Quote:
Originally Posted by Knock-on
Considering Fred and Lewy had enough problems beating their own teammates i don't imaigne it would bother vettel one bit.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Knock-on
Considering Fred and Lewy had enough problems beating their own teammates i don't imaigne it would bother vettel one bit.
Yes he would. Vettel spent 3 years in that car and knows it inside out. Fernando or Lewis coming over would find themselves in a car they don't know and with no testing allowed they wouldn't have the time to get to know it. As was proven by the late season update last year, the RB is tailor made to fit Vettel's preferences. That would seriously stunt Fernando and Lewis. Can we please stop talking drivers down because we don't like them? Vettel, Alonso, Kimi and Lewis are top-notch drivers in the cars they're currently in - let's leave it that hat.Quote:
Originally Posted by Knock-on
Well vhatever, you might want to also consider how much trouble Vettel had beating Webber in 2010. Just sayin'.
Either that or quit the trolling.
Oh I noticed you had answered me. I don't know, which comments you meant, but I certainly do think Hamilton was much more superior to Button in 2012 than the point standings show.Quote:
Originally Posted by henners88
So Rosberg has had two poles in a row. Early in the season the question was asked - can he learn to untap his speed and deliver in Q3? He has done that recently. Now the question is how consistently he can do that and how much more is Hamilton going to blend into the Mercedes team. But there are of course no guarantees. Button started in 2010 in McLaren with two race wins and a championship lead. But he wasn't going to get more impressive than that later on after further 'settling into the team'.
two poles :o
Formula 1® - The Official F1® Website
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4 Lewis Hamilton British Mercedes 50
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It didn't take Kimi long to adjust to a new car in 2012.Quote:
Originally Posted by dj_bytedisaster
It did. Kimi was very consistent, but not spectacular in 2012. Also, he had pre-season testing to get the hang of the car and the cars haven't changed much since he had left F1.Quote:
Originally Posted by zako85
That is true, but Lewis Hamilton has admitted that it takes time to adjust to driving a new car even if the regs are not much different to last season. Having two years out of the sport like Kimi and then coming back and adjusting back in to things is no mean feat. These guys are some of the best in the world at what they do and I don't think adapting to a different racing environment is quite as easy as some fans would like to believe.Quote:
Originally Posted by dj_bytedisaster
I like the way the McLaren team-mate battle seems to be hotting up. Based on Sauber days it looked like Pérez has a really tyre-friendly driving style - he could both conserve and go fast. I have to say that this year he is sort of showcasing this skill as well - he can both race and conserve tyres without destroying them in the process. This was the case in both Bahrain and Monaco. Everyone needed to save tyres, yet Pérez seemingly didn't do it, went for it, but the tyres didn't go off.
In terms of driving Pérez reminds me a bit of young Montoya. Has speed in pockets, goes for the overtakes, but can get slightly carried away with in in the process and loses points. Pérez was in the process of outracing Button, but Button got the result in the end. The more Pérez overtook, the more it looked like he was getting overambitious and could easily have a crash, which he sadly did.
Harsh learning lesson there - you can race, you can impress and pass, but still have to choose your battles. I hope he can keep this speed he has recently found. Confidence in the car enables driver to be more racy as well as we have seen. But the same questionmark from Sauber days remains thus far - he can be fast, but his ability to get consistent results remains in doubt.
I agree that Perez has an element of Montoya about him.
I thought he completely overshown Button today. He got stuck in and while top drivers were swanning around say "You cant overtake at Monaco" he showed you can if you are brave.
Shame about the last incident, but he can learn and at least he knew you could attack around Monaco.
I'll third that notion about Perez. The guy is a racer, not just a driver. And I like racers. As much as some will blame him for the incident, I see Kimi as much at fault, and I've been a big supporter of Kimi since he entered F1. Checo made it past a one time WDC with ease, past a two time WDC with ease (and Alonso is no slouch by any means), and finally had an issue with the third WDC in the train when he and Kimi got together after the multiple pass attempts.
But he raced at Monaco. He rolled the dice and this time he lost. But in the process he made a point. :)
Being fast and audacious is better than just being reliable and plodding. Atleast for us spectators. There is still time for Perez to learn how to pick his battles and be more consistent while keeping his natural instincts to pass. I would rather see people like Hamilton (who I dislike as a personality) drive rather than someone like Button.
Well six races on our way!
We can make a short balance now.
RedBull - Vettel is stronger then Webber, no surprice there!
Ferrari - Alonso vs Massa the same story as RedBull, but Massa is much stronger then last season.
Lotus - Kim for champion is my opinion and with Grosjean driving like this it's just a mather off time untill Valsecchi stands in
McLaren - Button has the upperhand on Perez for now, but I see some improvement with the Mexican now some commun sence an he can beat Button
Mercedes - the people that thought Lewis had a easy pray in Rosberg must wonder now, Rosberg is performing much stronger then Lewis at this moment
FIF1 - Sutil and di Resta, I wonder who will win the season here
STR - Ricciardo vs Vergne, the same as FIF1 but I think Ricciardo is a little better
Williams - the car is rubbish and Maldonado is back were he came from, Bottas is using his head more then his experienced teammate and has a little advantage in my opinion
Sauber - Well Hulkenberg has no match in Guiterez as expacted, when it wasn't for the money the Maxican would be replaced by Frijns already
Caterham - Everybody will be thinking what is hapening here! The poor driver vd Garde was as strong as Pic in the first 3 races, Pic was much stronger with the updates in Bahrein, but vd Garde was the stronger one in Barcelona with 90% off the updates as in Monaco with the same package as Pic. He is the best driver of the little teams for the last two races. And it doesn't surprice me at all! He was better then Pic at GP2, is a great teamplayer and knows how to bring a car to the finish aswell.
Marussia - Bianchi by far!
Ok I've just looked through this and am also going to give my foolproof utterly objective tam-mate summary so far (and the fact I haven't watched any races, and only followed the first 2 on the radio will in no way impede me)
[I'm being totally sarcastic here btw] :)
RED BULL - Sadly Mark looks like he's had enough and has lost his steam. Young Ronny Cox is making hay, but at least his rather fake nice guy cover now appears to have been blown.
FERRARI - Happily Massa has looked much better (even though I was never much of a fan). I am so sad for Alonso, for while he now has his hands on a car that occasionally keeps within spitting distance and more of the Red Bull, he now looks to have simply tyred himself out through the years of struggle (unlike some drivers who have had it rather easier)
MCLAREN - First a word about the car: Looks like no-one learned the lesson from 2004 where Williams and McLaren went the radical route and were supposed to run away with everything whereas Ferrari were conservative and evolutionary not revolutionary. Guess who dominated everything that season? Now in 2013, things are the same for those teams, and any chance I have of success in FGP this year have long since gone down the loo. The drivers - well Button actually kinda impressed me in Malaysia but I have noticed that young Checo is really matching Jens, and more in the races. Where's Hamilton when you need him?
LOTUS - I've not been that keen on Kimi, and am still reserving judgment, but I have been quietly very impressed with what he has done since his return. He has totally outperformed Grosjean and I admire the way he keeps quietly building himself up. He looks like he is taking this seriously, which is all I want to see. I still don't much enjoy the eccentric claims that Kimi was the best driver last year despite Romain Running Rings around him much of the time... Sadly Romain is exactly as I predicted, overall much more stable, but the flair has been put out and he appears pretty slow...
MERCEDES - Well now I guess this shouldn't have been too much of a surprise. The obvious implications are that Michael wasn't that bad after all (I believe that's true), that Nico is after all a top driver - I STILL don't think he is a very transecendent driver of his cars though (look, it's 3am, I don't care if I'm not making sense - I don't have as much time on my hands anymore. :) ) Obviously, the Lewis haters are having a bit of a field day, but Lewis I am sure will get on top of Nico still (and we will all call Nico average again...)
SAUBER - Flipping Nora what on earth has Nico Hulkenberg done to deserve this? Still doing an exceptional job I think. Just hope he isn't forgotten. Obviously easily beating Gutierrez but I do believe Esteban has talent there (even though there are others more deserving).
FORCE INDIA - Poor Nico Hulkenberg, he should be embarrassing Paul di Resta by rights. At least Paul is trying (a little too hard I think) to smile more - I don't think he needs to try that hard, just don't be miserable and feel entitled and all that. I don't know why anyone thinks Sutil (who I like) will beat Paul. Over the season I fully expect Paul to take this one. In 2011 he was behind Sutil because he was a ROOKIE.
WILLIAMS - Wow did Mike nick the 2013 McLaren design or something? (Ouch that was a real cheap shot FROM ME...) I didn't have a clue what to expect from Bottas. The people who thought he could show Pastor the way have been proved right. Bottas has looked far more impressive - great job.
TORO ROSSO - Same old, but further up than last year. I'm interested to see what these two can do later on this year. Really hard to tell who's the best, both have their highs (Ricciardo in China and Vergne's race pace in the early races)
CATERHAM - van der Garde better against Pic than I expected. Charles needs to step on it. Maybe he looks at that Marussia mournfully. Hope he doesn't become like Timo Glock and that's the end of it...
MARUSSIA - No surprise here for Jules. No disrespect to Luis Razia, but I'm glad someone can extract some sort of potential from that machine. Wish they had more money though. STOP YOUR GAMES Bernie. :(
That's about the worst excuse I have ever heard. Alonso had the car in 2010. His fault for not wining the championship. 2011 didn't have the car, 2012 his car didn't have the ultimate pace of the McLaren (fastest car in 2012) but it did have incredible reliability. As well, Alonso had incredible luck throughout the year. No punctures (Suzuka he drifted into Kimi it was Alonso's fault), no pit mishaps, when he won his rivals would score nothing or little. So it was all a bit skewed.Quote:
Originally Posted by rjbetty
For Schumacher's first five seasons with Ferrari he never had the best car.
And for four of those seasons he didn't convert either. He also didn't have the same level of competition the drivers have now IMHO. You don't rate Hill or Villeneuve who were Michael's key opponents of the 96, 97 seasons and Hakkinen was out of sorts and considering quitting by season five. If you want to bring Schumacher in as an example, I would say it supports that Alonso isn't doing too badly right now with the resources and level of competition.Quote:
Originally Posted by faster69
No Henners he's the worst on the grid, Ferrari has a car about 6 seconds faster than anyone else.Quote:
Originally Posted by henners88
Why do people bother responding to a dick :rolleyes:
Anyway, Nico has really upped his game and Lewis needs to get his eye in. I expect a change back to winning ways.
Checo is at a junction. He has speed but needs to temper it with a bit if nouce otherwise risk going the JPM route.
PdR looks like he's on the bounce. I hope he keeps it going.
Komi doing the biz. He's really matured as a driver although he's not really being pushed.
Alonso looked a bit out of salts in Monaco but expect its a blip. Massa having a strong showing for a lapdog.
The rest? Not bothered until something happens
One, who's been a bit overlooked is Adrian Sutil IMHO. Considering how long it took Hülkenberg to get up to speed after a year on the sidelines, it is amazing how quickly Sutil settled into the car. Drafted in at the last minute and having missed most of the winter testing, he was right up there with di Resta and more often than not even slightly faster. Were it not for rotten luck in many of the first races, he would be giving Button a run for the money.
When Schumacher won in Canada 98 it was only because his rivals were out of the picture.Quote:
Originally Posted by faster69
Hungaroring 98, one of the best drives in the history of the sport, a person could say that Schumacher only won that because Hakkinen had gearbox issues.
It's not all as straight forward as your rosey tinted glasses might make it seem. Even the greats need some luck in order to mount a championship challenge.
I read a great article about Lewis and his not feeling super confident in the Mercedes (yet).
Apparently, the Mercedes is built and designed around Brembo brakes. Nico gets on well with them, yet Lewis is used to his Carbon Industries brakes which he used at McLaren. The engineers at Mercedes have switched his car to CI brakes, yet it is taking some time to modify the car's design to them and getting it to work in harmony. Things like redesigned brake ducts all play into this, since the physical design and how it all fits to the car is slightly different. Considering how small parts on the car work with the overall aerodynamics, it can all add up to some time on the track.
Considering all this, Lewis has rather impressed in his short time with Mercedes. I'm willing to bet that as they get everything to work better to suit his style, he should surpass Nico sometime after the midpoint of the season and finish strong.
After all, he usually right behind Nico missing just a few tenths.
Did my eyes deceive me or did Romain do rather well today? He was talking candidly about how using a sport psychologist had improved his performance and mental approach but still looked a bit downcast. Perhaps today's result might give him the lift he needs.
As an aside, from a personal perspective he came across as a nice, down to earth young man. He might be a bit of a liability on track some times but I hope he sorts it out as I quite like him.
He seems great, and on the whole this season he has calmed down, but he is not as fast.
Apart from Monaco he seems to have lost his pace for the sake of being safe. Which is sad he couldnt do both. i.e drive fast but not crash.
Today however he did a good job.
I am not sure how much this is down to Grosjean and how much it is to do with the Double DRS system. Kimi was complaining about instability in the rear under braking.Quote:
Originally Posted by Knock-on
I think this is a case of shoddy new parts.
Grosjean was as quick as Kimi on the prime while Kimi was on the options in Q1. Something doesn't seem right here.
Absolutely. Seems like a fairly normal, down to earth, likable chap. Hope he regains some of last year's pace.Quote:
Originally Posted by Knock-on
Most of the season has passed, so we can make another summary.
Red Bull: Vettel's advantage over Webber this year has been more like 2011. Webber has been suffering from a fair amount of unluck, but it is worth noting that Vettel is leading qualifying battle of this pairing by an incredible 14:0! It would be a stunning achievement if he carried it till the end, especially considering, how close it was last year.
Ferrari: Same story as usual with Massa struggling to collect half of Alonso's points.
Mercedes: Up to the Canadian GP Lewis and Nico seemed roughly matched. They have seemed close to each other since the Belgian Grand Prix again, but during races inbetween Hamilton seemed to have an edge, which has contributed to the points gap the 2008 WDC currently enjoys.
Lotus: Since the German GP Grosjean has been up-to-speed and close to Kimi, but overall the damage was done and season was lost in the early part of the year already.
McLaren: There have been a fair amount of races in which Pérez can legitimately keep up with Button and compete against him. But on other occasions the Mexican has suffered from inconsistency and been left a long way behind in the points. A bit like Kimi v Romain. Sometimes the younger driver can take the fight to the leader, but inconsistency and maybe some unluck have left the junior a long way behind in points table. It is a tough job to compete against consistent drivers in the championship standings - you can't let in serious dips in forms.
Force India: it looks like once again they are pretty well-matched. Sutil is behind in points largely by the virtue of suffering a significant amount of unluck in the early part of the season, when the car was good and big points were available. Recently Force India's form has dropped, so it has become difficult to add to the tally and erase the points gap. But in any case they have been performing close.
Sauber: Gutiérrez is like Nakajima was compared to Rosberg. Sometimes he doesn't look too bad, but nonetheless is basically always behind his team-mate and struggles to get any points on board.
STR: for a moment somewhere in mid-season Vergne seemed promising, but overall Ricciardo has been more convincing. It is helped by the fact that the Frenchman still hasn't come strong in qualifying, which is a strength of the Australian and gives him a significant advantage.
Williams: it looks like there is little between them. Sometimes one guy finishes/qualifies above, sometimes the other.
Caterham: van der Garde has seemed quite close or should I say a match to Pic at least during the second half of the season.
Marussia: same story here, I have noticed Chilton has been very close to Bianchi in the second half of the season. Which makes me doubt about the hype of Bianchi that we had in the early races.
Is it really fair to call the Alonso-Massa situation a battle?
It's more like Badger Baiting.
And, like Badger Baiting, the Badger would be shot if it looked liked winning.
Is it really fair to call the Alonso-Massa situation a battle?
It's more like Badger Baiting.
And, like Badger Baiting, the Badger would be shot if it looked liked winning.
I typed that post in a cave.
That's why there was an echo.
Perhaps the most interesting recent stories have been Grosjean and Rosberg getting on top of their team-mates. At least temporarily.
Also Massa has been outqualifying Alonso a lot, but their comparative racing is still the same we have always seen.
The last couple of races have been stronger for Pérez too, at least compared to Button. I'd say ever since the Italian GP Pérez has been very close to Button, if not roughly a match during that time. But the points-battle has already been lost basically.
In Force India it is noticable that di Resta has been able to regain decent form after a string of crashes and it can be said he is about to legitimately beat Sutil this year.
Gutiérrez has slightly improved on average, but is still behind Hülkenberg and doesn't leave a strong overall impression IMO. Clearly in the bottom six drivers on the grid for me.
The only constant we have had all year is Vettel beating Webber. Sometimes by a small margin, sometimes by a big margin, but nevertheless ahead.
Two more Grands Prix to go - any more surprises?
For me I have been quite pleasantly surprised how Grosjean has improved this year :) He seems to be maturing and putting in better performances as the year is going on. Let's hope he keeps it up next year. We need more consistent, good drivers challenging up front :)
It is amazing how Grosjean has improved this season. Compare it to the crash fest of 2012 and apart from Monaco where he had a terrible weekend he has been sensible and fast.
He now looks like he could and will win Grand Prix in the future.
Never saw that a year ago.
I don't think anyone saw it! :DQuote:
Originally Posted by steveaki13
Remind you of a young Finn? Crashed a lot and was wild but fast in the early seasons, then matured!Quote:
Originally Posted by 555-04Q2
Sounds like you are referring to Mika (not Kimi). He did mature nicely as The Shoe found out :)Quote:
Originally Posted by SGWilko
House Point for you sir!Quote:
Originally Posted by 555-04Q2
To be honest, last year Grosjean finished second in Canada and was fairly close to winning at Valencia before alternator failure.Quote:
Originally Posted by steveaki13
So winning an odd race here or there was never out of question. However, consistency has been a big problem. We will see, what does the future bring on that front.
Why thank you sir :) And I can offer you a Noddy badge if you like :p:Quote:
Originally Posted by SGWilko
I remember Mika when he was young and brash, like the Takumo Sato of Finland! But he came good in the end didn't he :)
[quote=555-04Q2]Sounds like you are referring to Mika (not Kimi). He did mature nicely as The Shoe found out :)[/quote:1skss4pu]Quote:
Originally Posted by SGWilko
Not JJ Lehto then. :D
:rotflmao: Not! :rotflmao: