep improving from where they started , as they've told us not to lower our high expectations of them putting Mac back on top , and they are looking more than a little shaky at the moment .
:stareup: :laugh:Quote:
Originally Posted by Bagwan
That's pretty funny Bags!
Come on dawg, in 2006 and 2007 Alonso was a great car developer and thanks to his feedback both Renault and McLaren were so fast. I guess he got stupider when he went to Ferrari! :idea:
Get real dude, Jacques is talking shit, plain and simple. His comment had to do with disrespect. How disrespectful was Fred? Answer; a lot less than he had the right to be, and what he did say was simply speaking the truth with a touch of sarcasm. he could have said a lot worse, and not be out of line IMO
How soon they forget :rolleyes:Quote:
Ferrari team principal Stefano Domenicali has shed a little more light on the decision to drop Kimi Raikkonen and hire Fernando Alonso, saying that Alonso is a better development driver, more in the mould of Michael Schumacher and that is what the team needs
yeah Stefano Domenicali forgot everything
Great at developing cars nobody else could drive does make you look better than your team mate .Quote:
Originally Posted by Tazio
Ask the Fish , or JV for that matter , as he had to fill in , in a Fred configured car himself .
I guess that's what the shoe did , too , but he never dissed the brand , or the team , and when he took over the wheel of the red car , it really was a piece of crap , and then he won .
Quote:
Originally Posted by Triumph
True, but the something strange that JB saw could be as simple as the entry speed into the corner. i.e. Fred was 12km faster in on that lap compared to the others etc
Like the 2007 McLaren? :rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by Bagwan
Yes I remember it well. JV looked quite foolish in that little stint! :angel:Quote:
Originally Posted by Bagwan
In fact in the same car Jarno was performing swimmingly until he gave up on the last corener of the last lap in France, and let Rubens steal a podium away from him. That pissed Flavio off enough to eventually resort to Jacques. Why for could Jarno drive the R24 but JV just took a shit in it?
:sailor:Quote:
JT:
I go to every race feeling optimistic, but especially Barcelona. I didn't get past the first corner last year, but the car was very strong, and we know the R24 is very competitive there too. I have had my strongest start to the season since I joined Renault, and we know this is historically a good circuit for our car. Our rivals are very strong at the moment, and the battle is very close, but we will keep pushing to improve our performance.
;)Quote:
I wish Kevin all the best for this weekend in Australia, and I know the car is in his safe hands!"Even though we faced a lot of challenges in the tests, I am very encouraged by the feeling I got from the car, and I'm looking forward to going through all of the data from this weekend with the team to continue our push for development and improve our performance
http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/al...n-in-malaysia/
Jarno impressed in that car , Taz , you're right , but only at the start or the season if I am remembering right .
As it went along , it became edgier , and Fred , with his "crank the wheel" style moved ahead .
And , that's the car JV inherited .
And , somehow , Taz-man , I don't remember JV as looking as "foolish" as you seem to .
Find me a quote that uses that word to describe his outing at Renault .
Sorry Bagman, I remember a radio broadcast from the GP of China JV's first race in the R24, if I'm not mistaken. Jacques asked his race engineer where he was slow, and the response that was (I'm pretty sure) broadcast worldwide was....."Everywhere!" :spinhead:
I remember that , too , Taz .Quote:
Originally Posted by Tazio
We all laughed .
But , I also remembering him being just a tenth down on Fred in quals at one of the races , which is better than that guy he replaced , on average .
Oh, what an interesting discussion. 2004 and involving Trulli!
Anyway, my 5 cents. Villeneuve clearly didn't perform in those three races for Renault. I don't think we need to find excuses. He was unfamiliar with the car, thrown into deep end and against Alonso. It is worth reminding, how did Grosjean fare in late 2009 in the same situation - he was also nowhere.
Also JV's performance wasn't comparable to Trulli. Trulli was going well for half a year and though his performance dropped, was still leading Alonso in points before getting sacked. Though Trulli was also absolutely nowhere in the 2004 Italian GP, but this was his last race for Renault and I think by that time he already knew he was out and had no motivation.
I hope that Alonso is OK. I sat up when I read an article that was querying an electric shock. That surprised me because I had always been confident in the overall safety of the KERS implementation. A couple of early fires but it has been pretty much incident free technology since day one.
On this "Second Impact Syndrome". I actually caught a movie a couple of weeks back called "Crash Reel". Its about snow boarders and one chap in particular who had a terrible brain injury and everything he went through. The risk of a second concussion was top of the list as he recovered.
Definitely worth watching simply as a movie and also for the documentary value for anyone interested in sports injury and recovery.
Fair enough Baggie. Jacques really did have very little chance of challenging Fred. I think we may disagree on a few things but that is not one of them. I think we do disagree about the driveability of the R24. I've read several articles where both JV, and JT praised its driveability. However, back on topic; I just think that people that live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones. JV was rather disrespectful in his latest racing venture, as well as just totally sucking.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bagwan
So I think he probably should have just kept his mouth shut, considering his replacement did in one race what JV couldn't do all season.Quote:
"From our side, we're not happy that he has been critical of Albatec or the championship. Albatec is in World Rallycross for the long haul and is in support of [championship promoters] IMG."
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/116831
But what amazes me is that people still quote him. His is an opinion he is entitled to, but I put absolutely no credence in it.Quote:
Albatec Seals 2014 With Double Semi Final Performance In Argentina
Albatec Racing brought its 2014 to a close with both two-litre 16v Peugeot 208s reaching the finals in the last round of the FIA World Rallycross Championship presented by Monster Energy. Partnering Albatec Team Principal Andy Scott, 2007 British Rallycross Champion Ollie Donovan joined the Dumfries squad aboard one of its 600bhp Supercars following a successful return to British rallycross action this year, and both drivers made it through to their respective semi finals in the Total Rallycross of Argentina at the stunning Autodromo Rosendo Hernandez
Fred gave his all for a very good chunk of his career at Ferrari, and some butt hurt petty Italians are trying to discredit him. His performance at Ferrari is well documented, and his results, especially compared to his teammates is beyond remarkable.
I am beginning to think that Fred is faking it. Maybe he just doesn't want to drive that piece of dog poop?
Having probably seen the Australian GP on TV, Fernando must be really regretting quitting Ferrari by now. There must have been quite a bit of delusion and wishful thinking in believing that McLaren could compete with the big leagues in the first year with a new engine manufacturer.
Well he's not the first F1 driver in recent history to get a 30M sabbatical :andrea:
Quote:
Originally Posted by zako85
Even if he did stay at Ferrari, I wonder if he would be content with a third place maybe at every race? At least some fans must be happy that he singlehandedly extended Kimi's career.
stand by the mclaren was quite quick in the corners !!!!
That's surely a good thing, once they get the engine firing at least as well as the Renault, they'll be fighting STR, Sauber, FI and Red Bull