Maybe I am wrong, but here in UK they used tp seem to share commentators, Carlton Kirby, Martin Haven etc.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rally Power
Looks like I was wrong.
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Maybe I am wrong, but here in UK they used tp seem to share commentators, Carlton Kirby, Martin Haven etc.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rally Power
Looks like I was wrong.
What is the message to Motors TV for them to improve the WRC coverage, seen both from a Petrolhead and to get more people interessted in Rally ?
What would be the best way ahead if you could decide ?
It isn't down to Motors TV. All they will do is simply air the same tired ISC content that Eurosport did. Only now it will be a bit longer. So really the question should be directed at ISC.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sulland
All Motors can do is give it a good timeslot and dont mess around with their scheduling. They should have no problem doing this as they have nothing else of worth on their books. And no live coverage.
And why the move to MotorsTV?
We don't have chance to watch Motors TV in Turkey! This is a big shame if you think that there is one round in Istanbul this year!
I am very much dissapointed...
Here in Finland WRC is still on MTV3 the next 5 years, they made a new contract with ISC, else they show national championship and F-Cup too, enough i think.
Am in the process of getting Sky at the moment (though mainly for IRC coverage) so I won't notice any difference.
Think there should be more helicopter coverage though, I always find that really amazing to watch :)
Not related to WRC moving but it was interesting to see Autosport's David Evans putting the boot into Eurosport for their poor IRC coverage. Not their live stuff but rather the reviews - specifically the one from Rally Scotland.
I've said for a while they have a lot of work to do. It's just not up to scratch in some areas. Still can't wait for Monte mind you!
Jamie I'd recommend you fork out the bit extra for Sky+. Literally is the best thing since sliced bread.
ISC already problems with the WRC rally organizers! :p :
Source only in German!
http://www.rallye-magazin.de/top/top...isc/index.html
I have noticed that David Evans does seem to toe the corporate ISC line far more than Jerry Williams........Quote:
Originally Posted by Simmi
Possibly he does but I think genuinely they deserved criticism for some of their programming.Quote:
Originally Posted by MJW
Yes, quite true, in fact Jerry sticks the boot in frequently, wherea David tends to defend the WRC to the hilt. I want objective journalism, which is why his comments on the IRC RallyScotland highlights package, while justified were almost gleeful.Quote:
Originally Posted by MJW
A little statistic about rally on tv worldwide, WRC did have this year 633 million cumulative spectators, and was showed on TV, 5678 hours.
For comparison the irc figures are, cumulative spectators 16 millions, tv hours 212.
I wonder how they do calculate values like that...
That's what you quote when people start saying manufacturers should go to the IRC. I have no idea what a cumulative spectator is. But that's a massive gulf between the two series.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tomi
Hahah. :D Talk about IRC providing good visibility for the sponsors and manufacturers...Quote:
Originally Posted by Tomi
Yeah, no wonder that you wonder when WRC looks better. It's okay to like some serie, but hey, facts are always facts and there's no point trying to questionize them.Quote:
Originally Posted by HaCo
Lol yes, but it also shows that WRC is also a marginal sport in motorsport, but still on a completely different level on the visibility as well, compairing to the minor rally series.Quote:
Originally Posted by Juha_Koo
That's on average 111.000 per hour for the WRC and 75.000 for the IRC, so not a very big gap. Especially considering the IRC is a cheaper series to run.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tomi
Plus, the IRC figures are 99% key markets, namely the European countries. While the WRC figures on the other hand are for a large part made up from third world numbers that can only be guessed, from markets that are not very interesting to sponsors. I'd say value for money is around the same.
Edit: both numbers are very *** though. F1 gets 100.000.000 for one grandprix, so that's tens of millions per hour on average.
its true you can read statistics in many ways, what do you mean by numbers that can only be guessed? Not so sure eurosport in huge economic problems see 75000 as a very good figure.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lousada
Cumulative spectator means they add every number from every seperate show together. So let's say there were 40 one hour shows on DAVE and you watched them all. That means you are counted 40 times in this cumulative number. 633 million spectators does not mean 633 million individuals, but 633 million times someone somewhere was watching a WRC show.Quote:
Originally Posted by Simmi
There are only 20 countries or so that accurately measure tv-ratings nationwide. In the rest of the world they use estimates with a variety of different methods. These numbers can easily be twisted or inflated to your liking. Bernie Ecclestone is a master with this, just look how many Chinese people supposedly watch every Grand Prix.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tomi
I agree that 75000 people Europe-wide looks terrible. But on the other hand rally is mostly scheduled in off-hours - late at night or in the morning. Also remember that Eurosport 2 has a much smaller reach. Plus I think there are huge differences between rallies, the Monte was viewed by more persons than the Safari.
Of course, there is also a reason why they are shopping their WTCC and IRC tv-rights around in every country; to get some return! I think that is part of their strategy with owning their own racing series.
I don't know about this, I think car markets are pretty even between Asia, Europe and North America so I do believe areas outside of Europe are as interesting if not even more than Europe for sponsors.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lousada
I'm pretty sure that manufacturers appreciate media visibility in China, India and all countries that have developed a lot recently and cars have become a real possibility for the middle class.Quote:
Originally Posted by DonJippo
Rally start and finish ceremonies seem to be rather big events in China... Lots of good marketing value to be gained there. Atleast that's the impression I've got from Välimäki's adventures there.
Depends on what sponsors. M-sport for example is sponsored by Ford Europe. The entity Ford Europe does not care about sales in North America because that revenue goes to Ford US. Citroen doesn't even sell cars in North America. So these sponsors will retract the North American numbers from these statistics.Quote:
Originally Posted by DonJippo
In my own baseless opinion I think that currently all the sponsors in the WRC are focussed on Europe. Australasia used to be important too and probably will be again when the Japanese manufacturers return.
Thats not true, there will soon be events in places like South Africa and India, the initiative for theese comes from the manufacturers.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lousada
Most global corporations have regional divisions that can spend their own marketing euros. It's very seldom that a multinational uses a truely global sports strategy, and even more seldom that they use it on something so marginal as WRC.Quote:
Originally Posted by Juha_Koo
Yes, probably. However, China was in the IRC for two years and nobody in Europe cared. Where I am living rallies are locally big events too. On a national level however it still means nothing. Sponsors that can afford the WRC do not look at the live specators, but at the national impact. Which is still small in China.Quote:
Rally start and finish ceremonies seem to be rather big events in China... Lots of good marketing value to be gained there. Atleast that's the impression I've got from Välimäki's adventures there.
What manufacturers and what is soon? Again, the IRC attempted this and nobody showed even the slightest interest.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tomi
in 2 years, in general most initiatives comes from the manufacturers.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lousada
In two years, that means there will be candidate events next year?? I had not read about that yet.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tomi
Again I ask which manufacturers? Was it Ford and/or Citroen? Because I specifically said: sponsors that are CURRENTLY in the WRC. New manufacturers always try to impose their strategies on the wrc before they join.
Current manufacturers, offcourse.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lousada
Forgetting sponsors for a minute. To say that Ford ultimately doesn't care about the American market is not true IMO. Despite it being bankrolled by Ford Europe, it is all part of one huge automotive company. So if the American arm of Ford is suffering then the European side will surely suffer too. It is naive to say Ford wouldn't want the WRC to go to America. It is all of a mutual benefit for FMC.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lousada
Rallying visibility and popularity (WRC, IRC or else) should be counted by the people/followers from the stages and service parks not from the TV screen. me thinks
This has me worried for a number of reasons. A good few years ago Motors tv had many top world race series shown with full live coverage whether it was from the US or Europe. Then if the new years budget wasnt there or sponsorship issues they would chop it for the following year with pretty much no explanation, so you went from 100% coverage to practically zero.
Back in the day the WRC used to land on our screens one week after the rally in a half hour programme which seemed to be linked to the BBC but it was well produced none the less.
Then some expert correct me if I am wrong but wasnt it Eurosport who started doing nightly coverage during the Monte carlo rally back in 1998, it was only 15min at the start but this was a mega change at the time. Rally results and footage on the same day and without having to use teletext! Internet wasnt so big at the time for many people. Even now with Dave producing an ok 1 hour programme on Sunday evening, Eurosport is what I still watch on Friday/Saturday to get the most up to date footage.
I am not going to complain about the in-cars looking at back of drivers seats or rubbish commentators as I remember vividly what it was like back in the early to mid nineties. Actually when I think about it Motoring News or Autosport type magazines in the middle of the week following the rally was usually how we found out about what happ and got to see the pictures. I think Eurosport have done us excellent service regarding the WRC over the years. They showed live stages also in Corisca maybe 1999 was it? What other Sky or pan European channell has done this since please?
I hate seeing these channels like Motors tv, or in the past didnt Channel 4 promise the world with the WRC only for them to dump it again within a year or two. I would much prefer to see solid continuity rather than some head of programming tell us in December about how great its going to be, then for same person to close the door on the WRC two years later. Mark my words, I promise you this will happen. I reckon the same will happen to Dave at some point, it is not a sporty channell over all and the coverage is out of turn in that respect.
Snooker or not I for one am going to be sad to see Eurosport loose the coverage after putting in the effort to keep us informed over the years.
Some valid points but I don't really see the difference whether it stays at Eurosport or not. I mean lets get this straight Eurosport does not produce the WRC content in any way. I also dont believe the live stuff in 1999 was Eurosport content either. So this is simply finding a new home for the stock ISC coverage. What is regretable is that less people seem able to access Motors TV.Quote:
Originally Posted by WRCS14
Let's not mince words - the WRC was BURIED on Eurosport in recent years. They supported the series in as much as they aired it. Nothing more. Now they have another commericial imperative with the IRC - further compromising their commitment to the WRC. It doesn't take a brain surgeon to realise that relationship cannot continue.
So I for one am happy that we can at least get a fixed timeslot and (European) events should be aired at a decent hour. Plus the extended coverage and probably additional programming and repeats.
Point is continuity. Doesnt matter the fact they dont produce the WRC coverage, they have always given it a slot for us to view. I dont care if this slot is at 11:30pm at night because I remember the way it used to be before Eurosport changed things.
What are you going to do when Motors chop it from their line up due to costs in 2012 etc and believe me this will happen and by that time it will quite possibly be gone from Dave too. Back to the internet watching the spread sheet times change and waiting for the little news updates on WRC.com At that point Eurosport may still be progressing their IRC campaign and they may choose not to bother taking up the slack, I think either way it will be our loss if Eurosport is forced to drop their coverage.
But the point is Eurosport don't care about the WRC. They have the IRC now and I'd say they value the WRC about as much as their early morning Teleshopping services. Eurosport did change things and have done a lot. But now they've changed things again - for the worse as far as the WRC is concerned.Quote:
Originally Posted by WRCS14
I agree Motors isn't a stable platform but it is at least a platform. The coverage solution is all short-term fixes but the WRC is at such a low ebb anything is a result. In 2-4 years that hopefully won't be the case and it will be a stronger product.
I do understand what you are saying. But if you're wife leaves you for another man you don't continue to live with her for the sake of continuity. The WRC finds itself in this same position. I personally believe the IRC will fail in a few years and the WRC will find its way back to Eurosport.
Here what we get from rally sweden, quite ok?
11.2.2010
21:30 - 22:00 MAX MM-kauden ennakko
22:00 - 22:15 MAX Torstain tapahtumat ja tunnelmat
12.2.2010
07:30 - 08:00 MAX MM-kauden ennakko (2.es)
08:00 - 08:15 MAX Torstain tapahtumat ja tunnelmat (2. es.)
19:30 - 20:00 MAX Tilannekatsaus
22:30 - 23:00 MAX Perjantain ajot ja tunnelmat
22:30 - 22:40 MTV3 RalliExtra
00:35 - 01:05 MTV3 Perjantain tapahtumat ja tunnelmat
13.2.2010
07:30 - 08:00 MAX Perjantain ajot ja tunnelmat (2. es)
19:20 - 19:30 MTV3 RalliExtra
19:30 - 20:00 MAX Tilannekatsaus
23:00 - 23:30 MAX Lauantain ajot ja tunnelmat
00:35 - 01:05 MTV3 Lauantain tapahtumat ja tunnelmat
14.2.2010
07:30 - 08:00 MAX Lauantain ajot ja tunnelmat (2. es)
14:00 - 15:00 MAX Ruotsin rallin päätös-ek LIVE
19:20 - 19:30 MTV3 RalliExtra
19:30 - 20:00 MAX Sunnuntain ajot ja tunnelmat
22:30 - 23:00 MAX Kisan päätöspäivä ja yhteenveto
00:25 - 00:55 MTV3 Kisan päätöspäivä ja kohokohdat
15.2.2010
17:15 - 18:15MAX Koko kisan kooste
Result! :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Larry_Japan
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a little of topic maybe, but what telecompany produced Rally GB in 2003.. I remember that as a very well production with live stages at the final day. Not to forget the awsome fight between Loeb and Solberg, and the wild cheering after the finnishline :)