What next for the three pointed LOSERS?

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Originally Posted by denkimi

I'm glad lewis is not as sour a loser as his fanboys here.

It's over, so you better try to get over it too.

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Well, it is not over. It is with us for every season into the future. This would happen again, l assure you. The precedent for it to happen has just been laid down by Masi. It is now within the power of the Race Director to determine who wins and loses.

As far as Hamilton goes. I personally do not think he lost. In my eyes, he is not a loser. However, l think the Petronas-Mercedes team lost the driver's title of 2021 because they set up the scenario for this to happen by failing to change tyres at two opportunities to do so. A decision that left Hamilton vulnerable when the decision of Race Control altered the format of the racing.

While the aim is not to remove the championship title from Verstappen, he has deserved it. Petronas-Mercedes owe it to their champion, who has mostly secured them their 2021 constructor's title, to put up a robust challenge of the situation. Consequently, the loss of the driver title fails squarely on Mercedes. They are the losers here.

Besides, if you look at my posts going back seven years, you would find that l am an avid advocate for fairness in all manner of life and racing. If this was happening to Verstappen, l would be just as robust in my views. I wish l could say that for some.

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Originally Posted by Nitrodaze

However, l think the Petronas-Mercedes team lost the driver's title of 2021 because they set up the scenario for this to happen by failing to change tyres at two opportunities to do so. A decision that left Hamilton vulnerable when the decision of Race Control altered the format of the racing.

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I'm sorry, I realise you're quite badly hurt by this, and nothing I say is going to change your mind, but that's not a healthy way to look at it.

If they had brought Hamilton in for tyres, the work of a Red Bull-favouring race director would have been simple - just leave the SC out 'til the chequered flag.

Based on their (correct) interpretation of the rules, on precedent, and on simple common sense, Mercedes made the right call in leaving Hamilton out.

You can query their decision not to appeal (although I would bet that they're getting something in return for not pushing ahead), but their race strategy on this occasion was pretty much faultless.

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Originally Posted by ouvreur

I'm sorry, I realise you're quite badly hurt by this, and nothing I say is going to change your mind, but that's not a healthy way to look at it.

If they had brought Hamilton in for tyres, the work of a Red Bull-favouring race director would have been simple - just leave the SC out 'til the chequered flag.

Based on their (correct) interpretation of the rules, on precedent, and on simple common sense, Mercedes made the right call in leaving Hamilton out.

You can query their decision not to appeal (although I would bet that they're getting something in return for not pushing ahead), but their race strategy on this occasion was pretty much faultless.

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Ok l am not communicating my views properly. The tyre decision is immaterial at this point. It is taking responsibility to do what is respectable. Caving in and letting the possibility of this repeating itself in the future is not respectable. The FIA analysis and clarification is a PR exercise to quell this and brush it under the carpet.

My deep pain here is whether we would ever see another fair championship title outcome without the backroom fiddling to manipulate who becomes world champion. If you don't get the magnitude of what has happened, then l cannot explain it any further.

It is not about Hamilton or Verstappen. It is about the soul of the Formula. The very essence of what the championship means. What this Masi stunt has come to mean, is that F1 is a circus. Like those coin machines designed to steal your money, the championship title is now at the discretion of the Race Director where the situation presents itself.

I think the fact the FIA are openly discussing Hamiltons failure to show at the gala, and the consequences of him not following the rules shows how stupid and shortsighted Mercs decision was to drop the appeal.
Add in the Ecclestones comments about no one should beat Schumachers record and then the promotion to vice president for Mrs Ecclestone, well I think what's next is the acceptance that there are going to be one or two disillusioned fans over the coming years.

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Originally Posted by TMorel

I think the fact the FIA are openly discussing Hamiltons failure to show at the gala, and the consequences of him not following the rules shows how stupid and shortsighted Mercs decision was to drop the appeal.
Add in the Ecclestones comments about no one should beat Schumachers record and then the promotion to vice president for Mrs Ecclestone, well I think what's next is the acceptance that there are going to be one or two disillusioned fans over the coming years.

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Why should he abide by the farce by attending the farcical ceremony? F1 and the FIA have a serious image problem. It is probably great Todd is going. About time someone with integrity took over.

"New FIA president Mohammed ben Sulayem has refused to rule out punishing Lewis Hamilton for boycotting its awards ceremony on Thursday.

Hamilton and Mercedes team principal Toto Wolff did not attend in protest at the handling of the Abu Dhabi Grand Prix last Sunday.

Formula 1 rules dictate that the top three drivers in the championship must attend.

"If there is any breach, there is no forgiveness in this," Ben Sulayem said."


We royally fecked up your championship but you didn't come to the party.. and so you must be punished.

What are they smoking?

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Originally Posted by Nitrodaze

It is now within the power of the Race Director to determine who wins and loses.

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The problem is the FIA has not been consistent with their rules all year. So they have had undue influence on the results.

Rules should be applied the same on the first lap as well as the last lap. They have not been whether during this race or during the season. You always rationalized it as Alonso whining, or RBR whining, etc. Now you getting mad about because in your perception Mercedes got the bad side of things.

Again you are mad that Masi didn't unlap all the cars because you were hoping that race would have not started again - because you knew Hamilton hand been hung out to dry by Mercedes since they did not cover up the possibility of late safety car when they had to chance to pit under the VSC.

Root cause why Hamilton lost was because of bad strategy by Mercedes pit wall and bad luck with Latifi crashing out. If Mercedes pits under the VSC they win the race. If Latifi doesn't crash out, Mercedes wins.

Blaming it on Masi and the FIA - well it's been that way all year, so you are not going to get any sympathy, but pushback.

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Originally Posted by F1nKS

The problem is the FIA has not been consistent with their rules all year. So they have had undue influence on the results.

Rules should be applied the same on the first lap as well as the last lap. They have not been whether during this race or during the season. You always rationalized it as Alonso whining, or RBR whining, etc. Now you getting mad about because in your perception Mercedes got the bad side of things.

Again you are mad that Masi didn't unlap all the cars because you were hoping that race would have not started again - because you knew Hamilton hand been hung out to dry by Mercedes since they did not cover up the possibility of late safety car when they had to chance to pit under the VSC.

Root cause why Hamilton lost was because of bad strategy by Mercedes pit wall and bad luck with Latifi crashing out. If Mercedes pits under the VSC they win the race. If Latifi doesn't crash out, Mercedes wins.

Blaming it on Masi and the FIA - well it's been that way all year, so you are not going to get any sympathy, but pushback.

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I don't understand your point. It's been bad all year so do nothing about it. What are you saying?

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Originally Posted by Zico

"New FIA president Mohammed ben Sulayem has refused to rule out punishing Lewis Hamilton for boycotting its awards ceremony on Thursday.

Hamilton and Mercedes team principal Toto Wolff did not attend in protest at the handling of the Abu Dhabi Grand Prix last Sunday.

Formula 1 rules dictate that the top three drivers in the championship must attend.

"If there is any breach, there is no forgiveness in this," Ben Sulayem said."


We royally fecked up your championship but you didn't come to the party.. and so you must be punished.

What are they smoking?

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If this is what we would expect from him, FIA is in deep horse crap. BTW he has reasonable credentials but no international sporting experience. Unlike Todd who he is replacing, he is a paperweight compared. That said, a great accolade does not translate to a great presidency. So Mohammed ben Sulayem may well turn out to be a breath of fresh air. The Abu Dhabi crisis is the litmus test. How well he handles it would tell us what we have in store over the next four seasons.

Jean Todd's presidency was punctuated by two major crises; the Ferrari Smokey Engine which got resolved behind closed doors. and the Abu Dhabi farce which he duly ignored and passes on to his replacement. The last three years of his presidency saw the officiating of races become erratic in how the rules were interpreted. And driving standard deteriorated to the point of potential mortal danger. Can it get any worst?

It sucks that it ended that way .

I was , as was everybody , impressed that Lewis shook Max's hand as it showed him as a sporting gentleman in the face of such a stupid ending to the championship .
I was again impressed when he was reported to have been on the side of dropping the appeal despite having endured that stupid ending .

But , sadly , upon hearing that both he and Toto snubbed the affair , I see it as petty , and I question how sincere any congratulations were .

Even more sadly , rather than be a sullen affair for Lewis to have attended , I think , with his originally very magnanimous gestures of congratulations , he might have been up for many accolades and likely ovations at the party .
I think it likely both he and Max would have been lauded almost equally .

It would have been a true display of the "stiff upper lip", worthy of a knight , to have shown up to see his rival take the trophy .
I think he may have had a whack of pats on the back just for that reason alone , let alone all the great driving that had brought him there .

And so , we have a second ending that sucks .