Pastrana does it again

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Originally Posted by Rally_Rocks

Simmi, sometimes you talk sense, this time you are talking total crap!

What's the most exciting thing that's happening in our sport this year? Oh, and who's paying for it?

Raikkonen and Red Bull.

What Red Bull do with Pastrana is all part of an integrated global campaign to maximise the return on their rally investment. It's exciting, it's glamorous, it's glitzy, is that really a problem? Of course it isn't, it's the future. And if you don't like the ride, just jump off. Marketing driven motorsport is, unfortunately for some of you guys, the only way forward.

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It's funny because it seems like you still think that NYE stunt had something to do with rallying. They do sponsor Travis in his rallying exploits, but that jump is just about Red Bull. What can we do this year that is fresh? Oh yeah he have this contracted rally driver. Maybe this year we can have him do the jump. Next year something else. It's interchangable and it's a complete sideshow. I believe the money comes from a Red Bull pot of cash entitled 'Wild Events'. Not really anything to do with rallying and certainly nothing to do with their European rallying contracts. Which has been my argument from the beginning. It only benefits a small American offshoot of rallying.

And you talk about marketing like you've seen the future and you're the only one who understands what a sponsorship contract is. You have to get a return for your investment otherwise there's no point. But car manufacturers aren't designing cars and opting to rally them to prove they can jump over rivers. I don't think that's why Subaru got into rallying. You can have all the energy drink sponsors in the world but you still need manufacturers to make cars. I'd prefer to have the fate of the sport decided by them than a bunch of PR people high off their own product.

This is precisely the reason the WRC doesn't go to America. Because you have to jump over something and call yourself something you aren't just to get noticed. I'd prefer to concentrate on the positive vibes coming out of the WRC from 2010 onwards rather than some alternate reality and if that means I'm talking crap I will gladly continue to do so.

Simmi, I'll admit defeat and give up. You clearly don't see the bigger picture.

Ask the guys at FHI if they'd rather see Travis do that jump in a Focus and see how quickly they jump on your head.

My last effort at helping you understand this one. As I said earlier, what Pastrana does today, a whole generation grows up wanting to do tomorrow. I'm not for one second suggesting that the jump us rallying. But it was done in rallying most iconic car by a global superstar who is passionate abiut rallying. We have a missing generation in our sport and if the exploits of Pastrana and Red Bull help that generation connect with rallying then I will always applaud it.

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Originally Posted by Rally_Rocks

Simmi, sometimes you talk sense, this time you are talking total crap!

What's the most exciting thing that's happening in our sport this year? Oh, and who's paying for it?

Raikkonen and Red Bull.

What Red Bull do with Pastrana is all part of an integrated global campaign to maximise the return on their rally investment. It's exciting, it's glamorous, it's glitzy, is that really a problem? Of course it isn't, it's the future. And if you don't like the ride, just jump off. Marketing driven motorsport is, unfortunately for some of you guys, the only way forward.

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The sad thing is, you're probably right regarding Raikkonen/Red Bull/ Citroen. It was given plenty of press in the papers, magazines, hell, it was even mentioned on BBC Radio1. It was the most coverage the WRC got all year, and due to a Global Motorsport Superstar. Last year we had Rossi in RallyGB getting plenty of coverage.
While this seems good, it's also sad, Rallying has a genuine Motorsport legend - 6 Times WRChampion, yet needs other Motorsports Legends to give it any publicity. What does that say about the sport?

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Originally Posted by Simmi

I can't seem to find anything in my post about me saying it harms the sport.

I said it doesn't do anything for the sport outside of America. It does nothing as in it makes no impact what so ever. So not harming and not improving.

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Judging from the falling entries in the already skeletal Rally America Inc Amerikanski Champignonskit, the whole overblown extravaganza thing certainly isn't helping rally in USA.

16-22 entries---65% various Subarus---is not enough to keep organisers solvent and events happening.

The announcement that the Rally America "Series" will be a truncated schedule all stacked into the few months prior to the "X-games' and the "series" after all being held in some artificial arena in New Jersey seems to indicate the intentions of Rally America Inc to remake the "Champignonskit" into a mostly made-for-TV reality show....

Whether that's good or bad for "the sport' remains to be seen.

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Originally Posted by janvanvurpa

Judging from the falling entries in the already skeletal Rally America Inc Amerikanski Champignonskit, the whole overblown extravaganza thing certainly isn't helping rally in USA.

16-22 entries---65% various Subarus---is not enough to keep organisers solvent and events happening.

The announcement that the Rally America "Series" will be a truncated schedule all stacked into the few months prior to the "X-games' and the "series" after all being held in some artificial arena in New Jersey seems to indicate the intentions of Rally America Inc to remake the "Champignonskit" into a mostly made-for-TV reality show....

Whether that's good or bad for "the sport' remains to be seen.

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Does not look too good there, was there not some other serie with more entries usually?

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Originally Posted by janvanvurpa

The announcement that the Rally America "Series" will be a truncated schedule all stacked into the few months prior to the "X-games' and the "series" after all being held in some artificial arena in New Jersey seems to indicate the intentions of Rally America Inc to remake the "Champignonskit" into a mostly made-for-TV reality show....

Whether that's good or bad for "the sport' remains to be seen.

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Yeah I can't say these plans surprise me at all. When there are only a few companies interested it allows it to be dictated by their whims. Basically you are left with the X-Games and a series of super specials with larger jumps or gymkhana type garbage. When it gets stale it will be tossed aside.

I think its not a question of whether it's good or bad for the sport. The money men in the USA seem intent on just making up their own sport. A dim-wit extreme half-cousin of rallying that only two men can afford to compete in. Like I said in previous posts all money will just be pumped back in to making this a reality rather than rallying in the traditional form. Hence there is nothing to be celebrated IMO. It's a shame for American rally fans.

A different vid of the jump. From this angle you really get an idea of how huge it was....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qgvj0rPXK2o

Anyone who thinks these stunts will do anything to promote rallying in the US is smoking crack.

You face exactly the same sort of problem that we do here in Australia. Your motorsport world is dominated by Nascar just as ours is dominated by the V8 Supercars. Face the sad fact that unless there is some major screw up by whoever runs Nascar (a la the open wheeler split you guys had years ago), rallying is never going to be anything but a sideline sport in the US.

I think that many people who see these stunts(People who's never been to a rally) will notice what kind of car he is using, and maybe realise that..It's a rallycar... And maybe, they will go watch some rally.. either in front of their TV or in the forest? .. Anyways, they won't think the same as many rallyfreaks.. It won't harm rallysport at all..

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Originally Posted by Rally_Rocks

Wow, I'm a huge rally fan, but watching that video quite literaly took my breath away! Who cares that it's not proper rallying, it's one of the most dramatic and exciting things I've ever seen anyone do in a car.

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I had the same reaction. Travis' stunt was simply amazing! Aside from the car, this stunt had nothing to do with rallying, but it puts all of those sponsors on a bright map. This also has a positive spillover with rally enthusiasts here in America.

I feel a little upset by some of the reactions by the board members. When Travis was at Rally Mexico in 2007 there was a line out the door just to get his autograph. Throughout the entire weekend his car park was the most crowded. All the other drivers barely received any attention from the crowd and many of those fans were not Mexicans. No one really cared about his deplorable time at the rally, hell I even had a laugh about it, but that doesn't matter when you can have a cult following wherever you travel.

Travis is a positive for the sport of rallying here in America. Eyebrows are being raised and young people are getting more curious about the sport. I think one reason that rallying is dying off is because many people do not want to change their opinions and just sit around without any action. If rallying ever becomes popular in America it won't be the same type of rallying as the dog and pony show ran by the FIA.

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Originally Posted by Tomi

No hard feelings, but i think you slightly exaggerate pastranas meaning what comes to rally, also maybe your world is a bit too small.

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Get off your high horse.

*sigh*

The crumdrugeons are spouting the doom and gloom and the fan bois have a rager over how cool it is....

It was a stunt. Travis Pastrana is a Red Bull Athlete, his Subaru contract requires anything officially in a car to be in a Subaru.

It was fun, it was exciting.

Was it rallying? NOPE
Will it save rallying? NOPE
Will it hurt rallying? NOPE

Just enjoy it for the entertainment that it was...

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Originally Posted by L5->R5/CR

*sigh*

The crumdrugeons are spouting the doom and gloom and the fan bois have a rager over how cool it is....

It was a stunt. Travis Pastrana is a Red Bull Athlete, his Subaru contract requires anything officially in a car to be in a Subaru.

It was fun, it was exciting.

Was it rallying? NOPE
Will it save rallying? NOPE
Will it hurt rallying? NOPE

Just enjoy it for the entertainment that it was...

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Nobody is spouting or even whispering doom and gloom.
Very naughty of you to slander people that way.

Those that aren't peeing their panties are suggesting that the net result for anybody other than Redbull and Travvie is a 2 seconds of fun and a big NEUTRAL for the sport..


Now if somebody wanted to begrude something they might suggest that having this little stunt on the WRC forum, somehow implying even the most tenuous connection , even the remotest hint that Travvie is worthy of comparison, shows how this harmless --extremely over done, carefully calculated stunt-----actually does detract from what's supposed to be the pinnacle of Rally in this world..

In other words this doesn't belong here but rather maybe in USA section or really in Off Topic.

Wow that was quite a jump.

I understand that some of us cant really stand this kind of activity, but really this is very good. At the end of the day, everyone wins. Red Bull wins as we can see, in this thread we have already seen more than 5 references to the brand. Pastrana wins, Im sure he enjoyed the show and the jump and fans win.

But this kind of adversetising usually doesnt last for too long, If they continue to do this regularly then people will lose interest.

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Originally Posted by gloomyDAY

Get off your high horse.

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Dont you think that in the most part of the real world where rally is a sport there is more than just 16-22 entries, if the rally is not so well in 1 single country, it can do fine in many.

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Originally Posted by N.O.T

great publicity....bring him to wrc now...

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More publicity via YouTube and Twitter than anything WRC itsself has managed in years. for that I applaud the PR stunt and it shows WRC needs to do something more than it is.

However he's a crap rally driver so should stick to helping Subaru with his tricksy stuff.

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Originally Posted by N.O.T

great publicity....bring him to wrc now...

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Pastrana is absolutely not ready for WRC rally. :D

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Originally Posted by Rally_Rocks

Brother John, I will happily admit I'm a modern day rally fan who refuses to live in the past. You show your but with things such as those jump rally will not survive in the futurewhen you, "what real rally meant". I'm sorry, but I'm only interested in living in the present and doing all I can to raise the profile of our sport to the level I think it deserves. We live in a commercially driven, celebrity obsessed world. Embrace it and exploit it, then maybe our sport stands a slim chance of not disappearing into niche obscurity only to be enjoyed by anorak wearing whingers like yourself.

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I live also in the present, yes we live in a commercial world but with things such as those jump, rally will not survive in the future!
My true collors is that i like the rally sport and that has nothing to do with the past but with 30 years experience as a rally fan.

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Originally Posted by Tomi

Dont you think that in the most part of the real world where rally is a sport there is more than just 16-22 entries, if the rally is not so well in 1 single country, it can do fine in many.

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Yes, I live in the real world, and you should know that big things start out small. I'm not sure why you're being so condescending. Rallying is still in its infancy in America, if compared to rallying in Europe, and should not be taken lightly. I feel as if a door is beginning to open up for rallying in America. Disillusioned Indy fans and embittered NASCAR tailgaters are probably looking at something else to whet their automotive palate.

Be patient...

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Originally Posted by gloomyDAY

Yes, I live in the real world, and you should know that big things start out small. I'm not sure why you're being so condescending. Rallying is still in its infancy in America, if compared to rallying in Europe, and should not be taken lightly. I feel as if a door is beginning to open up for rallying in America. Disillusioned Indy fans and embittered NASCAR tailgaters are probably looking at something else to whet their automotive palate.

Be patient...

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Thanks!
I've only been daily involved in rally since 1984 (today, Sunday, a guy who has just built a new car and will be debuting in our season opener "Doo-Wops Rally" in Feb, is coming over to pick up arts for his suspension I made for his rwd XR4Ti rallycar, and I'll machine the differential companion flage of an Xratty to mate with his BMW diff, then machinging some alloy bushings for another noob's 240 Volvo) and was already hearing" Wait! we're just starting out, there's only been rally in America since the_______60s"

So we've been in "our" infancy since the 1960s.

And I just had my 39th birthday for the 18th time.

IF we are still in our infancy, it might be because while 99.5% of the field are in the crib, others have been shouting that "THIS TRICK" or "THIS 'media personanality'..." or "a WRC event" or some spaz-tacular external primarily PROMOTION-Centered SPECTACLE is going to be the thing to get us out of "our" infancy.

It MIGHT be we are in our infancy because some people believe if we cater to basically infantile whims for flashy glitz, the "Any promotion is good publicity" crowd, that more participation will magicvally follow...


Cause the reason we're in our infancy, and why guys such as Travvie and Kenny's are only "heroes" when there is weak competition is because there is no depth to the competition.

And there'll only eventually develop skills when there's larger numbers of PARTICIPANTS. When there's 40-50 in your particular class so you're forced to try harder.


And as those with more experience of more brains have pointed out, when the novelty of this sorta stunt wears off---like who even gives a sheeet about X-tream boys doing backflips on moto-cross bikes? Common as dog -poop on the lawn-----the "fans' will watch some other "spaz-tacular spectacle"....

But it's been what 25 years and I have a Road and Track magazine from 1976 also saying "What the US series needs is more cars, more money, more events", hasn't happened yet....

He Gloomy, tell us specifically why you haven't or aren't building a car to enter in rallies? I mean you're in LA: Car Mecca, Media Mecca.

Why are you not----as far as we know since you perpetuate the silly internet habit of posting anonymously---participating?
(Not an attack just wondering how and why people are content to just be fans)

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Originally Posted by janvanvurpa

And there'll only eventually develop skills when there's larger numbers of PARTICIPANTS. When there's 40-50 in your particular class so you're forced to try harder.

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This is for sure true, every country that produce international level rally drivers, has also healty national series with competition, to become a rallydriver is not just a desition, it takes years and years of practise and tough competition, its not always so easy it might look, but it can be done, if you look for instance at norway or estonia 15 years back their rallying was not much to talk about, but today they are both up there.

I initially thought wow he was quite the hero to attempt this jump. Then I seen some other youtube videos of him practicing on dirt moving the ramp back a little further each time. He even destroyed one car practicing on dirt. Then towards the end he was testing over dirt on a full scale jump with the scaffolded ramp to land on.
On the night all travis had to do was match his terminal ramp speed and throtle position and the jump was a sucess. There is now way I would ever attempt anything like this but its kinda lost some of its shine for me since all he was doing was repeating something he had already done probably a couple of times. And at that Im sure they have serious computers to test all of the above too.
My vision of true dare devil is some one who tries for a record and hopes that it will turn out ok, kinda like Evil Knievel I guess, when he jumped the buses in wembley stadium he knew he wasnt gonna make it but still went for it :) I dont think Travis has the same frame of mind.

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Originally Posted by Tomi

This is for sure true, every country that produce international level rally drivers, has also healty national series with competition, to become a rallydriver is not just a desition, it takes years and years of practise and tough competition, its not always so easy it might look, but it can be done, if you look for instance at norway or estonia 15 years back their rallying was not much to talk about, but today they are both up there.

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For us it was a bit different, coming from USSR, no money etc. Rallying has been popular here for ages and it just took some time for people to get wealthy. And we have had very good drivers before as well, but they did not had a chance to go abroad and when they did, the machinery was too outdated.

But otherwise You are right, we have a quite good series :)

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Originally Posted by cali

For us it was a bit different, coming from USSR, no money etc. Rallying has been popular here for ages and it just took some time for people to get wealthy. And we have had very good drivers before as well, but they did not had a chance to go abroad and when they did, the machinery was too outdated.

But otherwise You are right, we have a quite good series :)

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Yes thats true, but the point is it takes time to build a good national series, it does not happen by snapping fingers and its there.
Estonian series is good and important to our youngsters too, almost everyones first international rally is in Estonia and first international WRC is usually in Sweden.

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Originally Posted by Brother John

Pastrana is absolutely not ready for WRC rally. :D

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of course he is he jumped 299 meters and has a big number of clicks on youtube and thats what WRC needs... more clicks !!!

I mean Kimi is the most exciting thing in the WRC this year and of course of all times so 1 million clicks is guaranteed, if block comes we have at least 300.000 clicks more and if pastrana comes the number of clicks could be amazing....can you imagine if the italian clown sponsor kid comes too ?? my god...the number of clicks will bring tears to my eyes....

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Originally Posted by N.O.T

of course he is he jumped 299 meters and has a big number of clicks on youtube and thats what WRC needs... more clicks !!!

I mean Kimi is the most exciting thing in the WRC this year and of course of all times so 1 million clicks is guaranteed, if block comes we have at least 300.000 clicks more and if pastrana comes the number of clicks could be amazing....can you imagine if the italian clown sponsor kid comes too ?? my god...the number of clicks will bring tears to my eyes....

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very good, lol

I'm more impressed what Pastrana did with a three wheeler. :D
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3kh7d...eature=related

Travis and Red Bull Subaru were seen for more people with this jump than Sebastien Loeb and Citroen with his WRC title.

The reason is obvious, this jump was broadcasted all around the world in all TV stations. Loeb's title was broadcasted only in a few tv stations (the ones who had contract wirh ISC)... This was really good to rallying, because Travis was in a rallycar, and he could had been in any kind of car to do this.

What upsets me is this ecocentric sprit form rally people. Guys, WRC is not the center of world! Wake up guys!!

If was Loeb doing this, maybe a lot of people would know who is Sebastien Loeb, but as was Pastrana, people lnows that an crazy american made tha spectacular jump. As the portuguese tv station said "Travis Pastrana, the american rally champion, break a wold record....."

Click Click Click !!!!

so the solution is to turn Loeb into a sponsor boy clown like all those american and italian jokes.....yes i agree.

More Clicks now.....

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Originally Posted by JAM

Travis and Red Bull Subaru were seen for more people with this jump than Sebastien Loeb and Citroen with his WRC title.

The reason is obvious, this jump was broadcasted all around the world in all TV stations. Loeb's title was broadcasted only in a few tv stations (the ones who had contract wirh ISC)... This was really good to rallying, because Travis was in a rallycar, and he could had been in any kind of car to do this.

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Are you sure? Do you have figures? This hasn't been broadcasted overhere as far as I can remember. And the argument is not really about TV figures (or "clicks" as quoted from N.O.T.). It's the general misconception of certain people about the sport we know as rallying.

You're reasoning why this is "good for rallying" is so lame JAM. "Because he was in a rallycar, but it could have been any kind of car" ...right, so what's the difference if it shouldn't necessarily be related to rallying in the first place?

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Originally Posted by JAM

What upsets me is this ecocentric sprit form rally people. Guys, WRC is not the center of world! Wake up guys!!

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I don't think you really followed the thread good enough.

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Originally Posted by JAM

If was Loeb doing this, maybe a lot of people would know who is Sebastien Loeb, but as was Pastrana, people lnows that an crazy american made tha spectacular jump. As the portuguese tv station said "Travis Pastrana, the american rally champion, break a wold record....."

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There's not much else you can expect from Travis, we're used to it, but if Loeb was doing this, it would simply get on my nerves (luckily in this case, Loeb is not a showman in heart). Even though it looks spectacular to see an Impreza flying, this stunt was very calculated as some said before, there's no way he wasn't going to make it.

And wasn't Travis Pastrana a "World Champion"? :p

I don't expect nothing from Pastrana, for me the question is not the driver, but the promotion of WRC.

Do you want figures? Do you think that the majority of TV news around the world didn't notice that? In Portugal we have 3 main TV channels, usually one of them broadcast lite reports form WRC events, but this time two of them broadcasted a report about this jump.

And you? Do you have figures to prove that i'm wrong?!? :D

One thing is sure. All USA saw it, and more than half of Europe also. Usually WRC is seen by ahlef of europeans and only a few americans. Globaly, this jump had for sure more viewers that WRC events. A friend of mine who work in Zuhai told me that saw it in China TV!!!

I want real rallying, but we need this kind of entertainment to promote the real rallying near the ones that don't usually see rallies. If WRC wants to grow, ISC needs much more promotion than we had at the moment. This is the central point.

But ok, when ISC replaced Eurosport by MotorsTV, we understand that they don't want more viewers...

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Originally Posted by JAM

I don't expect nothing from Pastrana, for me the question is not the driver, but the promotion of WRC.

Do you want figures? Do you think that the majority of TV news around the world didn't notice that? In Portugal we have 3 main TV channels, usually one of them broadcast lite reports form WRC events, but this time two of them broadcasted a report about this jump.

And you? Do you have figures to prove that i'm wrong?!? :D

One thing is sure. All USA saw it, and more than half of Europe also. Usually WRC is seen by ahlef of europeans and only a few americans. Globaly, this jump had for sure more viewers that WRC events. A friend of mine who work in Zuhai told me that saw it in China TV!!!

I want real rallying, but we need this kind of entertainment to promote the real rallying near the ones that don't usually see rallies. If WRC wants to grow, ISC needs much more promotion than we had at the moment. This is the central point.

But ok, when ISC replaced Eurosport by MotorsTV, we understand that they don't want more viewers...

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I hear you on the fact it needs better promotion. But what are you actually suggesting here? I also wouldn't kid yourself that the whole of America and at least half of Europe has seen this. Should ISC try and do a jump? With what money? And would that not just be false advertising?

I say the best thing they can do is work with event organisers to try and take respective events into centrally populated areas as much as possible. Whether this is service parks, ceremonial starts and even better stages or demonstration runs. Now this isn't easy to do and costs money, time and planning. But if you're town grinds to a standstill one afternoon you might just hear about it or get caught up in it. And it will make the news. That's all I can suggest because this jump has clouded people's brains from what I can tell.

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Originally Posted by Simmi

I hear you on the fact it needs better promotion. But what are you actually suggesting here? I also wouldn't kid yourself that the whole of America and at least half of Europe has seen this. Should ISC try and do a jump? With what money? And would that not just be false advertising?

I say the best thing they can do is work with event organisers to try and take respective events into centrally populated areas as much as possible. Whether this is service parks, ceremonial starts and even better stages or demonstration runs. Now this isn't easy to do and costs money, time and planning. But if you're town grinds to a standstill one afternoon you might just hear about it or get caught up in it. And it will make the news. That's all I can suggest because this jump has clouded people's brains from what I can tell.

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I belive it differs much how rally is promoted and showed in different countries, here we have no reason to complaine, there is quite much in tv, national championship, groupF, and offcourse WRC, for instance from our own WRC event they start showing from the tests with different interviews 1 month before the actual rally already, and from the rally several times a day about maybe 2 hours/day, and during the rally offourse quality rally radio.

exactly...exposure differs from country to country and i doubt that bringing clowns in the WRC will make 3rd world countries increase the exposure of the sport. For example here in greece even in the gold era of mid 80s and early 00s the exposure was the same as it is now....ok we had some 30min shows in every rally during these periods but they were poorly made.

So i doubt that some click youtube guys can bring the real interest of people if the product itself its not exposed properly.

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Originally Posted by Simmi

I hear you on the fact it needs better promotion. But what are you actually suggesting here? I also wouldn't kid yourself that the whole of America and at least half of Europe has seen this. Should ISC try and do a jump? With what money? And would that not just be false advertising?

I say the best thing they can do is work with event organisers to try and take respective events into centrally populated areas as much as possible. Whether this is service parks, ceremonial starts and even better stages or demonstration runs. Now this isn't easy to do and costs money, time and planning. But if you're town grinds to a standstill one afternoon you might just hear about it or get caught up in it. And it will make the news. That's all I can suggest because this jump has clouded people's brains from what I can tell.

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I'm sugesting that out of the events, all paralel promotion is welcome. To see Loeb doing donuts on the street os Buenos Aires could be seen as false advertising, but is advertising, is a rallycar near the people of a big city, is promotion of a championship, it atracts the attention of ordinary people who don't even love rally.

The promotion is not for the ones that follow sport, is for the ones that don't follow the sport, and on that basis all the promotion is welcome. A world record jump, is one thing between thousands that could be done out of the events. It's positive.

Everyting costs money, but without visibility, is impossible to chatch sponsors that could pay that expenses. They have to invest at the beggining , but invest in a sustainble project. The last years shown that WRC is not a sustainble project. One of the main suports of WRC was Eurosport reports, but that is ended. I don't see a bright future in terms of sustainability, unless a lot of manufacturers start to appear and contribute to the whole investment needed...

'Infancy, when compared to rallying in Europe.'

'Rallying in America will be different than the FIA dog and pony show.'

America is not Europe. Americans like a different kind of show, so I'm not sure why some people are upset. Maybe the reason rallying has failed to grasp any attention is because no one markets the sport well enough. Look at how NASCAR took advantage of the Indy/CART split and snagged all of those fans.

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Originally Posted by janvanvurpa

Why are you not----as far as we know since you perpetuate the silly internet habit of posting anonymously---participating?
(Not an attack just wondering how and why people are content to just be fans)

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I have motocross bike and a 4x4 truck that I tinker with at my relative's ranch. Tied down with school as well. I really don't need anymore debt when tuition prices just went up another 15%.

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Originally Posted by JAM

I A world record jump, is one thing between thousands that could be done out of the events. It's positive.

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Well 270 feet/82m is nice but World record?
What kind of "World" record?

What's this:
Johnny Greaves jumping 301 ft just a few days earlier:

http://race-dezert.com/home/johnny-g...feet-4375.html

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gK3fs1gZ3IU

Maybe Travvie's World record is of the same sort of "Promotion" as his being 2007 World Champignon was........

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Originally Posted by janvanvurpa

Well 270 feet/82m is nice but World record?
What kind of "World" record?

What's this:
Johnny Greaves jumping 301 ft just a few days earlier:

http://race-dezert.com/home/johnny-g...feet-4375.html

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gK3fs1gZ3IU

Maybe Travvie's World record is of the same sort of "Promotion" as his being 2007 World Champignon was........

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It was a world record Rally Car jump. They went out of their way to mention it over and over during the broadcast.

Maybe if it was a world record for an Club Rally car using your shocks you would be less negative.

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Originally Posted by anthonyvop

It was a world record Rally Car jump. They went out of their way to mention it over and over during the broadcast.

Maybe if it was a world record for an Club Rally car using your shocks you would be less negative.

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I am not negative.

Car --truck whatever, the other guy jumped is 4 wheel vehicle tarted up to look like a pick up well more than 10% longer than Travvie in his 4 wheel vehicle, why be so picky if its a car or a supposed truck, it was longer and that's what counts.

You know nothing of rally, you're not here to discuss anything but rather to try and be a moster-troll, that is transparent, so maybe you should just go write you insane blather in Off Topic about how everybody in the world is a Communist-Nazi or a Nazi-Communist. Everybody except your indicted terrorist friends.

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Originally Posted by janvanvurpa

Well 270 feet/82m is nice but World record?
What kind of "World" record?

What's this:
Johnny Greaves jumping 301 ft just a few days earlier:

http://race-dezert.com/home/johnny-g...feet-4375.html

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gK3fs1gZ3IU

Maybe Travvie's World record is of the same sort of "Promotion" as his being 2007 World Champignon was........

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John,

I know how badly the tendency to grab on to a prime example, however honest of a mistake (or how poorly informed some peon in charge of a website was), can be, especially when it perfectly makes a point but...

Seriously, it was on his website, probably run by some college intern who doesn't know up from down. You've have probably reposted the mis information more times than it was every actually viewed. It may be time to let that bloody, beaten, tired old horse rest.

Not trying to start an argument with you, just think about it...

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Originally Posted by L5->R5/CR

John,

I know how badly the tendency to grab on to a prime example, however honest of a mistake (or how poorly informed some peon in charge of a website was), can be, especially when it perfectly makes a point but...

Seriously, it was on his website, probably run by some college intern who doesn't know up from down. You've have probably reposted the mis information more times than it was every actually viewed. It may be time to let that bloody, beaten, tired old horse rest.

Not trying to start an argument with you, just think about it...

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It shows an attitude, a sloppiness about the context and level their accomplishments mean which we just got another example of in Kenny's press statement about about "The most significant deal in WRC History" :
"Rally just hasn't been as popular in the States because it's been deemed more a European-type sport," Block says. "We haven't had many U.S. drivers that have gotten to that level. There have been a few people that have done one-off events. No one has done multiple events. It's a huge honor to go try to do that.

"There's a lot of pride, and to do it in an American brand, I'm really stoked to have this opportunity."

He forgets john Buffum who is still a better driver, and who did respectable top 5-6 results in a number of events.

No awareness of anything that came before.....typical.