Rally Sweden 2012

Finished watching 1 hour rally summary.

Close moments for Latvala, Hirvonen and a huge sideways slide by Solberg all from first two days that I didn't see before. Sordo, Tanak and Loeb going off all on same corner on day one (also new footage to me).

The puncture place today looked a bit weird. From Solbergs camera (on the left side of the car) it looked like the stone was just in the shadow between 2 sunny places, from Latvala's camera (on right side of the car) it didn't look so dark there. Anyway it was quite a strange place for a dangerous stone to be imo, on a relatively straight part (so can't see how it got dug out) and without any rocky hillsides (so it couldn't fall down).

Disclaimer: This is again not to start a conspiracy theory, just wouldn't expect it there.

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Originally Posted by DonJippo

Actually if I am reading this document correctly, http://argent.fia.com/web/fia-public...Appendices.pdf page 47 section 62.1 it says you can't have 6 new tyres with you as it is allowed to take only 5 new ones per change, except Acropolis where you can take 6 new ones. So that in mind did Mikkelsen have such a big performance gap compared to Ogier related to amount of tires?

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Thats not a problem,becayse some of your previous semi worn tyres, are not destroyed.So you can have 2 spares,one completely new and a used one.

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Originally Posted by ridder

The puncture place today looked a bit weird. From Solbergs camera (on the left side of the car) it looked like the stone was just in the shadow between 2 sunny places, from Latvala's camera (on right side of the car) it didn't look so dark there. Anyway it was quite a strange place for a dangerous stone to be imo, on a relatively straight part (so can't see how it got dug out) and without any rocky hillsides (so it couldn't fall down).

Disclaimer: This is again not to start a conspiracy theory, just wouldn't expect it there.

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it was dug out from the ground from the cars infront...

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Originally Posted by Viking

http://www.rallysweden.com/wp-conten...-doc.-2..6.pdf

Seems like PG and McRae has to add 2minutes to their times....

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So 2 mins for 72 and 82 grams of difference on handmade parts, which Proton blames on inaccurate scales used during homologation.


Tbh I don't really like the penalty, actually think it's too low and smells politics = FIA trying to be nice to Proton to keep the manufacturer interested.
Had this happened to a privateer he would be disqualified instantly. Many examples of that before.... Prokop in Argentina with worse brakes, Bryndilsen in UK, Solberg in France etc etc.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DonJippo

Actually if I am reading this document correctly, http://argent.fia.com/web/fia-public...Appendices.pdf page 47 section 62.1 it says you can't have 6 new tyres with you as it is allowed to take only 5 new ones per change, except Acropolis where you can take 6 new ones. So that in mind did Mikkelsen have such a big performance gap compared to Ogier related to amount of tires?

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Since you have trouble understanding that this gives an advantage. Even though it maybe was not decisive in this case.
How many fewer tires do you need befor it matter. 30% -50%.

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Originally Posted by ridder

So 2 mins for 72 and 82 grams of difference on handmade parts, which Proton blames on inaccurate scales used during homologation.


Tbh I don't really like the penalty, actually think it's too low and smells politics = FIA trying to be nice to Proton to keep the manufacturer interested.
Had this happened to a privateer he would be disqualified instantly. Many examples of that before.... Prokop in Argentina with worse brakes, Bryndilsen in UK, Solberg in France etc etc.

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i am not in favor of Proton,but some times when some parts are under the car,can lost weight from rocks chipping the metal.As you saw they weighted new parts and they were ok.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ridder

So 2 mins for 72 and 82 grams of difference on handmade parts, which Proton blames on inaccurate scales used during homologation.


Tbh I don't really like the penalty, actually think it's too low and smells politics = FIA trying to be nice to Proton to keep the manufacturer interested.
Had this happened to a privateer he would be disqualified instantly. Many examples of that before.... Prokop in Argentina with worse brakes, Bryndilsen in UK, Solberg in France etc etc.

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It for sure don't mean much for them, PG still SWRC winner but drop behind Neuville and Mikkelsen in the overall standings...

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Originally Posted by dimviii

i am not in favor of Proton,but some times when some parts are under the car,can lost weight from rocks chipping the metal.As you saw they weighted new parts and they were ok.

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That's why the parts have tolerances, the new ones are on the low edge of the tolerance.

Anyway my point wasn't what is fair/unfair relative to the advantage gained. My point was that when it comes to privateers they get kicked out for anything, when it comes to teams the punishment is always milder in last few years. Last time some team got kicked was with Peugeots 206. Then Ford got just a time penalty for windows and Citroen even smaller time penalty for stabilizers.

Prokop in Argentina 2009 got disqualified for using year old 30 mm brake discs (allowed size was 28-30 mm in 2008), when newly from that year Evos were allowed to use only bigger 32 mm ones (to improve braking). So disqualified for using worse parts...

Bryndilsen in GB got disqualified for using smaller brake calipers.

you are right ridder.

just to mention that weight tolerances are given because of manufacture differencies is possible to have any spare part,casting or hand made.Of course Proton had to be inside these tolerances.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ridder

That's why the parts have tolerances, the new ones are on the low edge of the tolerance.

Anyway my point wasn't what is fair/unfair relative to the advantage gained. My point was that when it comes to privateers they get kicked out for anything, when it comes to teams the punishment is always milder in last few years. Last time some team got kicked was with Peugeots 206. Then Ford got just a time penalty for windows and Citroen even smaller time penalty for stabilizers.

Prokop in Argentina 2009 got disqualified for using year old 30 mm brake discs (allowed size was 28-30 mm in 2008), when newly from that year Evos were allowed to use only bigger 32 mm ones (to improve braking). So disqualified for using worse parts...

Bryndilsen in GB got disqualified for using smaller brake calipers.

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Best one.. Hanninen, excluded from the rally for not wearing the correct fireproof underwear :)