Quote:
Originally Posted by jens
Sorry I misunderstood your comments. You are right in what you said.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jens
Sorry I misunderstood your comments. You are right in what you said.
Its funny how Chris has seemed to be able to drive there Subaru in a tame yet consistant manner and its payed off on the results table.
Petter seems to looking for the raw speed option and to me it seems as though hes being that little bit too rough on the car and it just cant hack it, hence the breakages.
To me that show that Petter is really trying, but perhaps trying too hard. The new car, if all goes well, should allow him to take the pressure off himself, relax a bit and settle back into to his 2003 form... I hope!
The current car is not good enough to keep pace of the C4 and Focus as it stands. Regardless who is driving it (loeb for example). Subaru has obviously had to work hard at keeping the car in the same league as the C4 and Focus. While the C4 and Focus can spend time and resources tweaking the car and making changes that will help when the times get tough.
With the unfortunate position of having a car that is always a little slower or more unreliable you get a unique opportunity to fix your mistakes with insight. You learn more from your mistakes than your success.
Time will tell if the car is really a new generation leap or more of the same. I think the car will come out swinging. And if petta can get a good feel for the car it will be a real contender. But how much money will the team put into it with its lifespan as short as it is with the new rules?
As for the drivers of subaru I think that Chris will fall well below Petter if the car is a winner. Experience and Petter's determination will really make Chris look slow. (not that I like Petta, I like Chris more.)
Focus short, and Evo and Impreza long?Quote:
Originally Posted by Kharts
First gen Focus was 102.9" or 2613,6mm
New ones are 2640mm
First Gen GC8 Impreza was 2520mm wheelbase
Second Impreza GDB was 2525mm
Next was 2540mm
Early Evo I thru 6 were 2500mm wheelbase
Evo 7 onwards 2625mm
Xsara WRC is 2550mm
C4 is 2608mm
I think you need to look up a bit before calling LONG cars short and short cvars long, so sorry!
Notice all the cars he said were SWB are hatches and the ones he said were LWB are all saloon/coupe cars?Quote:
Originally Posted by janvanvurpa
It's funny how often this happens :D
Yep.. I think its the shorter overhangs that decieve?. If I didnt know, Id have said the same too.Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel
Edit- Are the overhangs shorter on the new Impreza?
But nearly everything he said was wrong.Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel
Focus is long, and it looks like a hatch to me
Early Evo and GC8 Subie were short and they sorta seem like saloons you know with a boot and all?
I really don't follow your point.
Or his.
What I meant was people see a saloon and think it's big and that it must have a long wheelbase. Then they see a hatchback and think it must be small and therefore have a small wheelbase :) These assumptions are not necessarily correct which was my point ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by janvanvurpa
Zico there you're getting closer to what I see differing more: overhang front and rear.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zico
Ford pointed out how effective the old wonderful Lancia Delta intergrale was (97.4" wheelbase, like a GolfII) especially how nearly untouchable on tarmac it was.
That shorter overhang was a key part when the Sierra and Sapphire Cosworths was made shorter from 102.7" whelbase to 100.5 for the Escort Cosworth.
Barely 2.2" wheelbase but well shorter in front and WAAAAAAAAAY shorter in the rear overhang, more than 5 inches shorter in the rear.
The French have been the Champions of maximum internal space for a given model segment for decades by putting the wheels right at the corners and have nearly NO overhang, and it seems to work especially well on tarmac.
The stability coming from longer wheelbase isn't a big deal on WRC or GpA cars because they have fully adjustable suspension links and can set up the car with LOTS, 4+ degrees of castor and even a short wheelbase car can be made stable with enough castor and some toe in.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel
OK yeah. One of my rallycars is a Ford Sierra 4x4 at 102.7" wb and SEVERAL boys with their Fucci have been over to talk suspension or prep and I point out how large their cars are and how having a large car means weight, and they simply cannot believe their cars are longer wheelbase than the Sierra.
Even measuring it for them has left some say "Noooo way, dude, that's not right"
The tape measure never lies. Unless you're measuring your willy :pQuote:
Originally Posted by janvanvurpa
306 MaxiQuote:
Originally Posted by janvanvurpa
206 WRC
205 T16
All cars with very little overhang and all bloody fast on tarmac
All pretty much unbeatable on a rally like Corsica. I think the active diffs on the 206 also helped counter any twitchiness it's SWB gave it. I wonder how well a car like the 206 would have done with a full mechanical setup? I also wonder how the 207 handles on tarmac in comparison with another 100mm or in wheelbase over the 206.
Short overhangs also make a car look squat and aggressive. Important if at least for looking cool in my eyes regardless of the gains to be made :)
Going slightly off topic but I love the short overhang on the rear of the McLaren F1 road car :)
http://www.channel4.com/4car/media/1...mclaren-f1.jpg
To me the long tail version they did just looks wrong. But it did the business at Le Mans
http://www.mclarenautomotive.com/ima...1-GT_Large.jpg
surprise surpise... it looks like the s14 has been delayed
http://translate.google.com/translat...2findex%2ehtml
I cant access the site you posted a link to but if the delay is a significant delay, i.e. longer than from Greece to Finland, with the new rules regarding S2000+ you have to start asking is there any point in bringing this car out? It has 2009 season before having to be joined in 2010 with the new cars whilst the old WRC cars are penalised and then obsolete in 2011.
By the way Motorsport News in UK today carries a story that Abarth will be joining WRC with a new car complying to teh new rules S2000+
They were refering to this
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/67407
Yes, I think there is, not least because there would be no point in marketing terms in rallying the old-shape car for so long.Quote:
Originally Posted by MJW
DR seams to be optimistic...
http://www.wrc.com/jsp/index.jsp?lnk...%20in%20Greece
big changes? i dont see what will be different, other than the shape and colour of the car. the suspension they complain about is still the same.Quote:
Originally Posted by Glee
Why is that still true with the new model? :confused:Quote:
Originally Posted by Buzz Lightyear
Well in the Italy preview they asked Richard about the damper, but he say there is nothing wrong with it, just need to set up properly with the car, but we will see soon enough.
On SWRT website they say they are still working hard with BOS to find the best solution, in other words BOS needs to come up with something better.
By the way I think the car looks great, definitely the prettiest of the current WRCs. Now only hoping that it will deliver.
Enough of the fancy talk.
Time to see how this beauty rips!
Read my sig people. Pray along with me.
richards believes they've isolated (only last week) the damper problem.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nenukknak
he reckons it's the fluid reconstituting itself at a molecular level, which explains why they've had a hard time pinning it down.
at least, that's what he told me on the weekend.
would explain why the subaru usually puts in a good friday performance then goes to bits, as the damper fluid breaks down. surely damper fluid has been fairly well sorted over the years?
Interesting how the damper problem being resolved co-incides with the launch of the new car.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mickey T
Blame diversion to get Mr Subaru off his back?... or a genuine technical screw-up of biblical proportions on BOS's side?
If thats true it doesnt say a lot about BOS's quality control... a problem at molecular level?.. thats very difficult to believe unless they were being supplied by a Ford or Citroen owned brake fluid company. ;)
Cynical, who me? :D
That's all well and good, but what does Atko really think of the new car? Come on Mike, spill it.
It's not a dismal failure until now, but not great great neither :mark:
For the moment S14 has not shown any sign of being faster than the old Impreza. You can watch from last year where Petter and Chris after first day.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom206wrc
sort of where I expected. petter gets slight too emotional about things. he is just after saying on WRR preview interview, that is was maybe possible he could win with Acropolis, or at least setting fastest times. OK, give it time, but I expected it to be at least slightly quicker that the old car out of the box.
What I have seen recently good cars are very fast out of the box. For instance C4, Focus. Also previous Impreza won its first race.Quote:
Originally Posted by Buzz Lightyear
Out of box? C4 was developed over a year before first event...would not call that out of box performance.Quote:
Originally Posted by Finni
then keep it in the box till its ready. no?Quote:
Originally Posted by DonJippo
What's the least amount of R&D that still counts as out of the box? Six months? Four weeks? A minute? :eek:Quote:
Originally Posted by DonJippo
I can only hope that Subaru have something in store for the 10 week break to Finland. On pace alone they are 'moderate' and Atko's car failed to even start day 2.
Cant remember Focus 06 got a lot of points from its first rally.Quote:
Originally Posted by Finni
They need to use wires that audiophiles use, maybe it won't burn out.Quote:
Originally Posted by Malllen
Quote:
Originally Posted by Malllen
Does pace on the Acropolis mean so much? I dont feel its a true reflection on the cars speed capabilities... more to do with daring how hard to push the tyres?
Finland will tell us the truth...
I think the speed has been there on and off, like acropolis last year, the only concern is to get the car to not broke down. Haven't quite achieved that yet.
But it was bloody fast in the hands of mediocre drivers..Quote:
Originally Posted by Viking
This rall is certainly not the best test of speed but still the impreza has shown at least the speed of the old car on its very first rally with much developement to come. Plus Petter hasn't been this positive in years which is a good sign.