I'm no bandwagon rider so yes, he has one here!
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I'm no bandwagon rider so yes, he has one here!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Lopez
Last year was also shortened by 100+ kms....
It used to be the case where anybody entered in the event would score points, so long as they finished high enough in the results.Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel
Must admit I’ve thought that – is the S2000 route is the panacea we’ve all been waiting for? How do we know more Manufacturers will join? Just because they currently have S2000 cars doesn’t mean they’ll want to go the whole hog and join in. Could you blame for not joining? What are they going to get out of it? The whole WRC needs a kick up the backside from top to bottom; events, format, etc The shame is there wasn’t a lot wrong with it up until about 2002 – since then a gradual decline.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodeye
Incredible how are finnish fans when finnish drivers "fail" :s
dont generalise, i think most understand the charactare of motorsport and new events comes soon.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom206wrc
When you're Peugeot's and the French guys fail, you are even more angry...Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom206wrc
Watching the review saw Loeb were angry with the decision with no cutting the tires, but I am more astound to found out they are actually running on the hard tires in the mud. Don't know how much that may have contribute to Latvala's off. But certainly I wasn't too optimistic with this control tires idea in some special conditions, such as high speed tarmac, could cause big accident in wrong tire in the wet. Hopefully the FIA will review this a bit more, or I'm just over reacting due to watching circuit racing seeing how important it is with the tires being right.
Furthermore when the news wrote 'Pirelli: We overcame a tough test in Mexico'. Ummm, no it didn't seem so for me.
Wise words!Quote:
Originally Posted by bowler
If he (LOEB) want to have the perfectly tyre he must race on circuit were he belonged! Everyone wants see action and no high speed train!
Why he is angry if he does not in front of all the others? Ooo-yes that makes him this way popular!!!
I agree with Ford this time. Same tyre for everyone!
Quote:
Originally Posted by tmx
Congratulations to Seb Loeb for winning. I think Petter Solberg is long overdue a run of good luck after the electrical failure in his Scooby.
Think you’re being a bit harsh. I’m all for exciting action, but surely it was a safety issue he was complaining about. Just having the one tyre for any condition seems crazy to me. I understand Ford’s decision but maybe between now and the next Rally common sense can prevail – and maybe cuts are allowed.Quote:
Originally Posted by Brother John
they need to make sure P. Solberg is on suicide watch!
Petter.....when will the guy have some luck??? :s
As for Loeb about the tyres...if it is dangerous to drive faster with them, then slow down.... I thought that was part of the point of it. He is good enough to destroy anyone else anyway so shouldn't affect his results at all.
He already did have, because of others retirements he did drive as second for some time already.Quote:
Originally Posted by J4MIE
It's strange this Loeb and tyres, i dont remember him complainig before, now he started already 1 week before the event.
My understanding is that the tyres were dangerous even at low speed as they could not evacuate the mud.Quote:
Originally Posted by J4MIE
If it's okay to make all drivers drive on inadapted tyre, why not do the same with other safety device: let's remove the roll cage, if drivers are worry about their safety, they can slow down.
Subaru and Citroen drivers are in agreement for cut, and apprently Ford's are "not allowed to comment".
I don't know if anyone watched the wrc.com video of Petter retiring - that 'oh no' physically rips your heart in two - as people have said, when will he get some luck?
And on swrt.com, for the first time I have ever seen Petter hasn't commented at all about the rally. He seems really angry, the swearing is understandable, but this is as low as he was at Finland last year.
I will be surprised if Petter is still in the WRC next year if he deosn't win this year - and rightly so unless Subaru equip him with a car that can actually win which he deserves.
Petter was very good in Argentina, and yet he was still over a minute and a half off the lead. Whatever you guys think, I know Petter is not 1.5 mins worse than Loeb, it is mainly his car. And then like in Mexico, the car gives up. Its a joke.
Petter now needs to take each rally as it comes, as due to Subaru he now has no chance to have a go at the Drivers Championship this year. He needs to get his confidence up for next year, with the new car, on his best events (see 2009 WRC calendar), for his last pop at the drivers title.
And finally, is Jordan a loose gravel event or a packed gravel event? I ask because if it is a loose gravel event, Petter has a great chance there to win with a great road position. If its a packed gravel event, I'll be surprised if he gets any points.
This is a real low for Petter Fans.
It is hard packed (with salt) drivable roads in Jordan, in other words very good roads for rally.Quote:
Originally Posted by pettersolberg29
Thats what he said.... cuts for everyone!Quote:
Originally Posted by Brother John
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tomi
Does the road get cut up easily for later drivers, say 7th on the road, do you know?
Should I hold any hope for Petter (if the Subaru works), or has he got no chance?
Thats why they have been driving salt, to keep the road in good condition, but offcourse it will cut up some.Quote:
Originally Posted by pettersolberg29
But it should be quite equal conditions, and benefit guys who can drive.
That sounds just like this year though?Quote:
Originally Posted by sollitt
I agree with Daniel that S2000 alone will not 'cure' the WRC, but I think it will certainly help a few of the problems.
The main attraction of S2000 so far for a manufacturer is thay they do not have to compete in a full WRC campaign in order to homolgate one. In fact they could even be profitable for a manufacturer as they are mostly sold to private customers who then go and promote their marque in national championships, ERC or IRC at little or no cost to the manufacturer.
So in other words WRC is still going to have to offer better value for the manufacturers, drivers and sponsors to come back.
I agree with you in general, but in this particular case I think Loeb exaggerated the safety issue. After all even Routenbach managed to finish.Quote:
Originally Posted by xavier
The time differences aside, I think saddest thing about this rally is what superrally did for the results. I think Mikko didn't deserve the points (for example). I know superrally is good for the spectators and Tv as more cars are on the road each day, but maybe it could only be for Manu points??
And about Loeb and the tyres.... It is allways easy to complain and make it a safety issue as then any argument against you can be deemed as wanting unsafe rallies. But like J4mie said, there is allways the option of driving more slowly. Mikko said on some report that not cutting tyres seems to affect Citroen's grip on gravel more than Ford's, so that should put Loeb's 2safety" concerns into perspective.
S2000 wont make loeb less dominant.
At the end of the day Sebastien finished the rally in 1st position so I'd be very wary of someone saying the 1st place car was affected more than others :laugh: Perhaps that puts it more into perspective :) I would expect such chat from Petter a few years ago but not from Mikko.....Quote:
Originally Posted by COD
Driving slowly. There's an idea. Why don't we ban studs on tyres in the monte and in sweden then? Somehow I suspect this wouldn't be a popular move. I'd be pissed off if I went to a rally and saw cars pootling around at road car speeds on a WRC event. That's not cool. Here's an idea! Why don't we keep the spectacle? If the cars can go faster more safely with cuts on muddy roads then give us cuts.
I've said it time and time again I don't feel that Pirelli can make tyres that work in a variety of conditions and I'll keep on saying it till their contract expires and Michelin gets the contract and does a better job of it.....
As of super rally, yes it's ridiculous that Mikko got more point than Petter... Super rally is a stupid idea (i know i am preaching to the choir) but not allowing super rally in day 3 makes it the one of most idiotic rule ever.Quote:
Originally Posted by COD
As for the tyres, yes it put it in perspective. But he made the comment when he was 1:30 ahead agaisnt a Subaru, not a Ford. The C4 has been struggling for more grip on gravel since its start. So yes mybe it explain Ford reluctance to allow cut... but apparently out of the 3 full work teams 2 agree that cut should be authorized. I really cannot see why not authorizing cuts is a cost saving. What's next ? Dont authorize to change stock settings?
I think Suzuki is full work team also, do they agree tyre cutting or not?Quote:
Originally Posted by xavier
What I can’t believe people saying is drive slower – eh? This is the WRC not some amateur hour contest. If the tyres aren’t good enough – do something about them. I know costs have got to be made, but this is stupid. Personally, it just sums up the current WRC.Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel
As for Pirelli vs Michelin; I think we know why they won/lost the contract – nothing to do with Rallying – Indy 2005.
Have wrc still something to do with rally sport? :dozey:Quote:
Originally Posted by AndyRAC
I think Eurosport does exactly what the F.I.A. don´t want to do and is on correct direction for the future of rally. They take a look what the fans wont.
Just look at the good evolution from IRC and in the future of the new competition "IRC Classic"!
F.I.A. want to steal back the success from Eurosport´s IRC, with the new wrc rules of S2000 cars? Are they not able to come with themselves with a good idea? (instead of.........everyone know what must stand here) :rolleyes:
http://www.ircseries.com/html/readNews.asp?id=750
So true.Quote:
Originally Posted by AndyRAC
I'm just worried that the WRC will turn into another BTCC. Used to be great and now it's just amateur hour with some good drivers and a lot of others who would be nowhere if not for success ballast and reverse grid races.
Don’t give them ideas, ‘Success Ballast’ imagine that in the WRC? That’s my one problem with the WTCC – a World Championship shouldn’t have gimmicks like that. If a team/car/driver is better than the rest TOUGH!! Get on with it!!
I guess I am the only one that thinks the control tire is a good idea, even if the tire isn't the perfect tire for the conditions.
I understand that people want to see rally cars go as fast as possible but for me, and I may be in a severe minority here, part of the appeal is the difficulty and the battling of the conditions.
What I have been able to see of Mikko on the opening loop was inspiring. Part of the appeal is going fast in the impossible. There was a real battling the elements, man and machine versus mother nature sort of deal going on. You could tell Mikko was on the ragged edge and it was some of the most exciting if not spectacular driving I have seen in recent years in the WRC.
We all love seeing teams battle it out on the stages but I also love seeing teams battling the stages. The whole idea of you have to beat the course to win the event is all but gone from the WRC but we saw that return Friday morning and I loved it.
I am probably also the only one that liked the drivers not having the splits. Part of the challenge of rallying is pacing yourselves. Knowing how hard you have to push and how to keep the speed up and not just settle into a steady pace. When you have the splits you don't have to master that mental skill and that is a real shame.
I think control tyre is good idea too, it cut the rumours and give no space for favouritism, this time just the weather was crap, in dry conditions almost every team would have been happy.
BTW. if cutting tyres would have been allowed, who actually would have done the cutting? For me it's hard to belive that all the teams did have a specialist with them.
Loeb is speaking when he is finding no competition, so they are not excuses.
Tyre choosing, slection and lately cuting has always been part of rally.
I understand the benefits of a control tyre, but allowing cutting does not take away anyone of the benefits,and gives drivers and teams the possibility to use heir experience and take risks with theirtyre cutting decisions.
I am in favor of cutting, and in favour of Loeb speaking when he is in his curren position.
Regarding this last round, it istrue is was very boring, but in the "good old days" of rallying (70´s and 80´s) thought rallies usually fund this tpe of final results. It is no THAT bad. I do not like it, but this is also about rallying (fighting with rought conditions, bad weather, and taking care of the car)
Regards Loeb wanting the cuts, on face value I can agree with him, but over the past few years Citroen have had the greater number of weather spotters, meterologists (including MeteoFrance with forecasting trucks on some tarmac events) so I guess they had or potentially have the most to gain if the cutting of gravel tyres rule is relaxed. If Pirelli make the cuts and all users get the same cut maybe this is ok, and is a genuine safety concern. I did see video footage on Eurosport where Loeb's tyre was "clogged" and clearly was not efficient in cleaning the mud.
I agree, though despite my dislike of gimmicks I don't go along with Daniel's views on the BTCC as expressed above, but that's not a matter for here.Quote:
Originally Posted by AndyRAC
Let's face it, stupid tyre rules are not something the modern WRC has a monopoly on. I'm sure I recall some rather misguided tyre regulations in the WRC's past, too.
Exactly right, if cuts are to be allowed, it should be same cuts for all but Pirelli said they are not prepared to do that, so that's it then.Quote:
Originally Posted by MJW
And when I said drive slower, I meant of course that speed should allways match your equipment. Loeb should stop whining and do what he does best, win rallies
The 'whining' doesn't seem to be affecting his ability to win, though, does it?Quote:
Originally Posted by COD
Quote:
Originally Posted by COD
No, no. This is wrong.
Tyre choosing, or in this case at least cutting, should be part of rallying! It is its spirit.