I know you've got a couple of weeks in between each race, but criss-crossing the continent from Ohio, to California, then all the way across to Maryland, only to return to California once more?Quote:
Originally Posted by ICWS
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I know you've got a couple of weeks in between each race, but criss-crossing the continent from Ohio, to California, then all the way across to Maryland, only to return to California once more?Quote:
Originally Posted by ICWS
If I'd known sooner that the IRL was going to be protecting the American open wheel street race tradition, I would have become a fan sooner too.
http://www.racer.com/dixon-supports-...rticle/216801/
will you support an early May road parade at IMS? 16th & Georgetown wants to know
http://auto-racing.speedtv.com/artic...s-mailbag-1116
NO! We already have enough road races.. I started to like the 2012 schedule, but there are already enough road races on the schedule for next year. They should've done this a few years ago, when there weren't that much road courses on the schedule.
The only way a road race at Indy makes sense is as a historic race of old Indycars on the road course sometime during May (opening day??) (just because it lets more people get a closer look at the cars at some sort of speed) - THAT I could support - not the current cars- that is foolish dilution of a tradition at the very best.....
Indy was diluted the day tony announced NASCAR was coming to town...
Indycars on the road coarse is coming.... If no in 2012 than 2013 ... Mark my words
Did you feel that way when F1 was there or the motorcycle races? While I understand the sentiment, I also realize that it is ridiculous to have a huge facility like that with only one event per year. The upkeep on the place must be huge and to expect only one event to pay for that guarantees an escalating ticket price for that event. Personally, I welcomed the idea of other series, if for no other reason, than to offset the ticket prices.Quote:
Originally Posted by SarahFan
Gary
I think you are probably right. The only other thing that MAY make sense is to make it a special invitational/ non-points race - a'la the Vegas attempt just to make it different/interesting....Quote:
Originally Posted by SarahFan
Absolutely I did Gary...... IMS is the holy grail of auto racing...the day Tony let NASCAR in was the day he legitimized it....
Quote:
Originally Posted by garyshell
F1 and motorcycles have a history with the Speedway. Just not a road course history.
So when does NASCAR start running the road course?
Not a road course history? When did F1 and motorcycles run an oval race?Quote:
Originally Posted by bugeyedgomer
Gary
Motorcycles 1909-1910Quote:
Originally Posted by garyshell
F-1 throughout the 1950's (technically - not "for real" - the 500 was a round of the world championship)
Wish Indycar could run here! I loved this track!!
2007 Champ Car Mont-Tremblant {1/7} - YouTube
Wasn't the Lotus an F-1 car at Indy? I believe it was the first rear engine car to make the race. But those were the days when you could "run what you brung" instead of the de-nutted bunch of crap wagons that race there now every year.
The great American racer Wilbur Shaw used to order all of his cars from Europe,,,so they would be F1
Jack Brabham drove a Cooper/Climax in 1961. I believe Lotus came in 1963 or 1964.
Brabham's Cooper Climax shocks at Indy 500, 1961
He got one car from Europe - actually Mike Boyle(Umbrella Mike) got one car from Europe - the Maserati - that car had a long career.... Prior to that Shaw actually built his own car (the one he won with in 1937) and used American iron. He retired after a wire wheel failed going for his third straight win in the Maser....Quote:
Originally Posted by bugeyedgomer
That being said - I have no problem with bringing on the best stuff you can find anywhere - it is the American way.....
The 2012 schedule was released yesterday Nd there are more races on foreign soil than ovals
AUTO RACING - INDYCAR: 14 Calendar Dates Confirmed So Far For 2012
A schedule with 14 confirmed dates and 2 more maybe's, Texas and Vegas. One of the confirmed dates is Baltimore and we know that is also up in the air.
Texas and Vegas are huge maybes....
Sure Briton and Eddie are saying come on back....
But the thing is the league took a bath at Vegas ... Place was empty...
And Texas has gone from two races at around 90k to one with 60k..... So you gotta wonder about a sanctioning fee reduction....
Mark my word those two are more about finances than safety
Not to mention Fontana won't be around in 2013....not that it's not an awesome oval in a huge market .... Just aowr has already failed there twice and to quote N/h in this economic climate promotion is likely to be minimal
Do we have an accurate attendance figure for Vegas? Somewhere I read it was 24,000. New Hampshire was considered a failure with 28,000 and a lot less promotion...Quote:
Originally Posted by SarahFan
18k
Anyone understand his language? Sounds like maybe finale in Fort Lauderdale?!!
Tony Kanaan: "Final da Fórmula Indy 2012 poderá ser nas ruas de Fort Lauderdale na Flórida!" - YouTube
Wish I knew what they were saying!
Shhhhhhh........Its a secret.Quote:
Originally Posted by jimispeed
Please keep the finale on an oval....
from one of the sites that uses this forum
and there is no LVMS for 2012,,,the remainder of the schedule remains in a kankedortQuote:
throw in up to 15,000 for Vegas. Despite giving away for free, upwards of 80,000 tickets to the event, if 15,000 showed up, that was a lot. 15,000 in a stadium that holds 132,000. It looked bad for IndyCar for what was supposed to be their 'grand' finale.
Anybody believe that?Quote:
INDYCAR announced today that the IZOD IndyCar Series will not race at Las Vegas Motor Speedway in 2012.
The series was scheduled to close its 2012 season at the speedway on Oct. 14, but INDYCAR and speedway officials said considerable testing with the new car is needed prior to returning to the facility.
"We feel we need to give our technical team ample time to conduct thorough testing at Las Vegas Motor Speedway, once we complete our ongoing investigation into the 15-car accident during the Oct. 16 race at the track," INDYCAR CEO Randy Bernard said.
The 2012 IZOD IndyCar Series season opens March 25 with the Honda Grand Prix of St. Petersburg. The complete schedule will be announced in the coming weeks.
BTW Do guys at Indy know that this is still a link on their Website?
http://mgmresorts.com/indy/images/izod-indycar_02.jpg
http://mgmresorts.com/indy/images/izod-indycar_03.jpg
http://mgmresorts.com/indy/images/izod-indycar_04.jpg
http://mgmresorts.com/indy/images/izod-indycar_05.jpg
http://mgmresorts.com/indy/images/izod-indycar_06.jpg
Glad Vegas is off.
Why ?Quote:
Originally Posted by schumacher180
To quote a member from TF, saying it make sense to do the three day street festivals because of the money they raise and the crowds they attract is like saying "It makes sense for someone to use heroin because it helps make them feel better." In reality, it just highlights the fact that you cannot attract spectators to actual racetracks.
It's not just about ovals: the fact that next year's schedule only contains three ovals and three road courses shows how unattractive the product is. Filling the schedule up with street circuits is like admitting defeat: the product cannot pull people to racetracks so I have to bring the racing to the urban cores so people will come. Most of whom aren't really race fans, just party fans, who will not watch the next race on the TV.
One has to look at the demise of Champ Car to see how slippery this slope is. Champ Car didn't take this route willingly, it's what happened to it. It's what happening to IndyCar as well. It's not like the powers that be like street races, street races are just the last refuge for a dying series to appear alive for a couple of years.
We already have enough road/street courses.Quote:
Originally Posted by SoCalPVguy
Sad words here but I tend to agree. It may be reality unfortunately. Race tracks need priority here, not street courses, where as we see in the long run lose money, look at Baltimore. It's sad, I dont know what the immediate fix is but it certainly isnt more street courses. It scares me to be honest. I love Indycar and I love open wheel racing on ovals, there is NOTHING more exciting to me.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr. Krogshöj
I disagreeQuote:
Originally Posted by schumacher180
How can you disagree, there are WAY TOO MANY street/road courses. Its sad, real sad. :(Quote:
Originally Posted by SoCalPVguy
I hope you recorded all of the IRL seasons because there won't be anymore all oval seasons again. I wish the series would have 50/50 but that's not possible right now. People just aren't going to the ovals other than Indy.Quote:
Originally Posted by DanicaFan
It's not that there are too many road and street races ... It's that we are shirt a dozen ovals
Your model of an all oval open wheel series is a proven financial failure in today's market. Plus of course if you're for it I am automatically against it LOL given your poor judge of driving talent and racing economicsQuote:
Originally Posted by DanicaFan
Well, I don't want them to return to the oval days. I want a schedule like we had in 2010, 9 road/streets and 8 ovals is perfect. But I understand this isn't possible right now, and I like road racing very much as well... Especially the races on a street course, and we have enough of them. I can't say I'm not happy with this schedule, I'm curious if Power is still such dominant on them with the new car. The only thing I want is at least the finale to be on an oval, nothing more and nothing less.
I think the series probably needs to pick at least one or two additional ovals and "make" them work - in other words - make sure the racing is excellent and plan on losing money. The success of the entire series depends on the diversity of the tracks - it is the only thing that truly sets Indycars apart from the rest....
I have been reading some racing "history" books lately. This attendance problem is nothing new - even in the "golden Age(s)" there were more than a few events that did not do well/survive. Places like Ontario & Trenton died - there were more than a few events at places i have never heard of that only lasted a couple of seasons (both ovals and road courses)... I am forced to conclude that racing's normal state of existence is as a niche sport. The boom days of CART in particular were not the norm but just a wonderful confluence of events that allowed the sport of Indycar racing to thrive in spite of itself, not because of anything anybody did "right".... In 20 years, we will be saying the same thing about NASCAR (which has clearly peaked - but due to excellent management is having a fairly shallow glide path down to the reality of a niche sport....). Racing is not alone in this sense. Those of you who grew up in the 1980's probably remember that nearly every weekend was filled with huge and elaborate rock concerts at the local sports arena or stadium - now nobody will pay to see most of them.... Basketball and Hockey are nowhere near as popular as they once were....
As fans of Indycar we need to adjust our expectations.... A 12-15 race series with a mixture of tracks and a high quality internet product and teams largely supported by wealthy individuals with occasional multi-season binges by corporate spenders is what we can/should expect. TV is ancient history and too expensive. Cost controlled spec racing is a desperate attempt to cling to the immediate past (tv, big sponsors, big series...). We need to boldly move to the future and embrace the limitations of our sport and give the participants a more modest model that allows the sport to show the creativity and innovation that made the sport interesting in the first place even though it was never really "big time" then....
Back to the ovals vs. road course argument, Champcar didn't survive a lack of diversity (or lack of Indy really) - but Indy cannot survive if you cannot take the sport "to the people" - which is really the street courses in particular... Yes, we need more than just Indy for ovals and we need carefully selected street courses - but people need to see an Indycar in an environment that is familiar to them to understand just how awesome the sport is... The fact is we need both and the different types of tracks really need each other - all road courses don't give you a sense of the awesome speed potential of the car and all ovals gives you no frame of reference to what is really happening on the track....