Being smart and pushing where one can, instead of pushing all the time and crashing/breaking the car (sometimes not) is called luck now. Ok...stupidest argument ever.
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Being smart and pushing where one can, instead of pushing all the time and crashing/breaking the car (sometimes not) is called luck now. Ok...stupidest argument ever.
Yes, he is very good at judging when to push and when to hold back a little, and helps make his own luck in that way. Probably also helped that the Fiesta seems the strongest car this year when it comes to suspension and impacts etc, like the VW was in its time.Quote:
Originally Posted by AL14
But for anyone to claim it was skill to escape without major damage when (for one example) spinning out of control between trees after hitting a bank is clearly nonsense - in those moments it really is just luck.
You can't disagree Neuville was unlucky this year.
In Monte Carlo he went maybe 10cm wide, something that happens a lot. Only on that spot he had no room...
In Sweden he wasn't concentrated enough on the SSS. Stupid mistake, only a minor one, but stupid.
In Germany he did nothing wrong imo. Just the Hyundai being fragile (same with Sordo and Mikkelsen in Catalunya)
Catalunya was his fault.
These mistakes have costed him a lot, to finish less then a rally behind (in points), it's fair to say he could have been the champion.
But Ogier got more points, so he is the deserved champion
Neuville had a pretty hard hit against a bank early on Rally GB and no damage.Quote:
Originally Posted by SubaruNorway
Luck evens itself out over time and Ogier cant have beeen lucky for 5 years...
winners are always more lucky then 'losers' ;)
of course he can... the same sewer dogs believe that Loeb was lucky for 9.. so 5 is something normal for them.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fast Eddie WRC
But you skip that he got away with about 50 other offroad excursions.Quote:
Originally Posted by dupanton
Did he run normal group N4 car? Or that evo9 was heavily modified?Quote:
Originally Posted by Munkvy
And this wasn’t all :DQuote:
Originally Posted by EstWRC
Tanak farewelled from M-Sport with 'wet balls' prank:
https://t.co/S7HPnZ3Kgf
Did he? I'm sure there were a few, but I think Ogier had bigger offroad excursions without consequences...Quote:
Originally Posted by A FONDO
That's friggin brilliant. Obviously they took the signal for road mode and 3rd gear and sent them to the unit for spraying water on the windscreen but rerouted the pipe.Quote:
Originally Posted by EstWRC
That must have been a shock for him hahahahahaha :D
God I laughed when I read that.
did he said that?
Michel V.*
@rockollector
Ott Tanak after gala interview : "It would be nice to beat Ogier before he retires". Has he said too much? :-)
yes but look what he says before it, didnt reveal anything IMO, in the end of the video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lA9FvNMkWg4&t=0s
Yes, but he failed to bring that he said "It would be nice if he continued"Quote:
Originally Posted by dimviii
lets hope he doesn't get disqualified for using not homologated parts. :pQuote:
Originally Posted by EstWRC
What a great season we had, bringing the best of my memories from the glory days of rallying.
I, as many, was hoping for yet another different winner in 2017 in Rally Australia, but it wasn’t to be, nevertheless, I enjoyed the rally. Having said that, cancelling the penultimate stage was a massive let down for me, a real anti-climax, I am sure we were denied a nail biting finish due to the tricky conditions. I struggle to believe that the safety (as in access for safety personnel and vehicles) would have been compromised as stated in this forum and that the conditions would have presented any greater challenge to the organisers than the ones at the night fog during Rally GB. I suppose good persuasion powers on the side of Mr. Nandan.
And to reiterate what others have said regarding the conditions, this is rallying, not circuit racing:
http://www.italiaspeed.com/2011/moto..._stratos_2.jpg
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CB5fTXhXIAAH7oZ.jpg
What?
1. You seriously think Latvala had a chance to catch 15s over 16km on two stages after it stopped raining and the conditions got more equal and less risky? The 9s he got in the morning were over 30km stage with no splits in the worst conditions when Neuville took it easy. Immediatelly in next stage in just about same conditions Neuville took 5 back.
2. What do you think is more likely
a) organizers decided to cancel as they had info on how the access road look
b) Nandan convinced them to cancel and find out an excuse
Occam's razor or tinfoil hat?
Sure it might have been unnecessary/bad decision, but given the differences between drivers and the stopped rain + drying road it would have had little to no effect to run the stage.
I disagree. The conditions were extremely difficult, and as we saw with Mikkelsen anything can happen when a stage is super treacherous. It would have gone down to a battle between who could manage difficult conditions the best.Quote:
Originally Posted by mknight
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Exactly - if the conditions were what we were told they were, then anything could have happened. And if they were not, then why was the stage cancelled.Quote:
Originally Posted by steve.mandzij
Explanation was that the stage got cancelled due to damaged access roads? In my head that means damage to roads that emergency services have to travel in case something happens.
We have seen on the Power Stage how dry and clean it was compared to the morning so I have no reason to believe the stage before was much different.
-----
As a side note what has Mikkelsen? to do with super treacherous conditions, he got 2 punctures on a dry stage. Those that got caught out in treacherous conditions were Lefevbre and Breen. Starting to think you were watching different rally.
The entire rally took place during changeable conditions and Mikkelsen was undoubtedly caught out by them. It was a known fact that the stages were difficult and not entirely dry during Saturday and Sunday. Mikkelsen made his own mistake but the road wasn't completely dry and grippy.Quote:
Originally Posted by mknight
It is correct that the access roads' condition was the reason for the cancellation, though. That's just a shame.
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Lappi and Evans nearly went off on the Power Stage when it was really wet with standing water. And Latvala did go off through pushing too hard for the conditions.
That's rallying - you have to drive to the conditions. None are too dangerous, its up to the driver to go at the right speed to get through them.
Out of all the offs/incidents in this rally (Meeke 3x, Ogier 2x, Mikkelsen, Lefevbre, Breen, Latvala, Neuville, Lappi, Evans), Mikkelsens' and Meekes' had least to do with conditions. So very strange pick. Guess it was the easiest pick for you for some reason.Quote:
Originally Posted by steve.mandzij
I feel you're trying to paint a picture in which I called out Mikkelsen for something. I'm not. He overcooked a corner, likely thinking he had enough grip in the mud, hit a bank and had to retire. Meeke's accident, on the other hand, was nearly unrelated to the conditions as you said.Quote:
Originally Posted by mknight
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Does anyone know when the crews are heading back to Europe?
I was trying really hard to find any mud on the onboard but failed. Either you have much better eyes, or you just remember it wrong.Quote:
Originally Posted by steve.mandzij
The onboard is on WRC+, in case you don't have it then on the open channel you just have views from before/after (with 2 punctures) during the same stage: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g9SnXa1a-0w
Looks totally dry with dust and everything. Driver comments suggest the same:
https://www.ewrc-results.com/results...2017/?s=153101
So yes I do feel you are calling Mikkelsen out for mistake in wet/tricky conditions when it was a mistake on completely dry stage.
Not going to join the conversation, but this is Mikkelsen's corner in the "Mud"Quote:
Originally Posted by steve.mandzij
It's just because they can go as low as 1.5 Bar starting the stage so it's easy to knock the air out that early in the stage when the tyres are low on pressure.
Oops, I suck at remembering things. Well done then.Quote:
Originally Posted by mknight
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Maybe they should consider this fo access:Quote:
Originally Posted by mknight
https://i.ytimg.com/vi/CfiqbpvOGbE/maxresdefault.jpg
I can confirm that rain on cancelled stage started earlier and ended approximately one hour later than in Powerstage and it would have been very-very wet and slippy while running (it was planned to run more than hour before PS). Lefebre-s corner was so slippy that it was almost impossible to walk on it and one of the watersplash got dagerously deep. Sometimes you need to take unpopular decisions. So, I think it was a good idea to cancel, too many obstacles for drivers and possible emergency car along the stage and on the access roads.
Thanks bluuford.Quote:
Originally Posted by bluuford
Not N4 no. They are apparently allowed a 36mm restrictor on regular pump gas or 34mm on any fuel, and I believe from people I spoke to on the rally he was on the former. They do have to run a factory turbo however, which would be a somewhat limiting factor.Quote:
Originally Posted by KKS
Sounds like you were either on the same corner as me or you know the Estonian guys I was standing there with!Quote:
Originally Posted by bluuford
I have "eyes" in many places ;) But these were not Estonians.Quote:
Originally Posted by Munkvy
Than you think in every time when Ogier spins he control a car and see all tree's around him at 360deg? I don't believe in it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mintexmemory
Last Ogier spun so far at SS12 he was lucky not be bounced into a trees, and even before that he has 2 very hot moments.
Thanks.Quote:
Originally Posted by Munkvy
And why all other Australia Champ field not entry in WRC event, but only few of it?Quote:
Originally Posted by Munkvy
Aus champ have different route or what? So how Quinn was in two champs at same moment?
Personally I have trouble connecting Ogier's success to luck. Luck is something that occurs randomly and when you count the incidents he's had and gotten the better of it compared to the other way round, he must be doing something better than the other drivers. It could be a very small detail in his driving style... setup... - or whatever, it's significant for just Ogier.
When it happens once it's random every while, when it happens on a constant basis it's a habit.
Monte-Carlo - he could not get out of that ditch for a long time (or maybe damage supension/tyres on that road sign)Quote:
Originally Posted by KKS
Sweden - he cut too much and pretty much have luck that there wasn't a rock.
Mexico - Kris Meeke have luck in there you all know why (and if he haven't, guess who would win the event), Ogier have engine problems, spun, stall engine
Tour De Corse - lost hydraulic pressure, struggle with many setups, electrical problems
Argentina - into the ditch without damage, hit big rock (bent steering), dog on the road, almost spun on the watersplash
Sardegna - Puncture
Poland - damaged car, 2 punctures, spun and hit a step, onto the field (Ott's misfortune = Ogier on the podium)
Finland - Okay here he was unluckiest and Paddon too.
Germany - Spin, another spin
Wales GB - Broken brakes (that night stage was in my opinion cause for his greatest luck in the year)
Australia - he made some mistakes and have problems with car but have no point if he was already world champion.
He was real competitive maybe on one or two events (with Neuville crashed he obviously not pushing anymore, I don't know if there would be more). He was criticize more or less everywhere not just day one when he cleaned the stages with how much he was on limit but speed was not there. He climbed on stats more of mistakes of others, than his personal achievements, but that's how it is. We can't do anything, he played smart, always thinking on championship and get most of it. What if's have now no point because it's over. Sure Neuville did many mistakes, few letdowns with car but it is how it is.
Real cowards I could say is Volkswagen. And I don't believe a word about diesel scandal involved in WRC quitting by them. Now they compete in GRC, Formula-E, F3, TCR, want to go to Pikes Peak, World RX, buliding Polo R5... That's a lot of money... And Audi and Skoda also involved in big games... No they run away because they knew it would be hard to continue of their dominance. Anyone agree with that.. No offense by fans of Ogier and Volkswagen but I just share my opinions here like everyone
I definitely do not agree with this. In fact, this is crazy talk.Quote:
Originally Posted by ESTR
On the whole topic of luck, it has been explained perfectly already by Seneca over two thousand years ago. "Luck is what happens when preparation meets opportunity." This is true in every discipline and in every facet of our lives. There is no such thing as luck and the only way you can have any affect on an unknown outcome is in how well you prepare.
Cant't oppose to Seneca. ;) And in rally I can add, what 10 times Lithuania rally champion once said - "those who searching troubles in stage, always will find some" - by cutting where they shouldn't, pushing where they shouldn't, etc. Some drive aggressive, others not so much.Quote:
Originally Posted by OHL
https://www.autosport.com/wrc/news/1...from-wrc-teams
"FIA rally director Jarmo Mahonen was rather more blunt in his assessment of Coffs Harbour, saying: "The good thing about this event is that it's very safe - because there are no spectators!"
A couple of numbnuts ruined that impression this year though!