Can he quit using DMACK's altogether this season? His car is festooned with the logo though...Quote:
Originally Posted by vkangas
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Can he quit using DMACK's altogether this season? His car is festooned with the logo though...Quote:
Originally Posted by vkangas
We can add Atko to that list as well. We all know he is not coming home to the WRC.Quote:
Originally Posted by SlowSon
I have doubts about the next generation. On this "lost generation" (sounds like a UN memo on poverty in the 3rd world); they probably would have had drives if more companies were involved and possibly if M-Sport had not maintained the same driver line up for many seasons (who could blame them as without Gronholm they had no chance of the Manufacturers title). For me I have followed drivers like P-G etc for many years and it sucks for me to see them fall just short. Life goes on however.
He is under a contract of five rallyes with Dmack. Quitting using them means quitting driving :mark:Quote:
Originally Posted by Plan9
Very interesting discussion about this lost generation. When those currently ~30-y-o drivers were rising stars, most of the manufacturers quitted WRC and there were no opportunities left. From that generation only Hirvonen and Sordo have come through and have had some kind of a decent career. But now those 30-y-o drivers are considered old and past their prime, because a new 20-25y generation is coming up. Which is kinda unfair as Panizzi and Rovanperä turned into WRC frontrunners only at around 35. And Grönholm had his first proper full factory season (incidentally including the title!) at 32.
But Bosse had number of works outings before.
+1 very true. The withdrawal of Subaru, Mitsubishi, Suzuki, Hyundai, Skoda/Seat et al is definitely a cause of these drivers not having a home. I also feel people like Ketomaa suffer because unlike Panizzi and Rovanpera they do not get to be "specialist" drivers and do at least a few rounds each year. Its also interesting to note that Solberg and Loeb are the two drivers from their generation to have gone furthest, Martin and Gardmister had their careers curtailed for example.Quote:
Originally Posted by jens
Also in a recent Auto Action magazine article (I'll try to find it) Leob despairs of the 20-25 generation because they feel its okay to crash as they can come back with "Rally 2" and are not interested in consistency. Loeb also found it interesting how few of these young guys could beat Delecour. the 30 year old generation has speed and for the most part has been quite impressive in the opportunities that they have been given. I do not want to see them disappear of fade away from WRC...
It seems that Ketomma will also do Rally Argentina.
http://www.rallyargentina.com/wp-con...s-RA-20129.pdf
That's something at least. Let's hope the DMack's do not shred beneath him on this event.
Yes, I know the conditions were awful in Portugal. Yes, I know there were lots of problems with the car, first with ride height, then with engine and after that with brakes. But c'mon, one proper stage time !!! That's not too much to ask. I'm way disappointed :mark:
I'm disappointed but not surprised. As I said in the Rally Portugal thread, I've never really understood the hype behind him. During the off season I had a few people trying to persuade me he was a future Bosse but I couldn't believe it was the case. And for one of the only times in history I seem to have been proven right. On a similar level to Araujo so far, and that certainly isn't encouraging!
Well, I'm surprised because he seem like a different man behind the wheel.Quote:
Originally Posted by pettersolberg29
I agree he seems like a different character, but I assume it's frustration at his inability to transfer his Finland and S2000 pace to a WRC car. Some drivers just aren't built for WRC cars - in Finland he'll be quick I'm sure, but it will take a lot of seasons and a lot of adapting for Ketomaa to get up to anything resembling competitive pace. And unfortunately time isn't on his side anymore.Quote:
Originally Posted by A.F.F.
I'm afraid I can't disagree with anything you say :mark:Quote:
Originally Posted by pettersolberg29
But I hope for the best.
Same. It would be nice to have another top quality driver even if only in a few select events a season. Now that Ostberg challenges for wins in Swede, would be nice if we had Ketomaa in Finland, possibly Tanak in GB or Sordo in Spain.
No future...
if his budget and sponsors allow he will be there...
none will waste money on ketomaa.
Correct me if I'm wrong but weren't you one of the main supporters of Ketomaa when the news of him in a WRC car came through? I'm not trying to catch you out, but just wondered why you think it's gone wrong and why your opinion has changed so quickly? Again, maybe I'm mistaken so apologies if you were of the same opinion as me.Quote:
Originally Posted by N.O.T
I was a supporter of many drivers who didn't make it and have no future...Atko, Meeke, Gardemeister, Kresta are some of them...when ketomaa got his chance i liked it but he failed miserably unfortunatellyQuote:
Originally Posted by pettersolberg29
Actually i want every driver who tries his luck in the WRC to be able to shine..the more top drivers we have the better...
When you support someone and have hopes doesn't mean you should be blind and not make any negative comments if they deserve them... Ketomaa was sweeping everyone including hanninen in s2000s so my hopes had a basis... Ketomaa is for sure no tourist and if he stays by paying i would have no problems with it.
that is the difference between humans and myself.
I feel like Ketomma is a bit of an wasted talent. If he started among the big boys earlier perhaps he could be something. It must be too difficult for him to match the likes of Ostberg or Tannak, some of these guys are already in their third or fourth entry in most of the rally's (Ostberg has been doing most rally's of the calendar for 3 or 4 years in a WRC car). For what I have seen in Portugal he lacks than extra bit of confidence which allows some to go flatout in those tricky places. It's not like he doesn't have the courage to, but it feels like he misses the knowledge to do that.
Gronholm started around the same age as ketomaa.
Ok but we know we will not have another Gronholm for some years. Despite missing the knowledge Gronholm always tried to go as fast as possible from the beggining and we know what what expense.... a considerable pile of wrecked rally cars.Quote:
Originally Posted by N.O.T
Plus Marcus had official support from very early in his career, and that must make a difference. I can't imagine what damage a wrecked car can have on a privateer budget.
well i think in the case of those that rent the cars they do not pat anything if the car goes to waste...insurance companies pay i think...if the car is bought then its anther story.Quote:
Originally Posted by Francis44
about gronholm you were right and 10 years back finacially things were far better for the wrc in general.
Ketomaa doesn't have Veronica by his side. :D
Fair points, but to go from 'he's a potential star' to 'no future' in like 4 rallies is quite drastic. I support Petter, but it doesn't mean he is guarded from criticism - when he crashed in Portugal I was the first to crticise him for being reckless! But if I believe he is still able to win rallies that doesn't change after 4 bad events.Quote:
Originally Posted by N.O.T
Really? Are 100% certain of that?Quote:
Originally Posted by Francis44
Im quite sure yes, Marcus didn't set much foot in the WRC without official support, outside of the World Championship I do not know.Quote:
Originally Posted by A.F.F.
well in finland he used his own cars i guess but in portugal 99 he used an official mitsubishi and in 2000 his peugeot days started...Quote:
Originally Posted by A.F.F.
What exactly do you mean by that?Quote:
Originally Posted by Francis44
Because before entering to WRC, Marcus gave his farm for rent to finance his rallying career at the age of 29. He didn't have a manager until he got offers from Ford and Peugeot. That was year later and basicly because he set so many fastest stage times in Rally Finland 1998. He got support from Robert Gröndahl who had worked with Toyota but apart from that, he was pretty much with his own gang.
He already got a contract with Peugeot when he drove Mitsubishi. He also drove one rally for Seat that year and it was all cool with Corrado Provera. He wanted and let Marcus drive those cars so Peugeot could use all the info they got.Quote:
Originally Posted by N.O.T
I was just trying to say almost everytime Marcus entered a WRC rally he had official support thus good cars, and was free to push.Quote:
Originally Posted by A.F.F.
Ofcourse before that I trust that he had difficult times and had to try very hard like everyone else eager to reach the top.
I thought he drove peugeot from 1999.Quote:
Originally Posted by N.O.T
He did. Peugeot entered only few rallyes first year, four if I recall right. In rallyes between Marcus was allowed to drive for Mitsubishi and Seat single events under a Peugeot contract.Quote:
Originally Posted by Barreis
Well, it's how you look at it really. Those were single try-outs, at rally Finland. One shot every year.Quote:
Originally Posted by Francis44
But if I go back to topic, about Ketomaa, I have a feeling that his results so far has not satisfied Mr. Harkimo. I don't know the guy but I've understood that he won't be bothered for long if success won't follow.
Well Ketomaa has already been replaced for Rally Argentina by Prokop so people are possibly losing patience already?
I didn't know there were a relations with their contracts? :eek:Quote:
Originally Posted by pettersolberg29
I dont think teher are relations between both. Perhaps just Dmack looking to expand their brand in the sport and Prokop surely could use the extra support.
I think he had moments of excellence. Rally NZ 2010 was fantastic for him and probably a career highlight for him. I have seen him do the odd APRC and Chinese event and he was not quite as amazing in them. I think it is about the benjamins more than anything else; a good car could make all the difference.Quote:
Originally Posted by pettersolberg29
I would say that is total BS. He just signed some new (imo good) sponsor deals last week. He has never denied that breaking into the WRC would be difficult.Quote:
Originally Posted by pettersolberg29
Unfortunately driver is just as good as his most last rally.
No need to be aggressive, but it is possible that some people are losing patience. Yeah he has new sponsors but Nobre has sponsors - doesn't mean he's quick. And he has said he expects podiums before and is nowhere near so he is obviously disappointed in his own performance too.Quote:
Originally Posted by Juha_Koo
I am not that familiar with the Ketomaa situation, but who is running the car? Someone mentioned something in the Portugal thread about Ketomaa's team appearing clueless about setup etc. Could it be a combination of bad set up and worse tires?